joshc1922

i am a freshman at western michigan university currently and i began the school year majoring in aviation flight science where my ratings counted towards acutal credit. I already have around 100 hours and got my private in high school at my local FBO. when i got here at WMU, i hated it. all the instructors could care less about the students, they were all time builders and i didn't really learn anything. Because i had my private, i had to do what they call a short course. i had to take several lessons and pass another checkride. I ended up spending more money doing the MINIMUM amount of lessons required for the short course than i did for my entire entire PPL training. it was rediculously expensive. They had a whole new fleet of luxury cirrus aircraft which were really nice but WAY too unessasry for private training, and that is much of why it was so expensive. I completed the short course and just started my insturment. It was at this point when i decided that this flight program was enough. Westerns aviation school is over 30 miles from their main campus so i have been spending rediculous amounts of money driving back and forth 5 times a week. Also the instructors who could care less about anything other than theirselves was getting to me. That's when i found this site and heard rumors about aviation degrees being pointless, and i have perfessional confirmation on that fact and that's when i said, im done with wmu's program. So i switched majors and now majoring in criminal justice which will give me a B.S. I plan on continuing my trainging at the same FBO where i did my private and i can save tons of $$$. I plan on doing training during summers or all at once with some saved money once i graduate. I chose criminal justice because it interests me and i am also interested in law enforcement aviation. I still plan on becomming a profession pilot. What i guess I am asking is whether or not this path is any better than going through Westerns bad instruction and over priced training. Is this type of training sought to be equal to a major flight training university? Because i feel the FBO was much more personal and the instructors actually cared so i learned WAY more. I am wondering whether or not in all of your professional opinions was this a good move for me? your feedback will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

de727ups

I think it's a great move. Glad you figured it out as quick as you did. There may be some things that you can't get at some FBO's. Multi? CFI? But you can work around that by doing it somewhere else.

Nobody cares where you train. It's about hours, ratings, and experience levels.

wmupilot85

I am a current WMU student, and I feel that the instructors that I have flown with do care. But, if you seem to be cocky and not put forth the effort, they won't care.

kevin91724

great point about instructors just wanting to build time. Thats what scares me about the "gloosy brochure" flight schools. thanks for sharing.

de727ups

"and heard rumors about aviation degrees being pointless"

OMG. No. Don't let the truth get out....

ryane946

That is a HUGE problem with University flight programs or pilot factories (ATP, Flight Safety, PanAm, RAA...). There are never any lifer instructors. At my FBO, more than half the instructors are career flight instructors. They have been teaching since I had training wheels on my bike. They have forgotten more about instructing than any ATP instructor will ever know! I am glad you recognized this before it was too late.

A cirrus is downright rediculous for private training. There is no need for that. Ideally, you want to do your private training in the cheapest aircraft possible. I did mine in a Cessna-172 ($80/hr), and I often wondered why I didn't go with the C-152 ($60/hr). I would venture a guess that a Cirrus costs about $200/hr. Basically, I could go up and fly for 2.5 hours in my 4 seat C-172 for the same cost on one hour in a Cirrus. Think about that. When flight training can cost $30,000, making it 2.5 times as expensive is a BIG DEAL. New airplanes are nice, but I don't think you should waste money learning to fly in them. A 2007 C-172 is about the same as a 1977 C-172 flying wise.

I wouldn't say an aviation degree is pointless. It is still a college degree. The thing is you do not need an aviation degree to fly airplanes. I got an engineering degree, and that was overkill. If you get a degree like business, finance, engineering, etc..., you will have a backup incase something happens with your flying job.

You are on a perfect path. I would be doing exactly what you are. Go to a local FBO and fly with instructors who care about instructing. Go out and fly a 1980 era Cessna-172 or equivalent (C152, PA-28,..). These are some of the greatest planes ever built. They don't call it "The Golden Era of Aviation" for nothing. They are also cheaper and ideal training aircraft. Get a degree in something other than aviation, especially something you enjoy (like Criminal Justice). No go out and enjoy yourself.
You are on a good path!

oldveedubs

just make sure the fbo you are going to is part 141 certified or you may just end up spending more money getting 250 hours for a commercial license under part 61 when you can be done way before that with a part 141 program

de727ups

Sometimes a less expensive 61 will cost no more than a 141 academy. 61 is less structured and that can have advantages. Also, you can credit 50 hours in an inexpensive ground trainer towards the 250 total under 61.

There are advantages and disadvantages to going either route. Like I said, I've seen 141 programs at 190 that don't save you much over a less costly 61 school at 250.

WhiteH2O

You are on a great track. You will save money, have a more useful degree, and you will get the same ratings that you would any other place. Like Ryane said, there is no reason to learn in a Cirrus (unless someone else is paying). I learned in a $56 hour C-152 and then moved to an $68 C-172. Then taught in Cessnas. An FBO can get you through training just as fast, the training is just as good, and a lot less money.

The 91 vs 141 debate will go on and on, but just be careful with either type. They can both be cheap and they can both be expensive. If you don't have the 250 hours for your commercial, start your multi or CFI. No one says that you have to waste that time flying circles in a rented airplane. Just start the next step. I started multi training and getting used to flying from the right seat (CFI prep) while building toward my 250 hours, once I got there, I was ready for two checkrides and not so far from a CFI.

TXTECHKA

some of the most fun flying time I had was building the 100 or so after the ifr for the commercial (250). This is your chance to load up and go where ever you want just because you can. Also keep the expensive airplanes and excessive amount of dual down to a minimum and you can keep costs low. In the logbook as cirrus is no better than a 150. Glass cockpit means nothing. The only times that are all that special are actual, multi, turbine all followed by cross country pic.