Junior Base.
 

Can a new joiner get Denver out of training?

Probably PHL at first. But likely back to DEN before you hit the line when completing IOE. Then you can upgrade there in 15 years or so.

How about MCO ?

Most junior MCO FO is an 11/18 hire

Not much growth in MCO right now. Rumors have speculated that MCO will double in size once JetBlue moves from the terminal. But now we have Spirit showing up and moving in. Not sure how that will impact us??
It seems like the only growth at F9 occurs when we add bases. Not much growth without that.

How long does it take to get ORD? Thanks

All bases are attainable in less than 6 months. The amount of time spent on reserve at each of the bases is in flux.

Reserve spent on your couch is the best reserve

Reserve A spent asleep in your bed is the best.

Would anyone be kind enough to share a typical bid packet?

It's kinda irrelevant seeing as how we'll be bidding via PBS this summer when you'd be hitting the line

I’d just like to get an idea of hotels, pairings, etc.

PBS isn’t scheduled to be implemented until next January at the earliest. So hard lines are relevant for at least another 11 months. Also, PBS won’t change how our pairings (trips) are constructed.
He/she could probably get a great deal of info from a bid packet, if it is for the correct base.

Thanks. We have PBS at my current operator and I've had experience with the "hard line" format in my previous life, so I realize the differences. I have many friends at just about every carrier except unfortunately Frontier which has been quickly becoming a place of interest for me. I would really appreciate making a contact at Frontier for some kind insight into the details of the operation.

Giving out hotel info on the internet to an anonymous person sounds like a bad idea.

However, I can answer a little. Lots of hotels that are nice, but have the word airport in the title, but the new contract will implement short and long stay, so that will change some. As dh pay, trip rig, and min duty pay are implemented, the pairings will change to minimize cost. We do a lot of redeyes overall, some bases more than others, and those are one or two legs a night. Average leg length is 2:30-3:00, so we arent doing lots of legs a day. And mostly point to point, not hub and spoke pairings, but again that varies with base.

Once again, you are flat out wrong.

Read. Your. Contract.

Seriously? Did you read anything? They are shooting for January 2020 PBS launch date. 1 year to implement

The NC mentioned at the roadshows they would try to get it implemented by late summer, that might be what the poster was referencing. Will it happen that quickly? With the inevitable arbitration I doubt it.

Well he did read the rogue letter, remember, he called the cops.

I thought they said that the PBS implementation process would start over the summer. Considering that CBA implementation won’t start winding down until May or June at the earliest, I would bet we are looking at early spring of 2020 before we go live.

Not a junior base, but with regards to Denver, how long is upgrade to CA? I’ve heard anywhere from 8-15 years. I realize things could change with a boost in hiring, but what can someone reasonably expect in today’s outlook?

Living in Denver, I’m trying to get a better picture of the pay scale and the likelihood of commuting for CA.

Thanks

Most Junior DEN Captain hire date 10/14/13

Curve is extremely steep from there. If you move up just 10 numbers and look at 10 from the bottom, that hire date is 03/05/07. Most of the Captains senior to that are from Denver and not going anywhere.

In other words, plan on a Denver upgrade being close to your retirement date.

Good Luck

I got the impression they wanted to accelerate the timeline and implement PBS before the soft deadline but I may have misheard. I do agree that we will likely be well into next year before everything is finalized.

I wish they would have taken an extra month or two to finalize the language before we voted. Just have a feeling we’re going to get bit badly with the “arbitrator shall consider Frontier’s operational requirements” clause in the LOA.

That’s what I was afraid of.

Thanks!

I think it all depends on how large or small the Den domicile is in the future. If they shrink Denver, the upgrade time will be very long, but if they were to grow it, the upgrade time will shorten a lot I think. So many of the guys hired in the last few years are not folks from denver like nearly all frontier pilots were years ago.

In my new hire class, all of us were Coloradoans. Every one of us. Today, classes are definitely not like that. So I think we are kind of right on the line of where the seniority is to hold Denver captain. Is it 5 years or 10 years basically. With the current domicile size (260ish crews) the junior captain is 5 years, but it was 10 years just a few months ago. If they grow Denver, it'll stay in the 5 year range, but if they shrink it, it'll jump all the way to 10+ years to hold it.

Hopefully that makes sense. It's all because from 2007 to 2013 we didn't hire any pilots.

You are missing a part, you're not taking into account the large amount of captains living in Denver and choosing to commute to Orlando, Chicago, and Vegas. I'd put that at another 50-80 guys. They commute to hold a line, as soon as things look better in Denver they'll be going right back.

Ghostrider got it right, sure the most junior guy is a 13' hire but 10 guys up the list and its 07'. They will need to grow Denver to the 400+ crew size to see any notable shrinkage in upgrade time there and that is not realistic at this point. Even if they did that, the upgrade time shrinkage would be momentary as the list is stagnant. Expect 2 more bases like the company has said, and expect them right around 100 crews as they have also mentioned. Denver will likely stay the size it is for the foreseeable future. As retirements happen commuters will go back, and even without shrinking Denver I'd expect the time to hold CA there will slowly increase.

I appreciate the feedback

Gary is probably right.

Denver is always going to be very senior on the Captain side. No doubt

Hey guys, I'm starting class with Frontier next month. I'm really looking to hold LAS as my base. Realistically, is that an option right off the bat? Or do I need to plan on spending a few months in PHL. Thanks for your input!

Junior LAS is an 11/2018 hire. You probably won’t get it in your initial bid but likely before you finish IOE or a month after. If we keep upgrading 20/month any base is within reach quickly.

With that being said- how long to move off reserve in LAS or any of the other bases as well?

Hard to say. Short call reserve in most bases historically has been 6 or so months in a base like LAS to a year or more in a base like ORD. These are dropping currently and with 1-2 more bases said to be opening in 2019 chances are that will drop even more if you’re willing to go to a junior base.

Thank you for your info! Really helps with the planning.

Holding any base and a line will come quick as long as the hiring and upgrades continue. They have been known to lie about hiring (basically every year I’ve been here honestly) but with the plane delivery schedule I think they’ll actually have to be truer to their word about their hiring needs finally.

Reserves
 

Hi folks
I'm heading to Denver for the March class but would like to sort some logisitics out beforehand. I live about 2hrs drive from PHL.
Does anyone have a sense of how much Reserves are being used. I know the base is brand new; LAS details are helpful too. Are new hires sitting around struggling to consolidate; run ragged or a random scattering of everything. Is there much Open Time in PHL or LAS?
Any feedback much appreciated!
Cheers
//PL

As of this very moment, in PHL, there are 11 open trips and very very few FOs on reserve. I think some soon to graduate FOs are headed to Philly.

Generally, FOs don't fly all that much on rsv here as most of the FOs are on probation and don't call in sick much and don't have much vacation time. I'd say flying 35 hours on rsv is fairly average, but since Philly is so new, there is no average. I expect Philly to grow rapidly in the near term.

A 2 hour drive is kind of a tough spot to be. Short call would be like being a firefighter in the station. Medium or long call is cake of course.

Just pointing out, to ward off any confusion, there is no medium call reserve anymore.

RSV
 

Thank you!

Can anyone provide the upgrade times per Domicile?

Most interested in LAS upgrade time since I would be commuting from SoCal.

May 2015 hire is the junior LAS CA......