Don't flatter yourself. The only thing that you wrote that I agreed with was "the PC12 is a great airplane" & "The PT6 is a great engine"

Now if you want to discuss the advantages/disadvantages of single engine versus multi-engine for the one millionth time on this website, fine. Just do it from your real account instead of being a troll. What's odd is that you suddenly decide to sign up yesterday out of the blue for the first time just so you could pounce on a company's misfortune with a very serious accident.

And these terrible work conditions that Planesense pilots work in?

My gosh what touchy fellows you are. Reading all this sophistry makes me want to quote a little Shakespeare, "Methinks thou dost protest too much".

You have 30 days to relocate after you sign the papers

Flight safety sim gouge anyone? I'm almost to the point where I'm putting in my two weeks at my current place of employment, weirdddd feeling

The sim gouge is: know the profiles and company procedures, make sure you are very comfortable with IFR. It's straightforward training; best of luck.

The real gouge is to make sure you eat your weight in Texas BBQ while down in DFW.


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Any chances there are any openings in DFW area at the moment or within a few months?

Not sure what the current qualifications are that will get you considered?

I'm interested in the Company from what I have read, but am still doing research.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

No base in DFW at the moment, you would have to move close to PSM, PDK, or MCO.

Thank You, not sure where I would like to relocate to at this time, starting my research.

How long to get upgraded right now? Does anyone ever hear any rumors about changing the 8/6 to a few more options to make it more appealing? 8 days is a long time to be away from home.

Upgrade is 4 months to 2+ years depending on merit, company standing, and seniority. No plans or talk of changing the schedule. Eight days can be long, but you aren't always gone the whole time.


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March
 

Anyone else on here joining me in March?

Sorry captfavreau .. I'm slotted for April..see ya around campus.. Good Luck !

I hope I don't need luck 🙄

You'll learn that this industry is a combination of luck and skill! Take the luck when you can...

hopefully i get lucky then!

dropped my notice in my bosses mail box today no turning back now!

You're boss is going to understand... If he/she doesn't understand .... Would you want to work for them anyways?

This is aviation. You're going to leave many more before you end up where you need to be

Keep in mind that it's very common to start at 4am on day 1 and finish up around midnight on day 8. Eight days is way too long to keep a crew on the road. Upgrades are "merit" which means never complain about anything, ever.

If you're planning on the Florida bases you might want to review the history of those bases during the last slow down, they disappeared.

Finally remember flying a single engine turboprop is career suicide unless you already have lots of experience. Get your time and get out. If you stick around too long no one will ever hire you. There are lots of guys there that have been trying to get out for years but they can't afford the pay cut.

Good Luck

<----3rd most bitter guy ever to leave planesense

Don't listen to this guy. If you're new to the industry, this job will teach you a lot and set you up well for the rest of your career. If you've been around the block, there's a lot of things the company does well that put other operators to shame.

If you're worried about being on the road for 8 days, don't bother showing up. Anecdotally, I spend about 20% of my work cycles on the road for eight days. The winter is slow, but in the last month I've worked 7 days.

It's completely true that flying a single engine turboprop is career suicide. There are people flying the Pilatus all over the world who hang their head in shame and wonder how they will face their children on their deathbed. Fast food workers usually spit in their french fries and loan sharks marvel at their lack of morals and conviction. It's basically akin to getting a DUI, only worse - you can get hired at a 121 airline with a DUI, but not with time in a Pilatus.

...............

I do think I know who this person is...

There's nothing to agree upon with that he has said...

I would be surprise if a Florida "base" closes again.. I think they have realized it's cheaper to airline than it is too repo. So you'll most likely see more opportunities for "home basing".

I wouldn't say 4 am is normal. I'd say 430 am :-)...

As far as career ending.. That's garbage. I know people who left for other jobs with not much experience else where. Some are Hawker captains, falcon captains, Learjet captains, and the airlines (not regionals) ...

The choice is yours to make. Maybe if you've been here 15 years you may find it HARDER to get a job. But it's not impossible. I would never worry about that.

That's a bold statement. If you couldn't get a job after PS for some reason- I don't think it was because of you having too much PC-12 time. Just saying.

The only people "stuck" at PS are the ones that want to be stuck at PS. They're not willing to leave the comfort zone of a 8/6 schedule, and semi-decent money. I was willing to take the leap, and I've doubled my income in 2 years.

Career suicide flying the PC-12? No way! Plenty of regionals hiring - including those with a flow-through to a major. Instant career path! If you have the hours you can also upgrade faster on nice equipment. There are more options these days.

