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FollowMe 01-05-2020 10:42 AM


Originally Posted by BoilerUP (Post 2951644)

This post is States Exhibit 1 in why this forum needs a like feature or upvoting!

Baradium 01-05-2020 11:04 AM


Originally Posted by Unicornpilot (Post 2951666)
CBreezy,

Which fact I have written in this topic is inaccurate? People want the links and public information, which I have provided. Everything I have written is available on the Internet and is a fact.

Can you point to one comment I have written that is not a fact and backed up by a public source?

You still haven't responded to my observation that you say a higher retirement age is a solution for poor pilot training rather than any thought of better pilot training or initial hire requirements.

Unicornpilot 01-05-2020 11:09 AM


Originally Posted by BoilerUP (Post 2951726)
Because ICAO has not announced an increase in mandatory retirement age like it did in November 2006, the FAA has not announced an increase in mandatory retirement age like it did in December 2006, NS EASA's own commissioned study in the topic last year recommended maintaining its current maximum age of 65?

The conclusions you are drawing from the "publicly available information" simply don't jive with, well, the publicly available information you cite.

The "drone pilot" nonsense is little more than a red herring.

You're connecting dots like a caller on Coast to Coast...

Yes, the independent review did recommend the age remain at age 65, but ICAO, the FAA, and the other bodies are moving forward with the age change.

Go to the link below and look at slide 3-, 31, & 32 on ICAO's website from the May 7, 2019 meeting/presentation.

https://www.icao.int/safety/aviation...%20Study_c.pdf

FACT - These slides specifically state:

FACT - A reduction of the maximum monthly/yearly FTL to 80% of the maximum allowed for pilots over 65 performing CAT multi pilot operations (see presentation).

FACT - Development of options based on the feedback from the Workshop and Medical Examiner Group (MEG), etc.

FACT - The parties will work closely with ICAO and the International Authorities on the future steps to (simultaneously) coordinate (worldwide) actions.

FACT - EASA high-level decision - Impact assessment will be consulted with EASA Advisory Bodies.

FACT - Further feedback from the advisory bodies on the way forward.

FACT - Regulatory activities (to increase the mandatory CAT multi engine age) in congruence with the (aeromedical) decision.

Drone pilots are coming. I guess you know more than the FAA, Boeing, and Airbus who have invested billions of dollars in this program, which begins testing this year.

Unicornpilot 01-05-2020 11:15 AM


Originally Posted by Baradium (Post 2951740)
You still haven't responded to my observation that you say a higher retirement age is a solution for poor pilot training rather than any thought of better pilot training or initial hire requirements.

The reason is having more experienced pilots who have had better training and are more seasoned is an obvious answer. This a partial solution to the problem. There is not enough training devices and resources to manage the problem.

The pilots being developed today do not have the real time in aircraft experience as those pilots trained 39-40 years ago. To suggest otherwise is nonsense.

Airlines cannot train any more pilots any faster. Their simulators are running 24/7 and they cannot contract more. It takes 2 years to build a simulator and that does not solve the problem.

International companies who want to fly into the United States are putting pilots in Boeing and Airbus aircraft with 300 hours total time.

The Lions Air and Ethiopian Airlines accidents was a wake up call.

The retirement age is changing and the bills have already been created for a change in the U.S., which is simply waiting for ICAO's final work.

airlinegypsy 01-06-2020 03:11 PM

Perhaps we should allow pilots to work over 65 as long as they are only in the left seat of a narrow body or even an RJ to help mentor all these new pilots! (Sarcasm is high)


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threeighteen 01-07-2020 03:54 AM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2951545)
If you read the summary at the end, the author makes the case that aircraft should be designed to be more easily flown a la the Airbus model (or even easier than that).

A Boeing VP pretty much eluded to the same thing in an interview a year or so ago.

Basically, make flying easier via computer software like Airbus (but even more automated) and you won't have to worry so much about how skilled pilots are anymore. The key phrase is "reducing the cognitive load".

DARPA has spent tens of millions of taxpayer dollars integrating software into commercial aircraft and helicopters to make them flyable with just a tablet and zero stick and rudder skills for example.

I realize this is a complete departure from how aircraft are designed and operated in the past and currently.

The problem with trying to making airplanes easier to fly is that it creates dumber pilots which then can't respond to basic system failures such as a trim runaway (MCAS issues) or frozen pitot tubes (AF 447).

The departure from the philosophy of designing airplanes to be flown by humans and to instead have computers fly them is what is causing the new wave of safety issues.

Name User 01-07-2020 06:43 AM


Originally Posted by threeighteen (Post 2952841)
The problem with trying to making airplanes easier to fly is that it creates dumber pilots which then can't respond to basic system failures such as a trim runaway (MCAS issues) or frozen pitot tubes (AF 447).

The departure from the philosophy of designing airplanes to be flown by humans and to instead have computers fly them is what is causing the new wave of safety issues.

Statistics say we are much safer even with the occasional failure and crash.

There have been non fatal crashes recently caused by pilot error such as the 777 Asiana in SFO. Pilots make a ton of errors every day that the system captures either due to slop or technology. TCAS, GPWS, controllers noticing, etc.

rickair7777 01-07-2020 11:03 AM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2952934)
Statistics say we are much safer even with the occasional failure and crash.

There have been non fatal crashes recently caused by pilot error such as the 777 Asiana in SFO. Pilots make a ton of errors every day that the system captures either due to slop or technology. TCAS, GPWS, controllers noticing, etc.

The flip side of that is automation also makes errors (or just plain clicks off) which pilots correct without even thinking much about it. Current aircraft could in no way begin to function autonomously.

threeighteen 01-07-2020 03:16 PM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2952934)
Statistics say we are much safer even with the occasional failure and crash.

There have been non fatal crashes recently caused by pilot error such as the 777 Asiana in SFO. Pilots make a ton of errors every day that the system captures either due to slop or technology. TCAS, GPWS, controllers noticing, etc.

Contributing to pilot error was over-reliance on automation, but "landing short" in SFO also seems to a right of passage among far-east carriers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Airlines_Flight_2


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