Frontier Surviving?
 

I saw that Frontier pulled its Expedia relationship.

Frontier Airlines pulls its flights off Expedia

Is Frontier turning the corner or is this a bad sign?:confused:

I think AA pulled their flights off Expedia or Orbitz when they were in a dispute, but I dont know if Frontier has the power to survive without listing on those sites.

Republic is all about saving money, they will do what ever they can to save money even if it means less revenue (such as this deal). They run the cheapest operation possible.

I would have to guess that Spirit is cheaper. They just joined expedia for what its worth.

You are 100% correct. We are the cheapest operation running. So cheap that they won't pay KCM, EFB, or any other perk you can think of....but on the other hand we do make some sweet cash.

The Frontier NAME will survive after AS buys them and rebrands the operation.

What's the point of making sweet cash if they won't reinvest it into the airline and its employees, for more efficiency (which is really what KCM and EFB is).

Really? Really??? I would say reinvesting it, in the form of 2 brand new simulators and several new aircraft would be a form of reinvesting in the airline. nice try.:rolleyes:

It's not considered investing if you don't own it right? They have no equity built in most if their current fleet.

Aircraft are leased, not owned. Where are these 2 simulators? In the Spirit HQs, a location owned by Spirit elsewhere, or in the Airbus MIA facility?

Pretty sure RAH did pay for KCM and is paying for EFB's on the Shuttle cert. But yes, overall they are cheap.

I am not sure I am following this logic. The company is taking profits, and in turn, using them to expand the fleet and training department. The fact that the company does not hold equity in new aircraft is a moot point. Spirit is using profits to expand the operation. These things are not being paid for with pixie dust.

The sims should be up and running in FLL next month. And yes, it is a sham that we dont have KCM, and Ipads are a lot nicer then lugging around a flight bag.... But that is another discussion... Getting back on point, good luck to everyone at Frontier!!!

Without Expedia, could be tough finding a Frontier flight from DEN to SEA on:

Orbitz
Travelocity
Kayak
Priceline
TravelZoo
Hotwire
CheapTickets
AlaskaAir (that's for Moby)
etc

Not sure who else does this, but at Spirit if you purchase a ticket on Expedia Orbitz or the like, you will pay more. Spirit adds in a fee for not booking directly through the Spirit website to cover the cost that they have to pay said company.

About Frontier...
 

Can we get back to the thread...the future of Frontier...sheesh:confused:

About as safe as a high school girl keeping her virginity on prom night.

Mike, glad to see u back on

Frontier doesn't have a future. Thats why nobody is talking about it.

Don't forget the main one: flyfrontier.com which incidently is where they are striving to drive a majority of their bookings.
Also Frontier just reported a hefty profit for the 4th quarter and full year 2012 relative to YOY results. Not going away soon for all the haters. Sorry.

Frontier will merge with either JetBlue, Spirit, or Virgin America. ;)

You guys still really think BB is actually going to sell/spin them off?!

He only said that to appease mainline f9. Great now he's made a forward looking statement... That was easy.

Why sell a company you've invested nearly $200 mil in only to sell them off when they return to profitability?

Unless he personally invested himself into the airline and has artificially held the stock down to sell to a street loved company at the right time and cash in..... Ok, so he might sell them. :rolleyes:

Here's what most of you guys haven't even thought about. The biggest problem with spinning them off or selling them is the pilot group. The F9 pilots are no longer Frontier pilots. They are RAH pilots on 1 seniority list represented by the IBT. Bedford fought with the FAPA pilots to keep them separate from the RAH pilots.

So now maybe some Front.....errr i mean Republic A320 pilots can explain to me how they would separate them from the seniority list. IBT isn't going to let them split up the pilots so that only the Airbus pilots get to escape. So then Bedford would sell off 'assets' like a garage sale. HOLY CRAP HES ALREADY DOING THAT!

So how could he "spin"off Frontier then. Not possible then?

If he shuts Frontier down, the Frontier pilots, now in the RAH IBT list would have to chose a seat in one of the RAH regionals?

Eeek, what a mess.

RP has always been a company that thrives on chaos. Just ask the pilot group now with their contract negotiations. A painful lesson the F9 pilots had to learn the hard way.

Bedford could have 'spun off' or 'sell off' Frontier if the pilots were separate. Not the case anymore. Why do you think there has not been a buyer or merger with anyone. Southwest, Spirit, or even Allegiant don't want in on them. Why buy into a mess when you can just sit back and wait for F9 to just die off in Bedfords fire sale.

As for the Republic A320 pilots, start getting use to hearing this from your passengers. "Oh wow it's such a small plane".

Total flame bait! Let's see how your theory plays out!

