Delta Loses 757 to FEDEX??
 

hey this might have already been discussed but a buddy of mine said that he had a fedex guy tell his captain that the 757's that fedex is getting are the ones delta has right now.. Is that true? he said it had something to do with the lease issues and delta's bankruptcy. apperantly delta tried to screw the leasing company over during bankruptcy so they intern signed a lease with fedex for the planes and that the planes in the near future will be assigned to fedex as the lease holders.. anyway thought i would throw that out there and see what you guys have been hearing.

We (DAL) are getting 13 or so 757ERs from AA. Not losing any current aircraft that I know of.

I think that number is now up to 15 757ER. There was one in ATL with the winglets installed. It's a sharp looking jet.

Someone else ...
 

I think some of the FedEx 757s are coming from USAir ...

USAir and a couple other places. I think one came from Ryan International. Isnt FedEx looking for RR powered birds over the pratts?

Who wouldn't ...

We have returned or will soon return some 75s 76s and MD80s to the lease holders. I guess some of those could be going to FedEx.

Given the the scarcity of good used 757s, FedEx can't be picky about the engines. It could be worse - there was supposed to be a GE engine for the 757 too - a CF6-36. That would really make life fun.

Me. 12,000 hours flying the Pratts with no problems.

I could have sworn that Boeing never built an official 'ER' model of the 757.

Are people just referring to winglet 757's as 'ERs' now?

Omni Air International is losing two of it's four 757-200's this year to FedEx. RB211-E4 powered. I imagine FedEx will be the largest operator of the 757 in the future. :cool:

Couldn't find anything on the Boeing web site about ER's. I do know that the first couple the USAF took delivery of did not have the range so Boeing added some long range tanks. UPS does the training for the USAF 757's.

I don't know if it is officially an ER but the ex-TWA 75's that Delta has have HMGs and carry 1500lbs more fuel than the domestic 75s.

HMG=Hydraulic Motor Generator, it's an additional electric power source that runs on hyd. pressure.

702TW was the ex-TWA bird in DL's colors. It looks pretty sharp. Glad to see that it has a good home with the good folks at DAL.

I believe (dusting off cobwebs) that when we (TWA) got our 757s that they were wired for 180 minute ETOPS (fire suppresion and HMGs) so that we could fly them to Hawaii and occasionally to Europe. I think that's where the "ER" designation came from, although I've never heard of a 757 ER- only a 757 with ETOPS capability. I guess just a matter of semantics.

I'm also guessing the winglets will help add a few miles to the range of the aircraft. At TWA, we used to fly the 757 from Barcelona, Spain (BCN) to JFK nonstop which had flight times in the Winter close to 9 hours.

I think there was a picture on here, or maybe airliners.net showing the ex-TWA 757 in DAL's colors with the winglets.

Finally, there was a picture on here showing on of FDX's 757 in the conversion shop down in Brookley/Mobile, ALA, and it was quite clear that it was an ex-USAir plane powered by RR RB-211 engines.

The winglets are supposed to add about 300 miles to the range of the 757.

FWIW, I've seen a Continental 757 (w/ winglets) pushing back in Berlin every week when I've arrived. If they can go from Berlin to NYC, they can cover much of Europe.

Pratts take forever to start, occasionally blow up, but have great reverse.

Rolls start quick, but use oil and reverse just makes more noise.

Seems like Rolls Royce really is on a roll. Rolls is now the worlds number 1 supplier to the widebody market. Securing over 80% of orders for the B757 with their superior RB211 was just the start.

There's no way Pratt can compete with GE and RR.

Our designation for the new 75's are in fact ER. They are pratt pw2037 powered, are 180 etops and have HDG's installed. Not sure if that ER designator is ours or an actual boeing designation.

We will be flying these jets on lower load European routes, shannon, orly etc.

It seems like the ex-TWA 75s at DAL have RJ seats in coach and lower windows and a very narrow isle, just like the CRJ200. I would'nt want to fly to Shannon or Manchester as a passanger in coach. But they look very sharp.

Dont believe the hype!!!

The top 5 operators of the 757

AA 142
DL 136
UA 97
UPS 75
NW 72

4 of the 5 use PW 2000 series engines for their 75's.

Granted UPS uses PW's on only half of their fleet, but with 1050 757's delivered the above numbers represent aprox 30% of all 757's made.

Nice try :D

The "757ER" designation is just an in-house designation. The previous reasons for this were already well explained. There is no type designation change from Boeing. They are designated as delivered to TWA as "757-2Q8"


I'm flying two of them tommorrow and Tuesday. Weee.

I'm not sure why you're saying "nice try".

The vast majority of B757's in service worldwide are powered by Rolls RB211 engines. That's not hype. That's a fact!

UPS had PW's first then switched to Rolls.

Every Airline you mention above is a Rolls Royce customer!

All variants of the B787 will enter service with RR engines (RR is the only engine certified to date for the B787)

The A380 entered service with RR engines. RR has greatest market share on the A380. The A350 will enter service with RR engines.


Like I said, PW can't compete with GE and RR!

That's probably because UPS has no more interest in narrowbody AC anymore, or else we would have snatched up those 757s. Only widebodies from here on out (MD-11s, 767s, 747s, possibly A380).

It will be interesting to see how Singapore get on with their new A380. I'm sure more carriers will order it in time.



AL

I'm not disagreeing with any of your statements, just some clarifications.

