awesomesauce17,
The fact that you are doing all this advanced research is fantastic. I am so pleased you are trying to find the right path to take. Wish I could say I did the same thing, but thats far from the truth.

If I had the chance to do it all over again, I wouldn't fly for a living. period. There is a difference between flying when you want to and flying because you have to. There is a difference between flying in nice weather with calm winds as a weekend warrior and flying in windshear at an airline. When you HAVE to fly it sucks all the passion you once had completly out of it.

My prefered route would be air traffic control. They get paid big bucks, they are still in aviation, they have awesome benifits and great retirement. Get a loan to put you through school. When you graduate you'll have enough to live well and pay off your loans. You'll even have the cash to get your ratings and a cessna to fly for $100 hamburgers on the your days off.

In my humble opinion, thats the best advice I can give. Thats what I would do if I had the choice. To be honest, its the passion for flying that I miss the most. I wouldn't want anyone to loose that.

Good luck to you in what ever you do!!! ;)

oops.. accidently posted twice..

I've never heard anyone say that before. Didn't even know FIT had an aviation program. I've always heard Purdue was the best followed closely by the airforce acadamy.

I visited five schools. Purdue, SIU-Carbondale, Central Missouri, Lewis, and SLU (parks). Stuck with parks because I'm from St. Louis, and at the time my grandfather was dying and my family was caring for him. Mom asked me to stay close to home. They also had the best financial aid for me since I went to a catholic highschool.

You're doing the right thing by visiting so many schools. Talk to current students, not just admissions. Find the one that's right for you, make sure you can afford it, and go.

kid needs advice
 

Young man you have so-o-o-o many options. Given your age, my advice and if I could do it over again would be to:

1. Attend a state university
(Acquire as many grants & scholarships as possible; minimize the loans).

2. Learn to fly at a local FBO. (PPL thru MEI).

3. Start instructing once you get your CFI. This will provide addtional finances.

4. Network like crazy. By the time you're 23, you should be ready to take your ATP written and pass. At that point, start calling on the contacts you've made. Also, joining the local Civil Air Patrol wouldn't hurt.;)

5. And last but not least...Choose your "friends" carefully. Bad company corrupts good behavior.

Best wishes. Blue skies.

6. And, uh, don't write bad checks.

Sorry, couldn't resist! :)

college advice
 

Heres my two cents:
I attend North Dakota. We have excellent facilities, new aircraft (piper, cirrus, diamond is tryin to get us to buy some), and the best part is for a four year university, it is extreemly cheap. I got residency after a year up here and pay around 4000 for tuition. Flight costs are much more, but will be any place you go. The good thing about UND is there are like 80 some majors to choose from. So if you decide to major/minor in something else, the door is wide open. Id highly recommend it over ERAU, the atmosphere is much more diverse, we have a $100 million hockey arena to cheer our sioux on, and is much MUCH cheaper. Some benefits of training at a part 141 school compared to part 61 are the hour requirements are less. You will spend less $$ on less hours while in the end getting all your ratings. I am getting ready to take my Commerical Multi/Instrument test and have around 200 hours total time. There are many who agree and prob even more who disagree with this, just my 2 cents

Good luck deciding

Just go to the USAF academy. Free school and if you qualify, free flight lessons.

OK! LOL. :)

True story, this would be by far your best bet. Your kinda late in the game now if you haven't already got your nomination and paperwork in. No worries though, keep your grades up a college this coming year and apply for the following year. I attend UND, but my brother attends USAFA (he wants to fly too), and I can see hes gonna get the better deal.

awesomesauce17
 

awesomesauce17,

FIT is a great school. I went there. Great people to work with. If you choose to go down there, you best be ready to work though. College is a different world compared to HS...that's for sure!:P No matter what, do whatever it is to make you happy. You will be there for 4 + years. (especially if you stay there to flight instruct)

PM me if you have questions about the school

I personally went through ROTC and got a flight slot (I had zero flight time and had ridden on a plane only one time) while in school. The government paid for 13 hrs in a C-150 at a local FBO. That was the first time I was ever in a cockpit of an airplane. Walked through Reese AFB, Tx gates with a whopping 13 hrs total flight time, and 51 weeks later, had my wings. Total cost to me.....Nuthin, but I did 12 years of flying heavy muti-engines jets and seeing the world! :cool:

Im really curious about this route now. Why did they offer you a positing through ROTC? Ive been trying to contact the local rep here, but he is never in his office it seems. Im trying for that, and I hope to have a fair amount of hours before getting into the air force (Im hopefully going to be flying all through college). If I get vision correction surgery ASAP and my private pilots license, will I have an advantage?

