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Spirit/Frontier Merger (Again)

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Old 10-27-2024 | 02:28 PM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
ALPA doesn't strictly prohibit staple, but in extreme case the rules might allow something that looks similar. NK is not there yet by a long shot, right now it looks like NB on NB with (I assume) similar longevity distribution so more like a zipper.

While career expectations count, that's hard to quantify as far as the company finances and future prospects, so it probably doesn't get weighted much. We're learning this stuff over at AS.
Any furloughed pilots will be effectively stapeled. In UAL/CAL the furloughees caused 1998 UAL hires to be merged with 2006 CAL hires and most of the 1998 hires had never even been furloughed. Furloughing drags down the active flying pilots lower on the status and category list, so any furlough at either airline will have a devastating effect on the SLI, even if they are furloughed just a few days before the Merger is Completed (independent of merger announcement date)
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Old 10-27-2024 | 02:32 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by Aeronaut55
I could be wrong, but I don't see Airbus typed guys willing to sign a $60,000 two year contract, especially with the legacies resuming hiring after the 1st.
United is hiring now. I'm sure Delta and American are as well. United only had a 6 week pause this summer which we do most years to give new hire staff a break. Planning on 2,000+ hires in 2025 as well. Lots of jobs for pilots who want to make a move.
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Old 10-28-2024 | 05:23 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by Chimpy
Interesting. I would think with Nk Selling $500M worth of A/C they may be able to fend off BK, but I have no idea how any of this works (clearly, lol).
Never look back chimp. Blue skies ahead.
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Old 10-28-2024 | 05:43 PM
  #124  
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Originally Posted by FriendlyPilot
The BK only has one major Creditor, who would likely fully control the process, unlike a bankruptcy where different creditors can vote. If the single creditor (that is owed $3B with $1.2B due in less than a year) isn't agreeing to change the terms of their debts out of bankruptcy, the court isn't going to magically wipe them out. Also these senior secured notes are "secured" by assets. The creditor can ask for their agreement to be honored, and the collateralized assets sold and the bonds paid including the future interest that would have been owed.

CH 11 isn't a do over. 60%-90% of companies that enter Chapter 11 bankruptcy never exit.
The collateral on the $1.2b is the frequent flier program. It’s not worth anything today. We aren’t talking about the delta sky miles program
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Old 10-28-2024 | 07:14 PM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by FriendlyPilot
The BK only has one major Creditor, who would likely fully control the process, unlike a bankruptcy where different creditors can vote. If the single creditor (that is owed $3B with $1.2B due in less than a year) isn't agreeing to change the terms of their debts out of bankruptcy, the court isn't going to magically wipe them out. Also these senior secured notes are "secured" by assets. The creditor can ask for their agreement to be honored, and the collateralized assets sold and the bonds paid including the future interest that would have been owed.

CH 11 isn't a do over. 60%-90% of companies that enter Chapter 11 bankruptcy never exit.
Spirit has twelve different debt offerings outstanding and those bonds are owned by hundreds of different entities/individuals/funds. Of the twelve outstanding, only one is secured and it is not secured by any asset it is secured by the frequent flyer program which is essentially worthless the minute they file bk. The other bond holders are already trying numerous tactics to try and latch onto anything and everything that may still have value, but they will fail. The only thing worse than being an unsecured creditor in BK is being a common stockholder. The BK judge has very little if any interest in making any unsecured creditor whole. That is the risk you take when you lend money, default risk. There is always an unsecured creditors committeein Ch 11 , and they fight for the scraps that are left over, and not much is left over.
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Old 10-28-2024 | 09:11 PM
  #126  
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Originally Posted by FriendlyPilot
Any furloughed pilots will be effectively stapeled. In UAL/CAL the furloughees caused 1998 UAL hires to be merged with 2006 CAL hires and most of the 1998 hires had never even been furloughed. Furloughing drags down the active flying pilots lower on the status and category list, so any furlough at either airline will have a devastating effect on the SLI, even if they are furloughed just a few days before the Merger is Completed (independent of merger announcement date)
Yes, I said that previously, current furloughd pilots get stapled below all active pilots.
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Old 11-12-2024 | 01:59 PM
  #127  
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https://www.reuters.com/business/aer...ts-2024-11-12/

It’s over. Spirit is on their own.
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Old 11-12-2024 | 02:03 PM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by Stayontarget
https://www.reuters.com/business/aer...ts-2024-11-12/

It’s over. Spirit is on their own.
Meh, ain’t over til the fat lady (or CEO) sings. Maybe just an attempt to get better deal post bankruptcy?
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Old 11-12-2024 | 02:18 PM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by Broing
Meh, ain’t over til the fat lady (or CEO) sings. Maybe just an attempt to get better deal post bankruptcy?
well there you go, he sung!

https://youtu.be/DbyFM6xtN0E
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Old 11-12-2024 | 02:19 PM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by Halon1211
well there you go, he sung!

https://youtu.be/DbyFM6xtN0E
Teddyroll’d
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