Delta is an RR customer 8 777s. Future 777 will be GE90s. All our 757s are PW.

GE and RR have about 50% each of the 787 market so far.

Outside of partnerships, agreed that PW is loosing ground.

I believe he was referring to those airlines being PW customers for their 757's, and not for being exclusive PW operators.

All 5 of those airlines he listed have some, if not all of their 757s powered by Pratts.

Correct me if Im wrong.

I didn't think AA had any PW powered 757's. I thought the few ex TWA planes were gone already.

I was just making the point that most 757's in service today are RR powered which is true.

AL

I believe your right, some, but not all of our 757s had a weird designator i.e. 2Q8. however, most of TWA's customer package was -31 or -231.

For example, our backwards wired 727-200s were 727-231 Adv. and I believe some of or 757s were 757-231. Good piece of trivia, Clamp.

Like many on the message board, I was fortunate to fly both RR and PW 2037 powered 757s. The starting sequences as mentioned are different. RB211 starts like a car engine. The Pratts have a lower max motoring, but you can go to the back make lunch and come back before the Pratts get to idle speed.

The Pratts have a lot of residual thrust at idle, so landing and taxiing can be pretty much done at idle thrust. The Rolls on the other hand require just a little bit of juice to taxi them and the same for landing.

The two engines have distinctly different sounds when in reverse and on takeoff power.

And from above, American's Fleet are RR powered. When they bought the assets of TWA, they acquired 27 very new 757s (PW 2037) and I believe have all but gotten rid of them. Some went to Pegasus leasing, whereas I flew 708/715/720TW while at TransMeridian. The other half, of course will be headed to Atlanta with DL.

I said "nice try" cause you mentioned that 80% of 757's were powered by RR engines.

I was making the point that 4 of the 5 largest operators of the 757 use PW engines.

I agree that more 75's are powered by RR than PW, but I don't think it's close to the 80% that you mentioned.

I think UA's 777 are GE powered and unless NW has RR's on their A330's, I don't think they are a Rolls Royce customer either :confused:

There appears to be some confusion here.

AA is the worlds largest 757 operator and they use the Rolls RB211. RR powers the "vast" majority of 757's and PW doesn't even come close. The RB211 incorporated the RR 3 spool technology and wide chord fan making it a superior engine.

UA has PW on their B777's but PW's market share on the 777 lags behind GE and Rolls. However, UA is a big RR customer. They have the largest IAE V2500 A320 fleet in the world just ahead of Jetblue.

NWA is also a RR customer. Their B787 will be powered by the Rolls Trent 1000.


The vast majority of Airlines around the world are RR customers and that includes "all" the legacy carriers in the US.


And as you might put it................NICE TRY!!!!!!!


AL

This may be true. According to DAL's page on APC, they're looking to simplify their fleet to four a/c type. Which one's they are....I don't know.



atp

Wow ...
 

Look at the ensuing feud I created with 2 words ... "Who wouldn't" ...?

:D

I have flown both ... and agree with the characteristic differences stated by most posters.

But without spending hours on the web looking over charts and graphs, I'll say this much ... most maintenance reliability types prefer the RR for its reliability ... I also think it is why UPS switched to the RR in the middle of its fleet, but anyone on here with more time at UPS would know for sure.

Everything that we can point out as differences as pilots is just that ... differences. Airlines worry about cost to operate and maintain and reliability ... in no particular order !

Later, CC

Some info from Boeing, AMR, DAL, IAE websites...

1049 757s produced, 617 RR and 432 PW , 59/41%

IAE is a partnership between four companies PW,RR,MTU,Japanese aircraft.

As of July 07' Delta is the largest operator of 757s.

Delta is an operator of RR engines, eight AC with no more RR orders in sight.

From another thread... Delta is not getting rid of 757s for fleet simplification. The lease holder wanted them back.

There's a lot of exciting things going on at GE and RR right now with the next generation engines.

Also, the next generation aircraft from Airbus and Boeing are very exciting. We are fortunate to have such great technology in our time.

AL

See post #34 by Sully

No. Delta operates PW powered 757s. Where did you see on DL's website that they operate RR powered 757s? :confused:

The following quote is directly from DL's website.

Pratt & Whitney signed a 10-year exclusive deal with Delta TechOps in which they will provide TechOps with materials for the PW2000 engine type. Delta was the launch commercial customer for the PW2000 engine and over the years TechOps has developed significant repair capabilities on this engine.
“Delta Air Lines operates the largest PW2000-powered Boeing 757 fleet in the world,” said Jim Keenan, senior vice president and general manager, Pratt & Whitney Global Service Partners. “We are proud to be Delta’s strategic partner and exclusive source of PW2000 material.”

source: http://http://news.delta.com/article...ticle_id=10649:cool:

He never said Delta flew RR on the 757, just that Delta was a RR customer with 8 aircraft, those being the 777's...Kevin

I blame the public education system for my reading comprehension! :p

Rolls Royce has really turned things around in the last 20 years with the RB 211. It was a real problem laiden power plant. On one of my trips across the pond, the RR CEO came up to the cockpit for a visit (oh, the good old days!) He asked me what I thought of the RB 211. I told him that I had no problems with it. He replied, only half jokingly "If I type up your statement, would you be willing to sign it?" Later I had big problems with one..scattering fan blades over the southern half of New Mexico.