New MEC Sales Video - Page 28 - Airline Pilot Central Forums

#271

DLax85 , 03-06-2018 07:16 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdbirdman

There you go. Blame those senior guys at the Union. Glad to hear you apparently know everything about this plan and it’s bad.

We don’t know everything - but many aspects have been revealed, and YES there are way’s it’s inferior to our current plan. Many!

#272

DLax85 , 03-06-2018 07:28 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mempurpleflyer

...That said, even based on the MEC's own information they have I was hired in my mid 40s and want to retire at 60. VB Plan gets me an extra 3% at best and I assume all of the risk. The floor is actually lower than the A Plan benefit. So...how is this an improvement to my retirement?...

Not exactly, the MEC has presented one specific example for you to theoretically increase your retirement based on numerous assumptions and one very specific data set of historical financial returns

- they assume a 2% “floor benefit” accrural rate
- they assume “No Cap Rate” on investment returns
- they assume (but haven’t fully disclosed) the historical investment returns that occurred over a specific 19 year period [1999-2017]
- they assume a specific upgrade timeline

The 3% increase could be better - and it could certainly be less!

Install an investment CAP
Encounter lower actual investment returns
Upgrade more slowly

Any of these will lead to a lower retirement benefit than presented by the MEC

In UNITY,

DLax

#273

DLax85 , 03-06-2018 07:59 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdbirdman

I’m one of those senior guys this group of pilots love to blame for everything. Since 2009 my expected retirement income of $130k is now worth $112,631(COLA calculator) Would love to get something better before I retire next year but not expecting it. If you have a few more years to retire this amount will be even lower. This fact I do know—every year your retirement income is being cut. I have no idea exactly how the new proposal by the Union will effect any of us because we still don’t have the facts yet but it seems you do and it’s us “senior guys” that are robbing you. Have you ever thought maybe it’s the Company robbing you? When you make statements like the above you do realize you are talking about real people that sit right next to you everyday. “We” are you in the future. Nobody is pulling up the ladder in fact I would say we are trying to inflate another lifeboat for our fellow pilots.

Mcbirdman - You posted this on Oct 18, 2015

You argued the B Plan offsets the negative effects of inflation

You voted for the TA in 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcbirdman

Final Post from a Silverback.

My perspective on this TA and upcoming vote may not be wanted or valued by many but here it is. I have been at this company for over 26 years after spending 2 years at Pan Am. I have seen the good and bad of a Union, of no Union, a company only Union and finally what we have today. Let me first get this straight to those who may doubt what we are or think that we are something different than those other unions- We are not different. The purpose of a union is to negotiate with a company to achieve the best contract possible. Notice I did not say the best contract envisioned. What we have today is a vote on whether this is the best contract possible given our present circumstances? I use the term "given our present circumstances" because if you are like me you went through many emotions as rumors and votes were tallied at the MEC level this past summer. I felt we had the best opportunity to achieve that contract I had envisioned. We were unified like never before with a terrible manning shortage and peak looming. I knew I was going to get that A plan bump and off I'd fly into the sunset of my career with the fix to my diminished A plan value. The Purple promise I was given when hired was to be fulfilled - "Fly with us for a full career and walk away with 1/2 of you highest earnings salary for life"

So what happened? The MEC determined that this was the best we could get considering all the present circumstances. I disagreed but now we are presented with a whole different scenario. That moment in time is done and now you and I must decide not whether this is the contract of our dreams but instead - Can we force the Company to re-engage us and negotiate in good faith? Unfortunately in my opinion I think that will be very difficult to achieve and the time spent achieving this goal will wash out any supposed gains. I have been wearing a lanyard that states "Contract Now" for years and now we want to tell the company "Okay maybe next year or later". Believe me the company will just love this new round of negotiations. Delay is their friend not ours.

The biggest obstacle to passage of this TA seems to be the diminishing value of our A plan. I can tell you I have had to reevaluate my thinking on this and I challenge everyone of you out their to do the same math. The contract of 98 and 2006 added a B plan to our entire retirement package. For those with less time to achieve the added value of the B plan the company added an increased multiplier to their A plan. Now with the TA of 2015 they did not-why? The answer is in the math. Your B plan is the inflation adjustment for the A plan. No matter how far away you are from retirement your B fund growing at a 4% rate of return will yield an annuity supplement for 20 years that combined with your capped A fund payout of 130k gives you 50% of an historical inflation adjusted final salary. That's right- I even adjusted into the future what my salary will be with this contract. If you are further from retirement than the length of this contract keep adjusting your salary based on historical inflation. I challenge some of you naysayers out their to do the math for the hypothetical new hire career. The results just might surprise you. Sorry I don't have the time nor the inclination to do it for that new hire for I am not voting on this TA for his/her benefit but for mine and all those currently on property now. Now in the interest of full disclosure here are my numbers.

A little over 3 years to my retirement date of Dec 2018. I will be age 61.5 and using 1,000 hours at $313.25/hr is $313,250. At a 4% return and $20,800/yr (8%) company contribution my ending B plan will be $402k. A 4% return on this money will yield an annual benefit of $29,136 for 20 years. 29k + 130k = 159k x 2 = $318k FAE
Using a 25 year payout = $311k FAE

Now for those of you who say the B fund is extra retirement income I can only say it has not been viewed as that on any of the past contracts. And for those out there who just want more I ask you to consider-Will Fedex show the rest of the 100k employees that we will strengthen the pilots A fund while we froze yours?

TOGA is a great slogan but it's not a strategy. I think I'm worth a million bucks a years but I am realistic in what I think I can demand. We are a union and make no mistake about what that means. We will have to demand and force this company to engage us again in negotiations. Are you ready to do that? Expectations don't make a contract. I am a proud YES voter-now flame away.

