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shdw 06-29-2009 06:04 AM


Originally Posted by 250 or point 65 (Post 636709)
Forgive me for not quite understanding. Exactly what are you scanning for outside when you are in IMC? To me, there's nothing to see out there and you only run the risk of becoming increasingly disoriented and eventually upset.

I simply mean after a few minutes looking out shouldn't disorient you, it wasn't not meant to scan for anything important. Common man being in clouds is fun you have too look around. On a practical note, you could be scanning outside for ice build up but that wasn't the purpose when I stated that before.

250 or point 65 06-29-2009 06:51 AM

ah, got it, sorry

shdw 06-29-2009 07:59 AM

No worries, I am horrible with wording as you will likely find out and that certainly doesn't help.

AirWillie 06-29-2009 10:03 AM


Originally Posted by jrs3fk195 (Post 628281)
Can anyone offer some useful advise? I'm a new Instrument Rated Pilot who did most of his flight training under foggles. My time in the clouds was limited during my training, and I never shot an "actual" approach before the checkride. Wanting to be safe, I vowed I would not fly IMC until I go comfortable with it. However, I am NOT getting comfortable. My first few minutes in the clouds are horrible. Although I maintain speed, altitude, and heading within PTS minimums, the feelings of vertigo are horrible! After a few minutes I'm OK, unless I'm flying an approach and the idea of desending, make me feel like I'm diving for the ground, (regardless of what the VSI and altimeter show) Is this normal? Or is there something I can do to make myself more comfortable and a better pilot?

If your an airline driver, and fly CAT III approaches daily, please do not respond, unless you can offer something useful. I've read too many threads that where GA pilots are belittled for wanting to learn. I know I don't have the skills of a legacy captain, don't remind me. I'm looking for help in hopes that one day I will.

That's completely normal. I was scared the first time I went into clouds, mostly because of the stuff I read on pilot training books where they make it seem like you will make a death spiral if you take your eyes of the instruments. It's not bad at all, you just need to get used to it. It goes away very quickly and actually becomes fun after a while as long as you're not in icing conditions!

MoonFallsDown 06-30-2009 09:09 PM

hey, i have had this feelings most of the time when I am flying IFR, First time I almost killed my self and when the time went through i got the catch and its better now, but i am not the best. I feel disoriented once in every flight, i guess its normal for us low time pilots. All i did was trusted the instruments. It helped.

cospilot 07-01-2009 06:47 PM

Getting Over Vertigo During Approaches
 
I didn't read through all the entries but another suggestion is get some simulator time, and maybe in a full-motion level-D simulator, but this is not necessary. One thing I've always noticed is that the simulator very nearly resembles the real thing. Shot several approaches with misses. Imagine that you are in the airplane. Imagine what it would feel like. Work on your scan, believe the instruments, and don't delay on any one instrument. Work on forming a mental picture of where you are in the approach as if you were watching a moving.

Then go out and shot night approaches somewhere REALLY dark where your peripheral can't play tricks on you.

Believing your instruments is the key. Try not to move your head and just move your eyes. If you have to move your head, move it slowly and with purpose. Are you keeping your eyes going, not focusing too much on one instrument?

You'll get past it with practice, but you have done the right thing to listen to your comfort level and not fly actual till you are ready. However, with that said, for some that is just the ticket. Get out there, believe in yourself and fly some actual, all the while remember your training.

If you need a refresher and a fresh perspective, visit PilotWorkshops.com IFR Proficiency Series. Really great stuff!

Anyway, good luck! Update us on how you are doing.

Jeff

todd1200 07-01-2009 07:54 PM

When you get into IMC, just put your foggles on :D

WalkOfShame 07-02-2009 04:08 AM


Originally Posted by cospilot (Post 638317)
I didn't read through all the entries but another suggestion is get some simulator time, and maybe in a full-motion level-D simulator, but this is not necessary. One thing I've always noticed is that the simulator very nearly resembles the real thing. Shot several approaches with misses. Imagine that you are in the airplane. Imagine what it would feel like. Work on your scan, believe the instruments, and don't delay on any one instrument. Work on forming a mental picture of where you are in the approach as if you were watching a moving.

Then go out and shot night approaches somewhere REALLY dark where your peripheral can't play tricks on you.

Believing your instruments is the key. Try not to move your head and just move your eyes. If you have to move your head, move it slowly and with purpose. Are you keeping your eyes going, not focusing too much on one instrument?

You'll get past it with practice, but you have done the right thing to listen to your comfort level and not fly actual till you are ready. However, with that said, for some that is just the ticket. Get out there, believe in yourself and fly some actual, all the while remember your training.

If you need a refresher and a fresh perspective, visit PilotWorkshops.com IFR Proficiency Series. Really great stuff!

Anyway, good luck! Update us on how you are doing.

Jeff


Night approaches are a great idea. If you can manage to fly on a night with a new moon or with a cloud base that blocks it out, into an airport with very few lights around and nothing around the airport, it feels very similar to flying in actual. Shot the visual to an airport like that the other night. Ended up using the LOC and GS anyway cause the illusion was pretty bad.

SemperFly 07-02-2009 01:40 PM


Originally Posted by mmaviator (Post 628462)
what helped me and what my instructor told me was to get on instruments way before entering the goo. then don't look outside cause of the unnecessary head movements.


IMHO, the best reply in the thread!

Get on the instruments early and stay on them until you get close to breaking out of IMC. Scan with your eyes and not with your head. Adjust your personal minimums until you get more comfortable and proficient.

And finally, just because you are rated doesn't mean you can't go up with a CFII (or an experienced, comfortable, current instrument-rated pilot) to ride shotgun while you get yourself more acclimated to the IMC environment. If I were you, I would be looking for every smooth, IMC day I could find (or afford) to get used to it. Avoid overly turbulent days at first, as this would most likely be counter-productive.

Stick with it, you'll get the hang of it soon enough. Just try not to get in over your head.

SemperFly

shdw 07-02-2009 06:44 PM


Originally Posted by MoonFallsDown (Post 637775)
hey, i have had this feelings most of the time when I am flying IFR, First time I almost killed my self and when the time went through i got the catch and its better now, but i am not the best. I feel disoriented once in every flight, i guess its normal for us low time pilots. All i did was trusted the instruments. It helped.

Try what I mentioned in my earlier post and see if things change. Get on the instruments a few hundred feet before the clouds and be relaxed, comfortable, and with the aircraft under good control when you enter the clouds. Stay like this only till you feel comfortable to look away and fly as normal.

You might be surprised how subconsciously we look up at things like going into a cloud simply for the fact that it is in our nature to not enjoy confinement which entry into clouds gives you this feeling. So consciously thinking about and doing this might help you out, not sure though but it certainly can't hurt. Good luck.


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