So much for "industry leading" pairings.
 

First pairings under the new rules and the union puts out a warning email....

What’s a pairing...

They never said industry leading pairings.

They said industry leading paring language. Which it is.

The reality is the company was taking over the pairing build with or without the CBA. We secured protections in the cba we wouldn’t have otherwise.


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Awesome! Winning!

Triple face-palm.

Glad I bid RSV in October...I'm sure many will now by choice. On the 190 side I'm not sure how they could get worse, but we'll see. We already have plenty of 4 leg days with 2 hour plus sits in them.

This next month is going to be terrible. Why anyone has any faith in this company or cba is sad... the first time this new cba has its chance to show the industry leading language it has, it fails miserably.

I've heard the pairings are bad. But "bad" is a relative term, depending on what each person wants. Unless it's more SDQ/STI/POS then it's horrific....

Supposedly, most high-powered 1 days are gone, and most 15hr 3 days are built into 4/5 day trips.

What email? What does it say?

edit- and where are you seeing these pairings? I didn't think they were up until the 1st of the month?

I get **** trips already... I guess I'll wait and see how much ****tier they will get.

The 1 day high powered pairings gone and 15 hour 2-leg 3 days built into 4-5 day trips is exactly what I'm expecting.

I agree, the beauty of any individual pairing is in the eye of the beholder... One mans trash is in fact another man's treasure.

The company was gonna take the reins on this CBA or no CBA.

What could possibly go wrong with a 8:40 hr block 4leg east coast day?

*5 leg

......

This is comical too. How do they think they’re gonna fit 5 legs into a 12.5hr day or less?

October is gonna be an epic irop of biblical proportions without a cloud in the sky.

You got that right. Glad I have vacation.

I’m guessing something like BOS-JFK-IAD-JFK-BUF-BOS. What could go wrong with that??

Wait until the LGB and MCO boys and girls see their pairings....

I would love this! I’ll get paid to not fly more than usual. Good thing I have my emergency assignments all filled up!

You know they will max everything out with very little buffers so they can hire as little as possible. Heck this month I had 3 reserve assignments that will not be legal on September 1st. There is no way they won’t f this up and yet nobody will be held responsible.

Hmmm. We had this neat thing negotiated, called a CBA. You'd think they would have maybe addressed this issue with some industry standard (some have, some don't) language, like pilots will CONTINUE to build the pairings - just like they have been.

Ya know, when all this "Industry leading pairing language" malarky was being thrown irresponsibly around, I pretty much assumed it meant that we were re-assuming the responsibility of building the pairings ourselves.

Without that ability, the language is meaningless and worthless. Putting extreme outer boundaries on the ********y things ********y people can do to us by treating us like ****** is not exactly something to celebrate as "industry-leading".

AND YES: I did emphasize that pilots building pairings was one of my top priorities in all surveys and communications with reps.

As a life-long union member, I am sorry to say that ALPA totally screwed the pooch on this issue.

Name 3 airlines that let pilots build the Pairings. I’ll wait.


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Glad I voted No for this horrible contract. 78% are to blame for their RJ mentality and defeatism.

Have you seen the pairings yet? Where are they?

You want a hanky? :rolleyes:

In the toilet.

No, we want a good contract. Guess that’s asking too much.

Nothing would have made us happy Navy. An October pairing hasnt even been published and its armageddon already?
What did you expect? They cant even cater airplanes. :D

This entire discussion has ZERO to do with the cba.

The pairing protections in our CBA are absolutely industry leading. Full stop.

Now if you think the company taking over the pairing build and just the general adjustment to the new CBA will take a while for everyone to figure out, then yes I agree with you. Will there be a few months of growing pains on the companies side AND our side? Of course.

Good deals went away, new good deals will arise. Seniority strategies will adjust and everyone will settle into the new rules.

New rules, new game to be figured out.


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what are some of these pairing protections that are "industry leading?"

Max connect times
Max segments
No more duty periods than days
Commutable pairing requirements(no one has these)
Pairing distribution(huge, no one else has this)
AVL(affects pairing build)
TLV restrictions(changes pairing build)
Min duty AND min day both
New day at 0100(best by a long shot)

All of these thing have an affect on what types of pairings the company builds.




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It’s not letting me edit for some reason. That’s only some of them.

Hours of service.
Red eye protections

I’m sure there is more I can’t even think of right now.


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[MENTION=1326]RiddleEagle18[/MENTION]

It sounds like you have some really good stuff in there. Could you provide some of the numbers, context and simplified detail? For instance, max connect times, there is a big difference between 1.5 hours and 3 hours.

As an outside observer "industry leading pairing language" sounds a lot like "who needs trip rigs anyway". Is that about right?

Go to Flica..."view pairings" and you can take a look at your base/seat's pairings for October.

No we’re pretty rigged:

1:2 Duty
1:3.5 TAFB
5 hour average duty period
5 hour average day
Plus some night stuff

What are your observations? I won't be able to look until possibly Tuesday or Wednesday.

It actually doesn't look that bad. The old 10 hr 3 days appear unchanged. I was concerned about them being "nested". There are some different pairings than before but nothing struck me as any worse/better than before.

The 5hr calender day rig is missing so you will have to submit for those. It seems like fewer 2 days but that could be my imagination.

Almost like those pairing construction rules added nothing to the pilots. But I know that can't be true. ALPA was hopping up and down over how great they were.

Overall I think it definitely needs work. The 190 has a lot of 3-4 legs days and even some 5 leg days thrown in there. (I only found one pairing where you operate all 5 legs). Winter IROP's will be fun. Airbus guys can speak for themselves about their pairings.

Maybe that's why all the BOS 190 CA's who negotiated our CBA bid onto the bus...

I tried this and failed. What’s the trick?

I can only get to sept 30

Disregard... found it under trade board

Type in the date

10/01/18

Or 01OCT


You can’t click view all pairings. They won’t show. Have to do it by individual date.


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I never use the mobile Flica...try the desktop version.

"View or Print Pairings"
"Pairing and/or Date"
"10/1 etc...