Loa 9
 

Discuss.
How many pilots are actually 63 and over on property?
COLA aimed at Mil guys/gals? Anyone else bite?
Can only assume that the F word is the next step.

Depends on if JB takes the grants. If they do, they can't furlough through Sep 30th.

I think there are 68 will be 63 by Jul 31, a handful of whom are management or on medical leaves of absence.

I’m bidding for it. Hoping they will give it to
me. Love to get it for the next 30 years.

You have access to the SL, right? 61 as of today, I believe. 68 by July.

7 others turn 63 before July 31st and are eligible.

Sorry, this doesn’t save the day by any means. Hypothetically if all 68 take it it saves them 23.8 million over 2 years. That’s with a modest 350k total compensation per pilot that takes it. Not everyone is at the top of the list.

I was optimistic at the beginning of this whole thing. Not so much anymore.

Sorry bud, your math is WAY off.

It will save less than a fraction of a fraction of a percentage of $23.8 million.

oh yah I think that’s what I meant. I mean basically it’s what you said I just said it in my own way.

Filllllerrr

Ah! You said over *2* years!

I'm so dumber at public maffs and readings.

You dun good.

I mean basically what I said is... it’s basically kind not really helpful really. forget the 7 am math problems.

68 people. I cannot imagine more than 30 people taking it. I don’t see the benefit in this at all. Save a few pennies? We’ve been steeping over dollars for
years.

also, a COLA? Did I miss the part of when they didn’t fill all the 50 hour incentive lines? Did I miss the memo of why they didn’t fill them all? And now they expect people to go away without being paid? Why are we just copying and pasting what AA did?

Read your contract our CBA it's different that AA CBA. What does AA even have to do with us? Knowledge is power. It's called furlough mitigation. They are following the contract.

JMO, They should have offered it to anyone with 10 or 12 years or more on property with an irrevocable letter of resignation to be paid out for 24 months at 50hrs.

I think they'd have a lot more offers to bounce out.

They’re doing everything they can to save money. It all adds up. If you have any better ideas, the company is literally asking for your suggestions. So tell them.

What’s a furlough?

Get off your high horse bub. And yes this is identical to what AA offered to their employees. You think 68 people are going to keep you off the street, you’re delusional. So yah. I get it. Follow the CBA. But I think we can get a little more creative when it comes to mitigating furloughs other than offering just over 1% early retirement.

Maybe drop that number to 60 or look at how they can come up with a reasonable % vs and age range.

No, it’s not everything they can to save money.
Like posted above, read YOUR CBA. Maybe start paying attention to Section 23.

They literally employee folks with advanced mathematics degrees. You think they haven’t done the math?
You think they’re gonna pay pilots at the top of the pay scale FIVE YEARS of 50 hour credit lines to do nothing in order to save a few furloughs?? You’re the delusional one.

They are following the CBA. They are going to do what they believe is best for the COMPANY. Not the individual pilots.

This is all it is plain and simple, it’s the next step in the process; they are holding that Govt $ as leverage until they squeeze the most out of the pilot group, to then say “you know what we don’t want that $ anyway” and bam furlough anyway those bastards!

Maybe credit caps to start. Amazing how many VDAS and prem trips went out last month. People crediting over 150 hours while reserves stayed at home.

I wonder why we skipped over that part of whatever section 23 is, and maybe whatever rsv periods means and maybe whatever that part time award thing means.

So yeah they are stepping over dollars to pick up pennies. They are not doing EVERYTHING they can to save money. It also says something about it not being limited to whatever section 23 is.

So maybe stop the individual greed. 0 hours/50 hours/75 hours. Open time is blocked or not blocked but everyone is capped at 75 hours. No VDA no Prem. 35 hours part time lines.

So either our cash flow problem hasn’t been that dire or maybe we all should expect to be on the street.

I think if they wanted more, they would have just dropped the age to 62/61/60 etc. Dropping the age down to 60 would yield about 200 people who are eligible. But, if they just offer a relative handful as part of 23.A...then they checked that box and can move on to the other items in 23.A. Or maybe they offer more later once there’s more clarity on the peak/recovery.

lol dude. You comment about how they are not doing everything to save money, then attack me for saying that the early retirement isn’t enough???? My minds blown

I'm sorry, you feel personally attacked? Wow, how hurtful that must have been when I said they are following the contract. Do we have an APC safe space we can have you sit in for a while. I'd hate to further "attack" you for simply posting my opinions.

And I must say, your mind is blown pretty easily. That or you just have really poor reading comprehension or the ability to grasp the obvious.

For your sake, and to ensure I'm not attacking you, I'll succinctly rephrase my opinion on what is happening:
The company is not doing everything they can to save money, with particular emphasis on how/what they offering pilots. This is intentional, as they are simply checking the boxes of Section 23. This enables them the ability to furlough. THAT is ultimately the way they will save the most money.

/end of attack

Thats why I’m afraid that a Jetblue pilot furloughed will be spending a long time on the sidelines.

lol

So, basically you still agree that not enough is being done?

What I have been saying all along.
And that it's purposeful. And that they aren't going to do more. They are going to follow the CBA.
Believe me, I don't want to be furloughed (again).
If you have some wonderful ideas, they are currently appealing to you to tell them.

So pretty much $160,000/yr to F off. I’d be in in a second. Only 20 yrs off.

Yea ok buddy. The company is desperate to save money every every way they can. If you find something in the CBA that would help reduce costs, make the MEC aware of it. Make the company aware of it instead of trying to be an APC hero.

The last thing I am trying to be is an "APC hero". Im just saying the company is following the CBA. And they are doing that so that they can furlough per the CBA. Again, my opinion.
And I hope I'm wrong.

High horse? Felt why are you giving concessions? You don't get it. We have a contract. They have plenty of money they can save within the confines of this contract and running more efficiently. This contract was smartly built with good times and bad times in mind. How about you just fly airplanes and not give away the farm....for nothing...

I get it man. Emotions are running high...for all of us. If you asked me 2 weeks ago, I was certain we’d be looking at a furlough in the not too distant future; however, today I don’t believe a furlough is going to happen here for a number of reasons. We, as a company, just need to tighten up, and I believe we’ll be alright.

concessions? Did you read section 23 bub?

You seem worried. I don't think, if it's needed, that these were the last solutions or the last LOA.

PLEASE REMAIN CALM.

If anyone is picking up extra flying while pilots are on the street, they have a very punchable face.

Loa 9
 

The list in section 23 isn’t in order. It’s basically suggestions and actually leaves more options available than just what’s written.

We aren’t even close to furloughs yet. Reduced alv and credit caps next if they are even needed.

The company is still thinking this all ends by late summer and demand returns to a reasonable level.


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I really wanted the E190 CA VIL for April but they only awarded 5. My gut vibe said this thing peaks and stalls by the end of April and we’re scaling back up after that. Big issue is going to be commuting in May it seems. I don’t want to have to show 2 days early. Guess I’ll bid the May VIL but I’m bottom 25% so unlikely to get it.

May is going to be awesome. i can just feel it...:)

this can’t be said enough.

I am sure it’s all being vetted through LSC. It’s all negotiable with ALPA and I am sure we haven’t seen the last LOA in regards to this pandemic. Credit caps wouldn’t be enough to make a big difference, just like early retirements won’t. Without bookings coming back in May/June we will all have to start dusting off our resumes. Until then credit all you can put money in the bank and try not to stress out too much.