I think you’re made my point. Simply put if someone wishes to advance their career, they would be far wiser to do so by operating multiengine jet or turboprop equipment as soon as they can. Single engine time has limited value (yes my opinion). Many corporations that operate jet aircraft will not hire them without substantial multiengine time. This is due to many reasons but most often their insurance will not allow it. Certainly a jump to a major airline would be difficult without lots of multiengine time. The Regional’s are a different story but that simply makes my point. If a pilot has 4 or 5 years experience operating a single TP I’m guessing their salary will be in the 60k range. Making a jump to a Regional will be more difficult due to the large pay cut they’ll need to take. It would be far easier to get your 1500 hours and make the transition then.

if you have decent hours you can upgrade faster at a regional and make more money. Plus, some are offering hiring bonuses these days. If you make the move, I would personally focus on those offering a flow-through agreement to the majors like Piedmont, PSA or Envoy to AA. Again, you guys have more options than in the past....

I plan on making a career out of this because 1 the business model is interesting, seems to be a solid strong company, not going to be flying the same arrivals and approach to the same airports over and over again, and i love the northeast :rolleyes:

yah they pay aint SUPER to START, ill be taking a 10K a year hit, BUT, its sure gonna be better then teaching steep turns and stalls all day


not gonna lie it's really hard to get cross country at a 141 flight school unless you jerk the student around (some do :( ), obviously this poses a problem going to a 121 operator

What flight school are you teaching at that you'd take a 10k hit by going to planesense? I got about a 20k increase, you'll get about $8k+ in per diem for the year in addition to salary.

I personally think for the equipment, operation and hours we work, the starting pay is very fair.

Riddle Prescott Campus, had 44k of income on my W2 it was an insane year tho had 15 students at one point not enough IPs to go around


Never considered the 8k a year per diem tho

any thoughts on the 10K/12 month training contract in order to upgrade?

The plus side: it's a one time, pro rated charge. It's also concurrent with the new hire training contract. If you upgrade quickly, it's not tacked on to the other end.

The downside: I have heard from FOs that it may keep them from wanting to upgrade.

The reality: it's a business decision. There was some increased attrition from newly upgraded captains - that costs money. This is a mechanism to get people who WANT to stay there to say yes to an upgrade.

If a training contract keeps you from coming here, that's fine. I came here with the expectation that I would pay the bucks if a better deal came along.

12 month comitment makes sense by explain the 10k? Salary reduction? Contract buy out?

I don't think I understand the question. If you upgrade, you sign a new note. If you leave the company before 12 months, you owe a pro rata share of that note.


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Do not count per diem as "income". It isn't.

I understand, but as a flight instructor and other jobs I've worked in the past traveling, if there is no per diem , there is my paid salary and then I pay out of pocket to eat.

So regardless of per diem or not I still eat, so If I flight instruct for 20k a year and pay for food versus, get paid 30k a year and paid 8k per year to eat, you can look at it however you want, but thats an 18k increase for me.

Answered it thanks

This must be a new thing... There was never an upgrade contract while I was there.

That being said, you can easily walk out the door the next day and not pay a dime.

I know many people who have left. And have never paid anything.. Some owners $6,000... Some significant less.

I think that's the case at most companies with these types of agreements. It probably depends more on the terms you departed.


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Sorry, not trying to be disrespectful, but I don't get the attraction to Planesense for new FOs. Regional alternatives are not perfect, but the hiring conditions have never been this attractive for new ATPs....

These days, get 1500 hours and you have plenty of alternatives to a Pilatus job paying $30K. Get a signing bonus, starting pay is better than it used to be (upgrades with better pay could be faster than in the past), typically several basing choices (or the ability to bid a different base in a few months) and, in some cases, go fly an E175 or CR7/9 with a flow-through (career path) to a legacy. Not perfect, but Envoy and PSA come to mind for flow-throughs. And you don't have to pick a default crappy regional these days - they are all improving their terms and scrambling for pilots. Piedmont and Commutair, for example, have made some big changes in their offers lately. If terms suck, fewer pilots will apply or stay...

Again, not a slam on Planesense which is a growing, established operator on the East Coast (the PC-24 will be cool). Just trying to understand the thought process and considerations for potential newbies.

Can someone who has recently made the jump from a regional to Planesense elaborate on the attraction of a PC12 FO job versus today's various regional alternatives? Airlines aren't for everyone... But with many more choices these days, what makes Planesense a good place to work vs the alternatives? What do you like about your job?