[QUOTE=ubermich]I got an aviation degree and do I regret it? No. When I was in your same position senior year of high school a lot of the instructors told me to major in something other than aviation as a backup plan; something useful, like finace. Then I talked to someone who hires and fires people for a large corporation. He told me that after a couple years of being out of college that if a person has no real world experience in that field, that he consideres the degree obsolete. One of my dad's clients who holds a similar position told him the same thing. So this meant to me that if I majored in finance and CFIed for a while then went on to a regional, then lost my medical, that I would be in the exact same place as I would be if I majored in aviation or history or dance.QUOTE]

I have heard/seen the same thing. If you do choose to major in something else, it will only work as a back up plan for a short time, i.e. a couple of years out of college. No decent paying employer is going to hire you and pay you more than you are making flying, if you got your degree in Business some 3-5 years ago and have never done anything with it since then. They have plenty of better options. What airline would hire someone who hasn't flown at all in the past 3-5 years??? Same idea.

Futher, there are plenty of jobs out there that require simply a college degree, no specific major, that pay well.

Look around, evaluate all your options, there is definately a way to make it all work, but that doesn't mean it will be easy.

If your happy, and you are sure it will make you happy, go with it. You only live once.

Awesomesauce17,

A little advice from someone who was in your shoes a few years ago and jumped back into them just recently to finish his degree:

Aviation degrees, such as BS Aviation Operations, Aviation Management, etc. are highly specialized degrees. Just like a bachelor's degree in engineering or information technology, there are not that many jobs out there which require a bachelor's degree in aviation science. In essence, many of the colleges and universities in the nation have simply capitalized on the fact that pilots need degrees to work for major carriers, (also realizing that most flight students want to be airline pilots) and have created this major around flying. A good major, yes, but is it a major that can keep you employed outside of the aviation field if you get furloughed, etc: not really.

I recently received $50,000 in scholarship money to continue my flight training and finish my degree. If it wasn't for the scholarship money, I wouldn't be able to become a pilot. I suggest to you that you go with the university that offers you the best scholarship package. Why? Because your endowments can only increase monetarily if you keep your grades up, are focused and loyal to your educational institution; and it's better for you in the long run to develop a relationship with the people who hold the purse strings at your college. [i.e., minimize loans].

Secondly: If you decide to fly, become an instructor at that college and somehow remain actively involved in your education. (Pursuing an MBA makes you that more competetive during an economic downturn).

Whatever you do, don't go to Riddle. I have a friend who graduated from there in 2002 or 2003, he has loans up the ass, about 400TT, and no CFI. Granted he's sort of a dufus, it's still not the place to go.

Remember, take in the information here presented by everyone [we do care about you, obviously] but make your own informed decisions.

I agree with everything you said about the A.S. degree, but engineering and CS degrees are a different story...a specialized engineering degree can get you a job in your dream field (ex. spacecraft propulsion) if you're lucky, but also is a great fallback position because you can always get an engineering job in any field related to your specialty...our spacecraft propulsion guy could get a job designing single-engine propellor hubs or aileron fairings or whatever. CS degrees, even with specialization, open up the entire IT industry: software & hardware mfgs, integrators, end-user companies, defense, etc. (but a computer engineering degree is even better).

Also an engineering degree in the hands of a US citizen has the great advantage of eligibility for a security clearance...you have a pool of job opportunities that are ONLY available to long-term citizens, and they often involve some pretty neat stuff.

