Engine failure at night
10-31-2009, 07:24 AM
#1
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Engine failure at night
Looking for some opinions.
Lets say you have an engine failure at nigth after we pitch for Vg then we look for a field. This is where my question is. In a sparsely populated area all you see is dark areas, you cant see trees, telephone poles, power lines, etc... What would you guys go for? Would you try to pull a Sully and put it in lake?
Or do you just choose a dark area and when you turn your landing light on and dont like what you see just turn it back off.
Lets say you have an engine failure at nigth after we pitch for Vg then we look for a field. This is where my question is. In a sparsely populated area all you see is dark areas, you cant see trees, telephone poles, power lines, etc... What would you guys go for? Would you try to pull a Sully and put it in lake?
Or do you just choose a dark area and when you turn your landing light on and dont like what you see just turn it back off.
10-31-2009, 08:39 AM
#2
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Joined APC: Jun 2009
Posts: 317
For me it would depend on the aircraft and the environmental conditions. I am not putting a GA aircraft in a lake in the dead of winter where I will just freeze to death anyways. GA aircraft are designed to crash at 40 MPH, at least that is what the crash tests are done on.
If you take it in at minimum speed you can crash into just about anything and have a high percentage of walking away. Sure you might be banged up, but you will be alive. So I would get it down as slow as possible and hope for the best.
If you take it in at minimum speed you can crash into just about anything and have a high percentage of walking away. Sure you might be banged up, but you will be alive. So I would get it down as slow as possible and hope for the best.
10-31-2009, 09:38 AM
#4
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An old pilot once told what to do in this situation...
Setup for best glide, configure the airplane, turn on the LDG lights, and wait.
If you don't like what you see, turn the LDG lights back off.
Setup for best glide, configure the airplane, turn on the LDG lights, and wait.
If you don't like what you see, turn the LDG lights back off.
10-31-2009, 09:52 AM
#5
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In FAA-H-8083-3A (Airplane Flying Handbook) it says:
- Maintain positive control; Vg; and turn towards an airport (look for beacons or tune in a CTAF and click for PCL) or AWAY from congested areas.
- Check to determine cause of the engine failure. If you changed something just before the engine failed, undo it.
- Announce the emergency situation to ATC or UNICOM . . . if you are already in contact with a facility, do not change frequencies unless instructed to.
- If the nearby terrain is not known, turn towards an unlighted portion of the area (but NOT one that is reflecting stars or other light . . . ditching a GA airplane in the water is almost suicidal because of the tendency for the airplane to cartwheel upon contacting the water. I heard that your best bet is to trim for level flight 10-30 feet above the water just above a stall and jump out because it won't be much worse than falling when water-skiing)
- If possible, choose a landing sight close to public access.
- Maintain wind awareness to avoid a downwind landing (check ATIS/AWOS/ASOS, groundspeed, etc. . . . this is where it pays to know where factories are located to look for steam)
Landing light working: complete the landing in the normal landing attitude at the slowest possible airspeed.
Landing light not working and outside visual references not available: hold airplane in level-landing attitude until ground is contacted.
- After landing, turn off all switches and evacuate ASAP
Another thing to consider is to plan your flight along a route with plentiful airports or fields. Also, the FAA does not recommend flying above 5000 MSL without supplemental oxygen at night for aeromedical reasons, so consider purchasing an oxygen system and cruising higher to improve your odds of gliding to a suitable landing site. Also, get that instrument rating.
Hope this helps!
- Maintain positive control; Vg; and turn towards an airport (look for beacons or tune in a CTAF and click for PCL) or AWAY from congested areas.
- Check to determine cause of the engine failure. If you changed something just before the engine failed, undo it.
- Announce the emergency situation to ATC or UNICOM . . . if you are already in contact with a facility, do not change frequencies unless instructed to.
- If the nearby terrain is not known, turn towards an unlighted portion of the area (but NOT one that is reflecting stars or other light . . . ditching a GA airplane in the water is almost suicidal because of the tendency for the airplane to cartwheel upon contacting the water. I heard that your best bet is to trim for level flight 10-30 feet above the water just above a stall and jump out because it won't be much worse than falling when water-skiing)
- If possible, choose a landing sight close to public access.
- Maintain wind awareness to avoid a downwind landing (check ATIS/AWOS/ASOS, groundspeed, etc. . . . this is where it pays to know where factories are located to look for steam)
Landing light working: complete the landing in the normal landing attitude at the slowest possible airspeed.
Landing light not working and outside visual references not available: hold airplane in level-landing attitude until ground is contacted.
- After landing, turn off all switches and evacuate ASAP
Another thing to consider is to plan your flight along a route with plentiful airports or fields. Also, the FAA does not recommend flying above 5000 MSL without supplemental oxygen at night for aeromedical reasons, so consider purchasing an oxygen system and cruising higher to improve your odds of gliding to a suitable landing site. Also, get that instrument rating.
Hope this helps!
10-31-2009, 02:28 PM
#9
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I used to teach my students that if there are any houses or civilization in the area to aim for the darkest area NEAREST the lights within reason.
By doing that you are not landing in someones backyard or endangering those on the ground but you are at the same time giving yourself a chance of being rescued/found sooner.
By doing that you are not landing in someones backyard or endangering those on the ground but you are at the same time giving yourself a chance of being rescued/found sooner.
10-31-2009, 05:39 PM
#10
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Joined APC: Jun 2009
Posts: 317
Originally Posted by usmc-sgt
By doing that you are not landing in someones backyard or endangering those on the ground but you are at the same time giving yourself a chance of being rescued/found sooner.
Planespotta: Your jumping out into water theory might be good if you know how deep the water is. At night this would seem suicidal, I'll stay in the aircraft. Otherwise a 30 foot fall into a two foot swamp or a high sitting rock/embankment in a lake will be deadly.
IMO fly a foot off the water until you stall, 33 knots in a 172 and with a good jerk back you can probably get under 30 with some vertical sink. Protect your head on impact and other than some broken bones you should walk away. We aren't flying in a piece of paper, it does provide pretty substantial protection.
On another note, cartwheeling isn't as deadly as direct impact, its actually safer, just looks worse.
Finally, contact ATC or UNICOM? This was in the AFH
What about 121.5?
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