Logging time
 

Ok so my buddy and I are splitting multi time just to build up the time in the log book. question is. If one of us in flying with the foggles and the other is acting as Saftey pilot, we enter into IMC. Is the pilot in the left seat then the only one that can log actual time while the other has to sit and wait for VFR conditions and the foggles to go back on. What if I just leave the foggles on during IMC. I told him that two pilots cannot log actual time at the same time.

Cut straight from FAR 61:

If you aren't flying, you aren't loggin it ;)

well this is more directed at two people flying in a plane and logging time safety pilot vs PIC

If you’re trying to build up time for an airline, most of the time they will only take 10% of your time as safety pilot.

Thats interesting I was told the exact opposite by a few different flight instructors. I havent had the opportunity to log actual while time splitting but I was told both were able. I guess I should pull out the good ole far/aim and have a look.

Safety pilot time is a real gray area with the airlines and FAA. Some airlines accept it, some take a part of the time, and some don't accept it. Depending on where you are, the FAA may or may not agree with your interpretation of the rules.

From what I have learned, if the aircraft if flying in actual IMC conditions, both pilots log the Actual time. If it is VMC and you are on foggles, then it is still considered simulated IMC time and only the pilot at the controls gets that time. IMC can also be broken down into anytime when there is no visible horizon. Anyone else?

This is not true. In the past a few airlines were known to give less-than-full credit for SP time, but I don't know of any that publish such a requirement today. Plenty of folks get hired with hood/SP twin time, especially these days.

Obviously if they have a choice between two applicants with equal everything, except one has 200 hours of MEI time and the other has 200 hours of Hood/SP time they will hire the MEI. In todays environment, they will hire both of you.

It is not a grey area with the FAA at all. It is clearly defined in the regs, and it is also an accepted "industry standard" means of building twin time. See my previous post re. airlines.

However if you enter IMC, the SP is no longer a "required crew member" so he cannot log SP time while in IMC. The PRACTICAL application of this is: Neither pilot should LOG any IMC while on a hood/SP flight. If you do, the SP has to reduce his logged time by an amount equal to the logged IMC. Hopefully you catch my drift here :rolleyes:

Not only can the safety pilot not log time as IMC if under IMC, he/she cannot log ANY time. What if the pilot keeps the foggles on while under IMC? This doesn't matter. Safety pilot's are referenced under 91.109, which is *simulated* instrument flight rules. In actual, you don't need a safety pilot, and therefore the safety pilot can't log time.

It makes sense, right? The safety pilot's purpose is to make sure that you don't hit other airplanes. What are they doing if you're in IMC? Nothing, so why should they log time?

Some of the previous posts have stated that both pilots can log actual and total time in IMC. This is incorrect. The only way two pilots can log actual is if one is a cfii giving dual given.

Safety pilot time is highly disregarded as a means of time building. I disagree with rickair about it being an industry standard. Safety pilot time is meant for you and a friend to go get current flying instrument approaches in VFR conditions. It is and will never be considered a legitimate way to build multi engine time.

double post

Everyone has their own opinion, but as long as the airlines are hiring pilots who earn the majority of their twin time doing the safety pilot thing - pilots will continue to do it as its the most economical way to get your multi-engine experience.

As Rickair said, you do actually want to avoid IMC conditions since only one pilot can log time here and the cost per .1 on the hobbs goes up.

From an FAA standpoint, its safer since you have two pilots up there making decisions and working together.

From an airline standpoint, MEI time is great but its generally VFR stuff. Safety pilot time is generally two pilots flying IFR and also working on CRM (its more airline tailored). So yes currently it is accepted, who knows if it will not be accepted when the airlines aren't so pilot hungry.