While I somewhat agree with your philosophy, I was simply trying to make a comparison: The jobs are NOT a dime a dozen for graduates with extremely specialzed, brand-name degrees. I'm simply trying to help this kid make an informed decision. Not waste his money and get stuck with 400 hours, three raitings and a huge amount of debt to pay back.

awesomesauce17, i am also a high school senior who's confused about where to go. I'm really looking at Lewis just due to the fact they are giving me $8,500 a year for 4+ years and grants. I have spoken with the aviation administrator from Lewis, and he says 95% of aviation flight graduates end up with a job. So $17,500 for tuition (-) the money they WILL give to you ($8,500) (+)flight fees (-)grants = still gives you plenty to pay off but not as much. Any lewis graduates tips?

well
 

as long as you dont go to Regional Airline Academy then I think any career move toward an education is a suitable one !

Sorry it took so long to get back, but been on the road.

First, USAF ROTC did'nt offer it to me, I earned it by competing against many others through my grades, scores on the military entrance exam, etc.

Dont know why the recruiters are ignoring you. After all, rotc is recruiting.

When I went through UPT (undergraduate pilot training) Nov'83 - Nov'84, there was no such thing called "vision correction surgery". YOu either had 20-20 or better, or you did'nt get a pilot slot.

Having as much private time when you go through is an EXTREMELY HUGE ADVANTAGE. The military will look at that as not having to "test the waters with you" as they say (IE-send you to Hondo TX to see if you can grasp the idea that if you push forward, trees get bigger, pull back and trees get smaller) There were two guys in my class who were regional pilots, each with over 5000 hrs. Needless to say, they breezed through the program, while I studied my ass off and sweated each day (had no clue to what a vor was).

Anyway, it was a fantastic experience. Good luck. :cool:

"If ya can't fly with 4 engines out on one side, you can't fly"

HEY WOW i havent been in this post for A LONG TIME. alrite wells i decided to go to Florida Tech for good. I got this awesome loan that gives me low interest plus 20 years to pay back, plus a sweet amount of scholarships (at the moment $15,000 a year and counting lol sorry couldnt resist) and i figure i will get scholarships down the road at Florida Tech. Florida Tech just seemd to have the whole package, so Im going there.

To the guy asking about Lewis, props on the scholarship. nice work. lewis isnt for me because well there 95 percent job rate is based on hiring at their FBO for flight instructors. Now dont get me wrong, i know thats an EXCELLENT way to build up flight hours. However, I have talked to a lot of flight instructors there and and FIT, and they dont treat there new CFIS very well at all. However, when i visited them they said within 3 or 4 years they are looking at having a bridge program with American Eagle. SOunds like neat stuff. Also i live like 5 minutes away from Lewis, and no offense but i wana get out of town really bad lol.

To any body else out there, as far as colleges are concerned, it seems like Saint Louis University is going down a great path right now. They almost exclusively are JetBlue's northern internship house, and they get a lot of people into the Southwest internship. They have a pretty cool program. HOWEVER, St. Louis shuts down after 10 if your under 21. NO JOKE!! I mean, Im an honor student and all, but you know everyone likes to have some fun every now and then. Otherwise um, Saint Louis has a pretty cool campus, the professors seem great, and they are VERY well connected. They have a retired pilot from TWA (practically flew everything with wings on it), ex-american, united, and delta flight instructors, as well as retired bussiness executives. Just like Florida Tech, they are a very well connected school. Also the girls are MUCH MORE ATTRACTIVE in St. Louis. Alrite thats my 2 cents. Feel free to comment back.

Also lewis kid, or anybody else considering college, hit me up at
www.myspace.com/blazingpaco

Does FTD time count as actual flying hours?

It doesn't count towards your total time, but as long as it is IFR certified by the FAA you can use it towards some of your ratings.

No. In fact it probably doesn't even count as sim time unless it is an FAA certified instrument simulator...if it is, it will have the FAA authorization posted on the wall.

Apparently your friend did not put enough effort into it. Most of my friends that are graduating this year have their CFII's. On top of that 47 instructors have been hired from the school onto a regional since july '05. Don't bash the school just because your friend had a bad experience.

