"My long term goals would be to make $50k within a year or two and make $100k in three to five years time."

A couple of years ago I would have said no problem making 100K in five to seven years. You'd have to work extra and maybe be a checkairman, but it was doable. Now, with the cycle trending back down, and possibly a few regionals tanking, the 100K goal will be harder to reach. Maybe even darn near impossible unless your at a few select regionals and have been on the property 10 years.

If you really need 100K in five years, I'd think about bidding reserve and starting your own small business as an auto mechanic. I bet your hourly rate wrenching would equal Capts pay easy. I took my Vette into the local Chevy dealer and had to laugh at their $106/hr shop rate.

If you play the game right, flying can be a part time job. If you like wrenching on cars, and are good at it, I could see making pretty good money with that part time as well. With a flying job, and wrenching on the side, I could see 100K in five to seven years, especially during the next upswing.

You'll have a hard time equaling your current pay as a pilot until you upgrade. Used to be, upgrades took two to three years. Now, it's pretty hard to say.

No I don't need a 100k - just a goal. I unfortuneately am very good at my job... I chose to be an auto repair technician when I was 18 - what does an 18 year old know? not much that's what! ;) My highschool sweetheart's dad dang near begged me not to become a mechanic, as he had been one himself when younger. I have owned my own shop - I won't go into the complexities of it here - but I wasn't a very good businessman long story short. I make upwards of $40 per hour working for someone else - it just wasn't worth the headaches for me( my own business ). Dealer rates in my area are around $80. My flight instructor asked why I don't I consider an A&P - number one I make more than a lot of A&P's and I'd have to start at the bottom regardless of my past mechanical experience, though I have little doubt I could progress very quickly, but that all goes back to the whole reason I want to change careers and that is all the years of physical labor takes a toll on your body and I just plain don't want to do it anymore.

Thank you again for your experienced eye on the market as it were. So my goals would have been reasonable based on days gone by but not now and not likely in the near future. I'd be happy enough knocking down $50k without a degree as long as I'm not pulling wrenches :D

Probably not reasonable. Let's assume regional hiring standards revert to post- 9/11 conditions...

You will need 1-3 years as a CFI. Actually, CFI's have been making $50K so you might be in good shape there, unless the market dries up due to high fuel costs.

Then you will do 0-2 years of 135 freight (you might be able to avoid this). This might pay $25-40K

When you get to a regional you will make $20-30K first year, $25-50K after that as an FO. Second year pay varies significantly between airlines. After 2-5 years, you will probably upgrade.

A ten year regional CA at a better company can make $100K.

So after you get your rating you are looking at about 12 years to $100K, maybe a little sooner if things go well for you and the industry. Of course if you take a major airline job after that, your pay will drop to $30K, and then start climbing again (quickly at the top carriers).

For the love of God, don't get into this career based on money. You will be very disappointed. Too many variables. The future is very uncertain. I went from 80Kish in my old life to 17 my first year as a flight instructor. This year, if I bust my rearend, I will make about 35K. I am 37. In two years, I went through all my retirement funds to make this work. Now, I am paycheck to paycheck, but I am cutting back on alot. Gas is a different story though.

In the end, I am glad that I made the decision to change careers. It is an adventure. But it is deffinitely not for everyone.

I hear ya bro, I'm just trying to get an idea of what I can make in the current market.

So let's just do this scenario here -

I finish my Private part time this year, I full time next year till I get Commercial, Multi, Instrument and Instructor then instruct until I get to 1000. Say at that point I would want to start a job like this one here - for example - http://www.aviationcharters.com/employment.html - what could one expect to make at a job like this ( presuming I could get it with 1000 :rolleyes: )

That's a light twin. You'd probably be lucky to make 30K. A better bet, if you want to do that sort of flying, would be Amflight. At least you have a chance to get into PIC turbine quicker. I think you can make 40K in the Metro. You'll need 1200 hours min for a 135 freight PIC job, though.

Starting around 30k at 1000 TT is probably reasonable (at present) ... it doesn't hurt to make early contacts and maintain contact with places in which you'd be interested. I know pilots that have gotten good charter jobs around those parameters by being persistent. Also some who've used a temporary stint in line service to expedite and improve networking.

Ok - Instructing ( at least right now ) is paying ok, first entry level twin job pay would be ok but from there now I'm talking 2000 total time, hopefully get a couple type ratings ( even needed in small aircraft? ) during that time to open up future options - like maybe pay for some lear jet time? sound like reasonable goals now for an average guy happy to be flying instead of wrenching?

The corporate aviation world is all different compared to airlines, and requires a different approach...

If you focus on geneal aviation (non-airline flying) by the time you have 2000 hours and several hundred ME hours you will probably have a feel for what's likely to be available in your area. If your local airport does not have significant bizjet activity, you probably want to find one that does. At the entry-level it is all about who you know and how well you network...if you can look and act like you fit in with the beautiful people, so much the better.

Type ratings are needed for all turbojets, and any airplane over 12,500 pounds. When you say "lear jet" flying I assume you really mean business/corporate flying. Don't use the term lear jet generically...if you're talking specifically about a lear aircraft call it a lear 35, or lear 60, or whatever.

The best approach to type ratings is usually to try to get the employer to pay for one , if needed. It might be necessary, or desireable, to buya type rating in some circumstances. If you don't have a specific job in mind, get a cessna citation type...they are the cheapest, there are a lot of them, and they are more likely to hire a low-time pilot.

There is a corporate aviation forum here on APC, check that out.

cool thanks ya'll that actually answered a bunch of questions I had. So the career path I'm considering would be 135 pilot then part 91(?)for the first five years or so.