Maybe so, but we have 3-4 years to weed them out if they show their butts. Unfortunately we are stuck with some of the jackwagons posting on here.

 

You make good points. Like I said in a previous post I am not as negative about this program as others. However, we should not recommend this program. Guys will not be treated well by there peers, that's already obvious. Candidates limit themselves to one airline,when with the time and money they could go to a different school and a more traditional route and better career opportunities. Finally it's not needed, there are plenty of qualified guys looking for jobs.

 

They aren't limited to one airline. They finish with an ATP and 1500 hours. If they want to go to a regional and get experience, off they can go. I finished flight school with $90,000 in debt in 2003. That's roughly what this program costs in today's dollars. But it was money well spent. I finished my commercial and CFIs quickly, and by spending that money I got hired at an airline faster than if I had done it cheaper and slower.

I just really don't see the problem. Many of us took different paths to get here. These guys will be trained in airline ops from day one, and will instruct over 1,000 hours before starting here. They are being thoroughly tested, and they have 3-4 years to get a good hard look at them before they get a seniority number. That's a heck of a lot better than we get with someone off the street.

 

As far as the "it's not needed" argument goes, this program isn't needed now. But it may be needed someday. And if it's needed it takes 4 years to spool it up. That's an eternity in a staffing timeline. Why wait until it is needed to start it?

You know what else isn't needed, but we do anyway? Vets in Blue. We have lots of applicants independent of that. We should axe that program since "it isn't needed."

We should just stop hiring anyone other than regional guys. We have plenty of them applying to meet the demand, so why hire military and corporate guys? They aren't needed.

OR, we can all appreciate that we all took different paths to get here, and stop being jerks to each other.

 

I don't not agree with either of your post, and I don't really care to explain why.... again. I will comment on your military and vets in blue. The vets in blue is to attract military pilots. Being such a small airline most military guys don't know anything about jetBlue and they only focus on the big 3. Military guys have proven they can fly complicated airplanes in the left seat or solo. They are a proven product. Corporate guys come with a world of experience. If you want to reduce the value of this job and make sure we hire people that will never leave than yes, keep hiring regional FOs with no PIC and gateway 7 guys. In that line of thinking why pay us more, let the qualified guys move on to better paying places, there is always a regional FO that wants to work here. Since he won't be able to get on at the airlines that pay better, because those airlines are hiring military guys and corporate guys, tons of them, he will be stuck here at low wages. Do you work directly for B.S.?

 

Are regional pilots not proven? They worked their asses off in substandard working conditions for years on end, doing essentially the same job in similar equipment. Sounds proven to me.

 

They are, and most are great pilots and know how to fly point A to B very well. Like you said they work their asses off, so do corporate pilots, so do military pilots. I have a problem with someone with less experience getting hired in front of them because the company wants to hire people that CANT leave. First is was regional FOs with no PIC. These guys have never set the left seat. There is a difference in one with 8K hours that never upgraded due to timing and one with 3k hours that just skipped ahead of everyone. JetBlue should hire the most qualified. But hiring no PIC 3K hour regional pilots and the gateway 7 instead of the thousands of qualified pilots out there because they are scared the competitive guys will leave is something us as pilots should not want. The guys with good resumes are not coming here right now. Ask around what a new hire class at delta or fedex looks like. It's not a regional pilot with no PIC and 3k hours. If JetBlue wants to keep competitive pilots from leaving than pay us more. Can you really be proud of the work it took to get here and the experience you have when you find out a guy ahead of you or behind you got hired at 1500 hours and no Jet time. Pay us better than industry standard and we will never have a problem getting pilots. I think management is getting prepared how to scrape dudes from the bottom of the barrel, when they should be trying to get them from the top.

 

Sigh...I had a whole reply written out, and it got deleted. I'm not writing it out again.

This program isn't about keeping pilots here. It's about innovating new ways of becoming a pilot. We have 7 gateways. 7. Jetblue likes to get pilots from varied sources. Our program will become the standard for Delta and United's program someday.

As far as my career goes, I don't base my feeling on my career off of anyone else. I have pride in my accomplishments and it doesn't matter if we hire a guy off the street or not. I don't get my validation in such a shallow way.

 

I'd be surprised if there were more than 10 guys a year hired with 3k hours and no PIC. Maybe a handful with amazing connections but it's the exception not the rule.

 

I think right now it takes 4500-5000 hours to get a call for an interview off the street. I've got a guy I'm trying to get on who has 4,000 hours and he's a captain at Compass. They won't call him until he has 500 more hours.