Could it be that JetBlue's strategy to wait is to avoid getting more mired in the P&W mess?

No, we’ll double down and buy NK’s grounded planes. It’s too risky for a triple down though.

This post makes me want to laugh, and cry.

You are correct, I couldn't remember the entirety of what she said, but you are close.

If the truth was as simple as helping Airbus with their backlog, or that it helped other airlines get their deliveries sooner, she could have just said so.

Hypothetical:

Analyst: "how were you able to get Airbus to agree to the deferrals without paying a penalty"?

CFO (hypothetical): "Airbus has a great many customers that want their deliveries sooner and Airbus has a very large backlog, this was mutually beneficial".

But she didn't say that, and very much acted as though she didn't want to continue that discussion one bit.

But we will know one way or the other when the press release comes out, whoever that may be.

Hopefully folks realize the “P&W mess” only applies to certain year groups of the GTF engine.

Ursula was definitley cautious around that questioning. I wouldn't be surprised if - by deferring deliveries - they achieved additions savings on future deliveries. I'm just a line pilot so I'm not all that smart, but I definitely picked up how she seemed to get uncomfortable.

I was unaware of that, thanks. Google, wow!

For anyone else as disconnected as myself, I copied this from cranky flier...

"Pratt had discovered an issue with contaminated powdered metal used in manufacturing between Q4 2015 and and Q3 2021 that could cause cracking in the stage 1 and stage 2 disks in the high pressure turbine. These obviously must be inspected at certain intervals to ensure there is no actual problem."

https://crankyflier.com/2023/09/26/the-problem-with-pratt-whitneys-pw1100g-engines-on-the-a320neo-family/

"Pratt says that these shop visits take 250 to 300 DAYS to complete"

this is what’s insane to me. How can it possibly take that long to disassemble and reassemble a motor.

give it to a couple red necks with a few cases of Busch light and it will be done in a couple hours.

Think of all those middle managers and Govt workers who’s jobs you’ve put at risk with your suggestion. 😏. Red tape and clip boards are “needed”

You're right, who needs those government regulators. Let the private industry do it unsupervised! The FAA allowed Boeing to design and SELF CERTIFY the MCAS system, what could go wrong?!?

Maybe they could divert some assets of the IRS or CBP.

Yeah but that does not really help your argument since the government let them do it. And really with the current FAA staffing issues I’m not sure they are a shining example of excellence.

But you do need a balance between government and pvt industry.

No, you need proper oversight in safety -sensitive industries. The private industry just won't do it themselves, they just won't.

Thats funny. The government just “properly overnighted JetBlue’s sensitive as$”. What are you guys gonna do now? Go back to the NEA? Hahahaha.

https://www.ch-aviation.com/news/136...e%20Airways%20(B6%2C%20New%20York,previously%20expected%20in%202 024%20through

Can't imagine JB will be buying any NK deliveries while deferring A-321 deliveries until 2028. Any thoughs on how this affects total numbers of planes on property at the ends of 2024 and 2025 and what mix of planes?

They are negotiating lease extensions/purchases off lease for the old 320s. So, the fleet will look similar to today with a handful of extra NEOs/LRs, 20 or so 220s per year, and 12-15 190s end of this year, 0 end of 2025.

my EOY 2025 fleet guess is:
110-125 or so A320s
63 A321CEOs
40-45 321NEOs (mix of HD, LD, LR)
60-65 A220s
0 190s

Should have grabbed a few if we could…..

https://www.boston25news.com/news/lo...C25DX2VLOMM2Q/

well if you fave the FAA allowing the company to self certify as you say……

Yep, that isn't proper oversight, and look what happened.

Have you watched the Netflix documentary "Downfall: The Case Against Boeing"?

yeah point being the GOVERNMENT allowed for it.

You mean the government didn't do proper oversight (I agree) and the private company without proper supervision killed 300 people and would have killed more if the government didn't step in and shut it down? Boeing was still maintaining that the problem was the third world airline operators, even though those airlines were on the record with Boeing being concerned about the MCAS (Mass-Casualty) system.

I ask again, have you seen the Netflix documentary "Downfall: The Case Against Boeing"?

That's a Bingo

Both those crashes were pilot error . They mishandled a problem. Yes, was very chaotic but anybody who has any experience in that plane would shut off that massive spinning annoying wheel in 2 seconds. Yes,mcas should 100% of been disclosed and discussed but it was no different then trim runaway.

Yeah. Longest airliner grounding in history because of pilot error. Sure.

What percentage of crashes aren't pilot error?

Tell us you haven't seen the Netflix documentary "Downfall: The Case Against Boeing" without telling us you haven't seen it....

Or, you weren't intelligent enough to comprehend the internal Boeing emails that show you are dead wrong...

Either way, yikes.

yes that’s why I said you need a balance. This isn’t some major argument relax.

since I know you…..balance like Boeing is allowed to be a private/public company but also has proper oversight from the government.

Seems in the max case as well as others Boeing failed and the FAA failed

But this conversation started when it was suggested the government regulators were a big part of the problem in this industry. This industry won't work without them. You can say the FAA failed, and I agree, but they failed by not regulating (oversight) Boeing enough. Boeing keeps showing us it can't be left unsupervised. Plenty of airlines have tried to show us as well. :)

All good.