Mitch Davitte

#274

DLax85 , 03-06-2018 08:35 PM

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Your post from 9 Sep 2006

You seemed very satisfied at the time.

A long list of positives, and no mention of the lack of A Fund improvements in the negatives.

In retrospect, your “post title” is a bit ironic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcbirdman

Are You Guys Never satisfied?

I registered just today because I just had to reply to all this negative press on the TA. Get a grip guys. Here's a small run down on just the obvious things I see in this contract OVER what we have today!! If I am wrong on any item please feel free to point it out--I'm not an expert on this new TA yet.

9% pay raise-- Later pay raises through other changes(assumes 1000 CH/yr)
Bump in rec tng pay +.6% B Fund +1.0%
TAFB rig Change 3.75/1 +6.7% Int Overide +1.2%
Total raise after all "kicks" in about a year No Int Flying +8.3%
All Int Flying +9.4%
Add the 9% + 3%(after Year1) + 8.3% = 20.3%
+9.4 = 21.4%
OKAY before It gets pointed out I know hubturn in MEM will not see the rig change bump.

Priority MU now 125%

Better disruption pay kick-in

SMALL Per diem increase

Bid for recurrent tng slots

Min layover 10:15

ANCHOR ZONE for scdeduling Read it it's complicated but BETTER than today!!

Critical Duty period block-in by 1000 LBT for out-n-back

Blended duty requirement--GOOD

Op receive less 11hrs crew rest after critical duty then next rest is 12

Sick trips in open time available for p/u between 0700-1000 Can now see all open trips--no blackout

Medical certs $275/yr instead of $200. This effects most Captains not FOs

Bid line adjust window now 48 hrs Other things are better during this period.

Can now PDO bump a reserve crewmember assighned a trip

New reserve periods A+ and B+ We'll put this in the neutral to negative column.

Union shop Positive----Former non-members exempt--BIG Negative

Much better medical insurance than current Jan 08

Better retirement medical benefits including some sort of medical savings account--read the TA for details

ALOT of enhancements to scheduling parameters. I don't understand how much they will change things but it will be for the BETTER

The NEGATIVES

Deviation expense to base now taxable--I'll now jumpseat to and from MEM more to avoid this!!

150 nonmembers get a free ride to the end of their careers

Electronic bid packs only--OKAY NOW THAT"S AN ISSUE TO GO ON STRIKE FOR!!!

BONUS ONLY $30,000 for WB Capt and $17,700 for WB FO Let's go on strike for this--I want MOOREEEEE. Give me a break.

A vote against this TA would be about the dumbest thing I have seen here since 1989. Get a grip guys. Please someone out there tell me what they want to go on strike for in this new TA because that is what you will be voting for when you vote this down.

#275

golfandfly , 03-07-2018 01:17 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdbirdman

As I remember, you were totally on the "yes" side of the contract vote. As a matter of fact, you said you were planning to retire a year after the contract was signed. Well, you're still here and not happy with the retirement.. Very ironic...

I remember having this conversation with you and several guys on the road. You asked how we were voting and it was split about 50-50. I told you I was a "no" vote due to lack of A fund increase. You said it met your retirement goals and you were displeased that we may vote down this TA due to your impending retirement plans...

#276

mcdbirdman , 03-07-2018 04:45 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by golfandfly

Wasn’t aware that a yes vote disqualifies me from commenting on the ridiculous comments from my fellow pilots against another group of pilots. Read my post again. It’s addressed to those left behind. This pilot group must do something or the best retirement in the industry withers on the vine. I have no idea what that is but blaming the senior guys doesn’t accomplish anything.

#277

pinseeker , 03-07-2018 05:00 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdbirdman

In your other post, you defended the fact that there wasn't an increase in the A plan stating that the increase in the B plan met the 50% of final earnings. Now you are saying that our retirement is falling behind and that you aren't even getting your $130K. So, since your two posts contradict each other, which of them is wrong?

#278

Nightflyer , 03-07-2018 05:05 AM

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If you want to guarantee that everyone on the property will get their high five plus "extra", we will quit blaming the senior guys.

If the senior guys think it is fair to freeze someone else's A plan at less than 130K, than yes, they deserve the blame for pushing a plan that is not equal to what they will get.

We wasted leverage in the last contract, we should have voted it down.

Now guys that voted yes want to line their own pockets at the expense of guys who have been here less than 25 years. No thanks.

I can't believe "my" union is trying to screw me out of my retirement.

#279

golfandfly , 03-07-2018 05:51 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdbirdman

I remember having this exact conversation with you. You told me the B fund met your expectations of a 50% pay replacement. I told you I thought our A fund would "wither on the vine" and that I wouldn't vote for a contract that didn't significantly improve our retirement. I find this incredibly ironic.

We had an opportunity to readdress retirement by voting against the TA. You were an adamant "yes" voter because you wanted to retire in a year. Now you want to address retirement? Seriously?

#280

mempurpleflyer , 03-07-2018 07:41 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by DLax85

Totally agree DLax. As you said in your response, lots of assumptions made by the union. 3% was based on those assumptions...may be more but may also be less.

I guess that's the main issue with this whole thing. We just don't know because our retirement payout will be based on the performance of the market.

There are plenty of us here who, given the choice, would rather stick with what we have. It is a known quantity. It is the "bird in the hand". It is not perfect but we know what we have and it requires us to assume very little risk. Based on that, we can tailor our other investments, both within FedEx (B Plan) and outside accordingly with a level of risk that we are comfortable with.

Why we would voluntarily freeze that is beyond me.