I'm so sorry you feel that way Bolo. I have no intention of baiting any flames here. We all have friends in every airline and F9 is no exception. However I have had the displeasure of fighting Bedford and Heller the pilot anti-christ. You guys are new to the fight there at RP. Remember when that snake announced on national TV that you guys are going to get your 10% raise back and all the wages you've lost over the years? How did that work out?

Don't tell me you haven't received the latest message from the IBT? The NMB has pretty much said bend over and take it like a *****. Bedford is sitting in his mansion with his 8 kids laughing his ass off at all you guys.

Again I sympathize with everyone of you stuck there at RP. Especially the old Midwest pilots. Believe me I would love for the outcome to be good. But my many years of experience there has me believing that the Frontier name will go away soon and all the Republic A320 pilots will get absorbed into the system.

However you have to admit my last comment about the passengers was funny :)

All I can say now is Good Luck to you all and may god have mercy on your airplanes.

Oh they'll survive!!

Harlem Shake Frontier Flight 157 (CC Wasabi Ultimate) - YouTube

Another mainline airline buying Frontier in its current state means the buyer might get forced into taking a bunch of RJ pilots who are not trained on any equipment the buyer operates, and some of the RJ pilots may feel entitled to get integrated into the buyer's seniority list able to hold Captain! For another mainline carrier to buy Frontier would be an instant way to start a war with the current pilots - an expensive war.

The impediment to shedding Frontier for Bedford isn't in his own company (those costs are going to have to be dealt with on his balance sheet as part of buying Frontier), its trying to sell such a toxic asset to another company.

What assets does Frontier have that could make inheriting a seniority mess worth it? Does RAH have any LGA or DCA slots that could be thrown in to sweeten the deal?

Sniper you are so right. Pretty much what i've been saying. Bedford has already announced shedding 700 jobs system wide and they have already started selling off assets such as ground equipment. Im sure gates will be next. F9 has two gates in LGA. They are looking to shed those as well after talking to a F9 manager in LGA.

I certainly hope others here do not confuse what we are saying is not an attempt to attack the fine pilots over there. However I think there are still some pilots there that are delusional to think everything is going to be ok over there. The fact is, Bedford is not keeping it a secret that he wants to get rid of the Frontier brand and go back to doing what he knows best. Flying rjs for the majors.

going to Spirit

Please elaborate. What is going to Spirit?

We have had some Frontier pilots come to Spirit, and we're looking to expand in some markets, so, I could see us looking at some of Frontier's assets, especially ORD or LGA. We're pretty cheap, though, so I don't see us getting in a bidding war with Southwest, UA, AA/US, and Delta for anything Frontier owns.

I'm not hoping for a Frontier demise, just trying to offer some input on Spirit as it relates to Frontier. Spirit serves DEN already, and I can't see Spirit wanting to roll in hot on United and Southwest in DEN. I'd much rather see Frontier succeed, as long as it doesn't hurt Spirit. Best of luck, Frontier guys.

CNBC reporting Frontier Airlines will be investigated by FAA for "Harlem Shake" video. Doh!

CNN link, but I saw the story on CNBC:

http://www.cnn.com/2013/03/01/travel...faa/index.html

My favorite part of the story is this little nugget:

Dancing is a bad idea even on the ground, said Veda Shook, president of the Association of Flight Attendants.

Separating the IMSL isn't impossible, and your first paragraph is factually inaccurate.

No one can definitively say how this will play out, but I will tell you this much...we are going to see it attempted very soon.

Finally, the IBT has backed themselves into an un-winnable situation. They can either leave us alone and lose the property they never actually one or they can pursue their continues vendetta against the Frontier pilots and end up on the receiving end of an epic DFR litigation. They are already guilty of DFR, the only thing left is "harm".

oh no you dit-ent!!!

Yea seriously..........I would say what? 90% of new hire classes at Majors are "RJ pilots"

Not a problem. Using the sale of Pan Am's Pacific division as a precedent, only the pilots currently holding A320 base positions could be sent to a new carrier with the F9 assets.

You may be too young to remember this, but there was a flurry of bidding to the whale when the UAL/PAA deal was going down. Anyone who wants to escape RAH needs to bid the A320 immediately.

The arguments supporting the separation of Frontier pilots is much stronger than the Pan Am precedent, but since you brought it up.....

No one at "RAH" can bid the airbus. Only Frontier pilots can bid for Airbus Vacancies.

Then, there you go. In a sale/merger F9 pilots have a very strong argument that they should go with the planes and other F9 assets.

You are right, I am too young to remember that. And I can admit when I'm wrong. There may be a way out of the IBT for you guys and I hope it works out. But being a successful RP defector, I can only go by the history I had when I was there. If there was a suitor for the sale of F9, wouldn't it have happened by now? I don't and will never trust Bedford. He is a religious zealot that spews lies out of his mouth.

I don't see a bright future for the RP airbus pilots. I'm sorry but that is just how I feel. I only hope to his god that I'm wrong.