Tell me your are smart enough to realize the document was completely jaded. Why don't you use one of your 2 brain cells and read the accident reports and tell me it wasnt pilot error.

The captain 31 times trimming and and stopping mcas before not saying a word about doing that and hands controls to fo and goes heads down. Or the second one flying a takeoff power for 5 minutes before hitting the ground. Are you a student pilot posting??

It 100 percent had a design issue with single system triggering the mcas. However both accidents should not of resulted in crashes. Nothing more then trim runaway.

If it was nothing more than trim runaway, a checklist/FCOM update would have been a sufficient solution.

Boeing's internal engineer emails stated that pilots would have SECONDS to properly respond to an MCAS failure, or the flight would be "unrecoverable". Yet Boeing provided no training on the system, or any procedures for dealing with an MCAS failure, let alone even mentioning an MCAS failure as a possibility.

Boeing's own engineer says pilots would have a short number of seconds to recognize and properly respond to an MCAS failure, or the flight is unrecoverable. I take the engineers analysis over yours.

You might review the timelines on the two accident flights and the prior flight for the first accident aircraft.

Have you ever been qualified on a non-FBW Boeing? Exactly how many seconds do you think you have with a 'runawy stabilizer' (old term) or 'uncommanded stabilzer movement (new term)??? Your posts either show a significant lack of knowledge or you're trying to ignore the truth - with a runaway stabilizer you have seconds before you can lose control of the aircraft. Not minutes, seconds. The MCAS failure looks like....an 'uncommanded stabilizer movement'. It has the same result - trim wheel moving uncontrollably. The corrective action that the industry thought every airline pilot knew? Turn off the stabilzer trim switches. What was the expected reaction time? I think I read 4 seconds. Slight nuances between different models but the basic steps are the same - turn the stab switches off, leave them off, maintain present airspeed or do not exceed x KIAS. Checklist. What can you do? Trim manually as the FIRST incident crew did. What did they do with this allegely fatal flaw? They continued to their destination. How fatal was this 'flaw' when a crew just 'remained calm and carried on'???

You're right, it's such a non-event that they grounded the airplane for over a year, and even US pilot unions were demanding more information and training. And of course, there was the published Boeing "MCAS failure checklist/procedure" to follow, which was highlighted during the Boeing MCAS training right? And of course how could they possibly have missed the "MCAS failure" warning light and/or message!

You're right. Nothing to see here.

I certainly have learned a bunch about both your passion to argue a point on the internet and love of Netflix documentaries while reading your argument over some 5 pages. That said, I don’t feel that there should be no oversight. I simply commented to another that oversight could be a possible reason for the length of time it takes for inspections on GTF engines. While it may have been construed in a way that I believe that less oversight is needed that in no way was my intent. How you turned a conversation about JB buying already ordered Airbus into a Boeing conversation is interesting. If you have source knowledge of JB going Boeing it’d be great to hear about it otherwise can we get back to the undisclosed Airbus order?

Ah, the old "we need oversight but it just can't slow us down" routine. Sounds like what Boeing would have said to the regulators during the MAX certification.

You are welcome to add any info regarding the undisclosed order. If you want to talk about other things or raise other points again, we can all talk about those as well.

How about we talk about the GTF engine issue which is not allowing for our new deliveries of aircraft that were slated to replace old aircraft before we spent money that we currently are not making refurbishing those older aircraft? How about we talk about the airline killing investor that has us clearly in his sights? You know the guy that will gladly part us out to the big four and Alaska at a percentage of 24,24,24,24 and 4 if needed to allow for us all to be sent to the streets? How about we talk about the Earhardt pad and how tight it is over there or whether or not you’d trust the Sushi in T5 any more than you would from Wal-Mart? These are all examples of things in our Lane. While I agree with you that oversight is needed at Boeing or Airbus how about oversight of DeIce procedures in BOS? Not just for the incident but for the product provided. This P&W thing is big enough that we’re not growing. Our 10 year cycle is now complete. Settle in for the long and painful next I’ll guess 3-5 because they’ll not be nearly as fun. Unless of course in my opinion we get an over turn of the decision in Jun, but then can they close before Jul 24? I guess we’ll see. Oh and as for CBA 2? That’s also kicked Far outside of the uprights now. I hope you’re correct about an order, but frankly I’ll be surprised if it is us.

I have had two de-ice occurrences that were so unreal, they would sound made up. You will get no argument from me on running a tight de-ice ship.

Are you saying your opinion is that the merger decision will be reversed? Or did I read your opinion incorrectly?

I agree, Pratt and it's suppliers have made a mess of JetBlue's growth plans. And I have no illusions about our new "investor" or our CBA prospects in the short term.

As for the order, I still think it is highly likely it was placed by JB, likely contingent on the NK outcome, and was part of a package deal that included revising the delivery schedule for our previous order book. I never claimed to be 100% positive, but I remain fairly convinced. I also reserve the right to be wrong on this one. And will admit I was if another airline claims the order. Until then, we wait. I was wrong that one time before...