The brand was tarnished.

https://twitter.com/lufthansa/status...719488?lang=en

https://www.dw.com/en/lufthansa-face...ash/a-53346800

Lufthansa ultimately "won" the lawsuit years later. They didn't have to pay extra compensation to the families. But when your brand is dragged through the press with lawsuits for 5 years that's a rather expensive "win".

i can’t find anywhere where his ab initio background was the cause of the crash.

if the pilot had had a German Air Force background (like the pilot in the flight I mentioned who had a military flying background in his country) would you say “hiring ex military pilots clearly does not work” or acknowledge that one person having a mental breakdown does not mean the way that person trained for the job does not work.

Their LCC subsidiary took the brunt of it, not Lufthansa. Maybe that's why they sent the broken toy there in the first place.

Can you find anything where I said ab initio training CAUSED the crash? No? That's because I didn't.

Someone claimed 'ab initio works for Lufthansa'. I questioned that blanket "it works great" pollyanish statement with the fact that a Lifthansa ab initio 100 hour hire purposely crashed an airliner and killed 144 people.

Does that meet your definition of "ab initio works for Lufthansa"?

I would disagree with your statement since the lawsuit and the years of bad press were against Lufthansa. The initial crash, sure the media was saying "Germanwings crash" every few minutes and that's bad, but the long term lawsuit headlines were against Lufthansa.

Better for LH to be named later in a lawsuit than have their logo on the big headlines. You and I know the relationship between GW and LH, but if I ask 10 friends and family five of them might remember germanwings but none would have any idea that LH was involved. Several german speakers and natives in that circle. Folks residing in DE are probably more aware.

GW was shutdown. The regionals which had at-fault fatal accidents here in the US this century have all been shut down. Funny how the off-brand subsidiaries go away but the mainline brands keeps on truckin'

Meh.... your stretching several times to connect a bunch of distant dots to drag people to your point, which is apparently that Americans don't know Lifthansa is connected to Germanwings?

Ok, what does that have to due with the issue? Americans don't know a lot of things about Germany just like Germans don't know a lot of things about America.

But everybody knows United Airlines beat up that Doctor and physically tossed him off an airplane a few years ago..... even though it wasn't United it was a feeder airline.

Anyway, Germany doesn't have much to do with our age 67/68 question so I'll leave it there.

But if someone says "ab initio works for Lufthansa" my answer remains the same.

I'm not an ab initio proponent and I don't think it worked well in this case. But I think the pilot in question was utilized at arms length, and that wasn't an accident.

Theyve still got National committee chairmen that insist there is no shortage at all, not now and not later.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/pilot-shortage-start-ageism-rcna34831

“It is time to clear the boomers for takeoff.”

Now it’s not even age 67, they just want no age.

That's awesome! Maybe they should do a poll on all the retired boomers that want to get hired back on the bottom of the seniority lists of any airline. Stuck on reserve in LGA well into your 80's! Hopefully that new legislation to let 18 year olds drive 18 wheelers also passes so we can solve the trucker shortage.

SIC privileges only after 65. No international. Seniority resets to bottom of list on 65 birthday.

I could get on board with that. (not really, b/c there's no way I'm willing to fly with post 65 year olds again. It's like a box of chocolates, but half of them are moldy.)

Some countries overseas put post 65ers in the right seat. They are, however, permitted to operate to countries that do allow post 65ers,, such at NZ, and AUS.

You never know what captains at your airline think about you… a tiny peach way to immature to be picked.

When he is a Captain he will be *****ing about his copilots!

Their parents were known as The Greatest Generation. The Boomers will be known as The Greediest Generation.

This is the generation that promoted socialism and protested capitalism and wars in the 60s, got high and discoed through the 70s, then invented "conspicuous consumption" yuppies in the 80s while promoting wars, capitalism, and deficit spending. Later they transformed into right wing religious fanatics who hate socialism. Now they want to steal more years at the top from the Lost Generation. Very on brand.

No possible way that can happen, SCOTUS would toss it in a heartbeat (if it even made it that far).

Safety is the only legit excuse for age limits, it's either safe or not. If it's safe, then any other age-associated limits are discrimination.

Remote, vague possibility you could make a case that they can only be SIC's. Although reality on that is that it will be just like the last time: one of the two needs to be under 60.

But no possible way they lose their seniority.

The law will be made by septuagenarian and octogenarian lawmakers. Does anyone really think that those lawmakers are going to put restrictions on any age extension?
And as a bonus to lawmakers, they'll view it as a way to save the Social Security Trust Fund a bit of coin, along with additional taxes flowing into the system.

If there are a few summer airline meltdowns, it will grease the skids for an age change to pass. So if you don't want an age change, fly your butt off this summer and make sure your airline doesn't have a schedule meltdown.

Can you try that again in English?

I think they’re all great people but I’ve flown with a ton of post 65 guys and cognitive decline is a real thing, and it affects everyone differently, and many are good at hiding it.

”You sure about that Clark?”

There's a benefit to higher SAT's & lower BMI's.

I heard Kit Darby is behind this. It's all over the USA Today.

Swell. If you're old enough to date Miss Daisy, probably best to leave the driving to Greyhound.

Hopefully Sully can make it back at 71 years young to sling gear at USAir for some 28 year old millennial. The no age limit can bring back some of the best like Hoot, Darby and Yeager.

Didn’t 2 of them boys ride off to rock'nroll heaven? It's too old. What does Silky Sully say? I've no idea.

Just one.

Sully's the US representative to ICAO.

We are going to need a couple of these high profile old codgers to make it back into the flight deck to get the other old codgers off the rocking chair. Kind of like TopGun is doing to the younger generation. This is an all hands on deck moment to solve the summer of travel misery.

I figure a few months at a regional to get them current and up to speed then straight to a legacy. 6 months at most, just in time for the Holiday Rush. Sounds like Sully is already laying the groundwork at ICAO. This is going to be so awesome.

With all the ATC issues, hopefully we can get their retirement age removed too. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a bunch of extremely experienced 70-somethings giving us all speeds and headings into ATL?

Are you able to tie your own shoes without any assistance?

Please provide your data to make such an asinine claim.

I believe the UAL TA that just came out had a stipend for black Dr. Scholl's Velcro shoes to help the boomers with their financial difficulties.

All aboard, come with us, on a Continental Trailways bus.

Do the windows open? https://youtu.be/T4287tw_dwk

With this latest TA ALPA has become the master of taking and restricting its members ability earn $$$$$

STAY OUT OF POLITICS ALPA !!

Having lived through and effected by the last age increase this entire thread is both illuminating, hilarious and repulsive all at the same time… but that’s often the case on an APC thread.

Aside from forwarding lousy contracts ALPA backing the madatory retirement age is probably the dumbest move ever. Parked airplanes = lost jobs and revenue ( dues paying revenue). We all know age 60/65 rule has nothing to do with health and safety and everything to do with politics..ALPA strongly opposed it in 1958 so what changed other than people living much longer lives? Absolutely a stupid move.

I support my union 100% in its stance

For such a new APC account you seem to be knocking it out of the park with Pro Management talking points and ant pilot rhetoric.

He's a rabid "No" advocate on the TA.

ALPA is out of touch
 

Already contacted my reps to ignore the ALPA bull**** on age 65. ALPA currently doing all it can to destroy the pilot profession given that disgraceful TA. Now pilots will need to work until 70 to make up for their BS. How about a madatory retirement plan ALPA?

If ALPA negotiated a retirement plan I would be gone tomorrow. ALPA is the one in bed with management not me.