The Ansett "stuff" is relevant and shows the hypocrisy of ALPA.

Your hr 2881 quote has nothing to do with this thread in my humble opinion.

Age 60????? What did ya say?? Had your turn . . . . Now go and enjoy what little time you have left!

I understood his point. It doesn't really matter if 98% of ALPA were against the age change, it was going to change. It's a matter of understanding when and where you have the ability to affect the outcome of something. This is not one of those situations. As soon as foreign pilots were allowed to fly into the U.S. over age 60, it was a done deal. So, is it better for ALPA to spend time and resources trying to halt a change that is unstoppable?

You left out the second part of that statement:

Or is it better for ALPA to change their course once the inevitable happens and ensure that they play a role in how the new age 65 rules are adapted and integrated to ensure that its membership is protected to the greatest extent possible?

The way I understand it and heard it from ALPA: ALPA polled the membership and the majority was in favor of changing age 60. ALPA said OK, we'll be proactive in the process and get involved with the FAA to protect the pilot's interests.

I don't know or care about Prater or any ALPA leadership. I didn't see the poll results. I don't know what politics are involved. I'll try to find the source for the above statement. I know this is a public forum and any and everyone has an opinion, but let's stick to the facts whatever they may be.

By the way, I'm 40 and I want the age 60 rule.

ALPA’s Governing Bodies Grapple with Age 60 Issue
At its May meeting, ALPA’s Executive Board will consider a resolution from the Executive Council to modify the union’s Age 60 policy if it decides that such efforts are in the best interest of ALPA pilots.

The resolution comes on the heels of the FAA’s announcement that it will propose a new rule to allow pilots to fly until they are 65. The proposed rule would parallel the ICAO standard—either pilot or copilot may fly up to age 65 as long as the other crew member is under age 60.

Since the announcement, ALPA’s president, Capt. John Prater, established the ALPA Age 60 Blue Ribbon Panel to study the long-range effects of potential changes to the FAA Age 60 Rule and to identify issues connected to possible changes to pilot mandatory retirement age.

The Panel presented its preliminary report to the Council on April 24 which included issues that need to be addressed in legislation to change the Age 60 Rule. Currently, Congress is considering legislation—S. 65 and H.R. 1125—that would raise the upper age limit to 65 in multi-crew operations as long as the other required pilot is under 60; sunset the current FAA Age 60 Rule 30 days after the effective date which is the date of enactment; require the Secretary of Transportation within 30 days after the effective date to modify the regulation making it consistent with the statutory change; and establish that it would not be a basis for a claim of re-employment or seniority under any labor agreement.

ALPA expects that attempts will be made to attach or include S. 65 and H.R. 1125 in each chamber's version of the 2007 FAA reauthorization bills which the committees of jurisdiction are scheduling to debate and vote on in May or June.

The Blue Ribbon Panel concluded that provisions in both bills do not sufficiently address ALPA’s issues. Those issues include:

appropriate language to prevent retroactive application of a change to the rule,
appropriate language to ensure stronger liability protection for airlines and pilot unions in implementing a change to the rule,
assurances that FAA normal retirement age language in certain defined benefit plans would not cause a cutback in accrued benefits
opposition to any additional age-related diagnostic medical testing,
any attempt by the FAA to obtain greater access to medical pilot records, and
support of FAA Air Surgeon Fred Tilton’s recommendation to require a first class medical certification every six months for pilots over age 60, and
appropriate language , modeled on Akaka bill, which requires the PBGC to calculate pilot pension benefits as though they worked to the more traditional retirement age of 65.
ALPA continues to collect information on this critical topic. For your opinion to be heard, eligible members MUST take the ALPA Age 60 Blue Ribbon Panel Survey. Although the survey results will not be the only factor the Board considers, it is an important aspect of the Board’s deliberation regarding the FAA Age 60 pilot retirement regulation.

More than 14,500 ALPA pilots have registered their opinions on the FAA Age 60 pilot retirement regulation via ALPA’s online survey. As of April 30, the top-10 pilot groups with the highest percentage of submissions are America West, FedEx, Northwest, ASTAR, Continental, Delta, United, Alaska, Hawaiian, and Atlas Air. The web-based survey began earlier this month and will remain open until May 10. Please log onto Crewroom.alpa.org to access the survey.

The president of the Air Line Pilots Association, International (ALPA) is forming an internal work group to develop a response to the FAA administrator’s announcement to conduct rulemaking on the mandatory airline pilot retirement age.

“The fact that the FAA is set to put the Age 60 regulation into the rulemaking process is very significant,” explained ALPA president, Capt. John Prater, after Administrator Marion Blakey’s announcement at a National Press Club luncheon today. “The FAA is careful to propose rulemaking only when it is convinced that a rule will need to change.”

“ALPA policy is to support the rule as it is,” Prater said, adding that since 1980 the union has opposed and continues to oppose legislation that would overturn the rule. “However, despite that policy, we cannot afford to ignore the significance of the FAA’s announcement. That is why I have decided to form an ALPA Blue Ribbon Panel on Pilot Retirement, composed of representatives from the four of the association’s standing committees most logically connected with the Age 60 Issue: Air Safety, Retirement and Insurance, Collective Bargaining, and Aeromedical.”

The mission of the panel will be to study the effects of potential changes to the FAA Age 60 Rule and to develop recommendations on how ALPA can address the issue of pilot retirement with the goal of having a positive effect for ALPA members. The committee will uphold ALPA’s 75 year-long commitment to ensuring the highest level of aviation safety. The FAA announcement and the formation of the ALPA Blue Ribbon Panel come in the wake of five years of tumult for the airline pilot profession. Furloughs, pay and benefit cuts, and a lack of job growth have put severe economic pressure on airline pilots of all ages and experience levels. The panel will present its recommendations to the ALPA Executive Board, composed of the leaders of ALPA’s 40 pilot groups, at its May 2007 meeting.

“While it is impossible to predict what the final FAA rule will look like,” Prater said, “ALPA will use its credibility and influence to protect pilot interests throughout the process.”



I can't find the poll results. I'm still looking.

Here is the google search for it, it is the second link down.

http://www.google.com/search?q=alpa+...ient=firefox-a

I thought BA just raised its retirement to 55 from 60??? And Cathay is still at 55... Air traffic controllers... Age 55... Just because someone else works until 65 does not mean we have to.

We live under a Government that loves Big Business! I do not care if its Dem's or Rep's... Lets just keep the pay down and the payouts low! Keep the pilot pool staffed and underpaid!

Work until you drop dead and the company and the government both benifit big time!

Cheers!

I'm disappointed in ALPA National leadership because they didn't do anything to protect the career progression of younger pilots regarding this change. I shouldn't be surprised, however, that their proposal provided a windfall to older pilots who not only will get another 5 years at the top of their earning potential but benefited from advancement of seniority due to Age 60 retirements for their entire career.

A better solution would have been to require the PIC of all 121 operations to be under the age of 60. Older pilots who wanted or needed to work would get another 5 years, likely at the top of FO pay and seniority, while not impinging on the career progression of younger pilots below them.

That would have been the best possible compromise to both positions...too bad it never appeared to have been considered.