It's not just as easy as waking up and saying oh "I want to go to USAFA"...It’s an extremely hard to school to get into, not to mention, if you are a senior, you’re probably too late. Most cadets were starting to write congressmen to endorse them while a junior, and probably attended the USAFA camp held during that summer. Also once you are at USAFA your not neccessarliy guranteed a flight spot. Only half of the spots are guranteed to USAFA graduates and the other half go the Air Force ROTC guys. Other instituions (Navy, Army, RTOC programs) offer free schooling at Unviersities, and you can still have a decent social life while attending those Universities.

Not So
 

It's not easy to get into, but is not that difficult either. Even if you don't get in, they have a year long junior college, acadamy prep school on base you might be able to attend. If things work out there, you're golden. You don't have to be right out of high school to attend either, one of the guys in my brothers squad was an enlisted f-15 crew chief, he was old enough that he was drinking with all the upperclassmen his first year there.

The nomination isn't nearly as big a deal as it sounds, usually a phone call or talk with your high school counsoler early in your senior year is enough to set up an appointment with your local congressman.

Only the hardcore cadets that just can't get enough of the military attend the summer camp, most do not. You are not guaranteed a flight spot, but it would be safe to say that you are all but guaranteed one assuming you are willing and able. Last year the acadamy had more flight slots then they had cadets (again willing and able) to fill them.

The academys are the way to go man. I wish I had put a little more effort into trying to make it to one...hind sight is 20/20.

awesomesauce17, thanks for starting this thread, I've learned a lot from it. I'm in the same position as you (except a year younger) and am looking for a good school. Im looking to leave this island too! lol :D

Good luck and blue skies dude :)

What about Louisiana Tech University. Since I have been in the Professional Aviation program there I recieved my Instrument through MEI. I started instructing in between my Freshmen and Sophomore year...now currently in my second year still (Senior by hours) I have 700 TT and 50 ME. I dont think you can get experience like this anywhere else in the country. On the side I copilot a B-200 and a F-90 with RON usually once a week. The school is DIRT CHEAP. After all is said and done I will be about 40-45K in debt. The people there are great, and we in aviation are a real family. Its nice to be able to have a life outside of flying (being a college larger than just aviation), and it is also a NCAA Division 1-A school.

Just my .02

Righhht....
 

First off, the USAFA is one of the most selective schools in the United States. It’s not UND, where you can be accepted after you put the stamp on your application. Requirements include, but not limited to: having at LEAST an average of 30 on your ATC. Also, at LEAST a 630 on the verbal and a 663 on math for the SAT. In addition the averages of students accepted are in the top 3% of their class. The overall process is: 60% of the selection is based upon academics, 20% is based on extracurricular activities, and a 20% selection panel rating. In fact, the AFA encourages students as young as 8th grade to begin preparing for acceptance.

As for the “simple phone call” to “set-up” and appointment also isn’t a guaranteed opportunity. Congressmen are only allowed to write two letters of recommendations a year. Most students willing to go to the AFA start visiting congressman early in their high school career to just get their name out. Just think about how many people are asking for a letter. If your not up to par with your grades, or aren’t a stand-out athlete, you can forget receiving a letter.

Also, the prep school is also extremely difficult to get into as well. Why? Because only a limited number of students are accepted into that program and the majority of the prep students are collegian athletes who were not accepted into AFA. Furthermore, once you arrive at the prep school, you’re not a cadet yet. You’re only referred to as a ‘cadet in training’. The prep school only improves chances for appointment as an Air Force Academy cadet, but does not guarantee one. Because no one, and I mean NO ONE, is guaranteed or “golden” once they get their. The AFA washes out so many people.

As well, once you enter your first year at the AFA you are AUTOMATICALLY a freshman, whether you 19, 20, or 21. Even if you have attended the prep school! Also, freshmen don’t “drink with all the upperclassman”, if they do, they get kicked out, plus not one single upperclassman would WANT to drink with a freshman.

Finally, although your “hindsight is 20-20”, that obviously isn’t the reason you couldn’t attend the Air Force Academy. Although the air force will not give any cadets LASIK, they will give cadets (juniors and seniors) PRK, which is a lot like LASIK, just more painful. You CAN STILL FLY once you get PRK.

Simply put, your remarks are ignorant.

Go to a state school and major in some type of business degree. Once you graduate you have very low loan payments and can easily get in to graduate school or flight school and will have a job to support it.