Taking the plunge
 

Hello,


I'm in a bit of a pickle. I'm 19 and considering training for being a pilot for a major or preferably corporate position.

From what I have read on this forum, it would probably take many years of hard work and luck to accomplish. But, I have been playing flying sims ever since I was 10 and I love the idea of being a pilot. Plus, my parents really want me to have a stable future.

Problem for me is I'm torn between two worlds, art and aviation. I have talent for painting and drawing and I really love to paint. I'm trying to decide which one would be a more rewarding career both lifestyle and financial wise. Thats why I'm asking for your guys wisdom. Should I start my training as a pilot now or pursue a career in art? And do you think corporate flying is the way to go?

P.S.

I Live in Vero Beach (FL) and being so close to FlightSaftey, I have scheduled a tour of the facilities and a flight.

All the best,

Justin.

No advanced career will pay you as little as being professional pilot. If you can't live without being a pilot, then you should pursue it. If you can see yourself doing something else, do it. Success in aviation is 95% luck and timing. Follow your heart and you never have to regret.

Perhaps you go for the art career. Open your own business. Be really successful. Take flying lessons, use your ticket in your business (tax write off). Buy your own plane. (tax write off) Enjoy life! Priceless!

Oh, and you can do that by the time you are 30!

PaintCan

PS Savannah College of Art and Design in ATL is one of the best art schools I have ever seen. Check it out. Flying lessons are nearby as well.

Justin,

You really know how to set yourself up for disappointment. You've picked 2 incredibly difficult fields to succeed in. My advice is pursue the art and flying both. Your odds are better of having some success with 2 endeavors. If you want to have a satisfying flying career you should look into the Air National Guard. Otherwise be prepared to be happy on 50-70 thousand a year. And hope it doesn't get any worse.

I've flown civil and with the ANG and currently fly for a major. I will be lucky to make captain before I retire assuming I am still employed in a year. (My second furlough is looking like a real possibility.) For job security and a pretty good income, the ANG is the way to go. If you are lucky you can get a full-time position with your unit or stay a traditional guardsmen and continue to pursue your art.

You will hear a lot of positions on your dilemma and some will encourage you but if you do choose to pursue only flying, trust a pragmatist and be prepared for a long and frustrating road with the real possibility of no significant payoff for all your hard work.

One way or the other, get a 4 year degree!

"Stable future" and a civilian flying career don't belong in the same discussion. You want stability and a flying career? Military is your only option.
Don't base your career choice on your success with and enjoyment of a computer game. The "idea of being a pilot" and the reality are very, very different.

There are too many reasons to list here against getting into aviation. In a nutshell:

The pay stinks and managements are usually one or two steps ahead of labor to keep it that way.

Unless you move into base (which you shouldn't really do), quality of life takes a nosedive because commuting stinks (a separate discussion altogether). Quadruple the stink factor if you are on reserve. And quadruple THAT when/if you have a family.

Good or great corporate jobs are few and far between.

I'm not trying to be Debbie Downer, just trying to be factual. Dedicate yourself to real estate and ultimately buy your own airplane to fly while you take a break from the masterpieces you create for yourself.

Why not paint planes? With all the mergers, new airlines, airlines closing, and regionals getting more mainline flying, planes are getting more face lifts than an 80 year old starlet.

Both of the "worlds" you dream of make better hobbies than careers. But at least you don't dream of acting.

go to school!!!! For Art. a degree is a degree. and while your doing that, take a few lessons and see how you like it. Take your time really learning how to fly! get your private pilots license and that’s when you'll come to that fork in the road whether to pursue aviation or something else. It took me about a yr to get mine(2 days a week while working w/ night school).
not saying FlightSaftey is bad or anything, but the time you spend during you private pilot "stage" of your training is the most important part of your training and going to a school that tells you that getting you license can take a few short months are neglecting your BASE knowledge of flying and aviation as a whole.

so my advise would be to go out to some small Po-dunk airport, find some old career flight instructor, take a few rides and see whether or not he can really pass the knowledge onto you. because having a firm basic knowledge of something as simple as how a wing creates lift is very important.

My 2 cents

Become a lawyer. They make all the money.

PaintCan: Well that is a good idea, I can also continue my art career while getting my license to fly.

LCCescapee: I agree. I have chosen two very challenging careers. I have not yet been bitten by the flying bug. I have been told that I have serious potential to sell my art and have won awards. I'm prepared for the long road, but don't you think thing in the aviation will be better in the next 5 years?

Alterbridge: Thanks for the advice, but how could someone create any money form real estate in this economy?

FlyJSH: Art is not a dream, I have friends who are not as skilled as myself and they take home over $500,000 annually. Its a demanding field and can get very boring living in your studio.

shockoe bottom: I'm getting a degree in art, I have 2 more years until I get my BA. I will definitely be on the look out for a good instructor now that you mentioned it.

JetPiedmont: I would rather take my risks doing something I enjoy, then waste my life as a lawyer. Don't take it personally or anything but law is the LAST thing I would ever what to do.

Personally, I'd go to med school, then buy an airplane. That always seems to work out pretty well.

Art will give you more options and less BS than aviation. Flying is great and its the love of the job that keeps many of us here but that is what management loves about us. By the time we make it to a major/good corporate job(if you ever do make it), were stuck and they know it. I can't tell you how many sh!t sandwiches(served piping hot by management) I had to eat to get here and how many more on their way. Fly privately and you'll be a happier camper in the twilight years. Just my humble opinion.

They always tell the new guys there is a pilot shortage but it never really seems to materialize. There are so many well qualified pilots on the streets right now its silly.

If you want to be a pilot then get started now. There’s going to be a large push starting here in the next 5 years and you don’t want to be on the back side as it will lead to being on the bottom of a pilot list and furloughed many times. If you start your flight training now you should be hired by a regional operator within the next 3-4 years. After that it shouldn’t take you more than 2-3 years to upgrade and another 2+ years to gain the valuable 121 Turbine Pilot-in-Command time needed to move on to the majors. Some say that the age 65 push won’t be that big but the fact remains and the numbers don’t lie, over 20,000 airline pilots will need to be replaced by 2021 (starting in 2011) and over 50,000 by 2031 (that's 60+% of the industry). Even if mainline reductions their operations by 10% they'll still have to replace over 15,000 pilots by 2021. You can easily see a shortage of pilots in the future when you take into account that there are only around 18,000 pilots in all of the regionals; 10+% of those regional pilots will retire and 30-40% will stay with their regional. Add to that the fact that less and less military pilots are choosing the civilian route (Uncle Sam’s paying huge retention bonuses), civil pilot training has been declining over the past 15 years and for those looking to become a future pilot financing will be harder to obtain due to the condition of our banking system.

On a side note, this industry isn’t what it once was and it will never get back. My father started flying back in the 50’s and ever since deregulation this industry has gone down the crapper. Back in the 70’s he was making the equivalent of $400K+/yr. Today, if you make it to the majors you’ll top out around $150-$250K (after 5+ years at the regionals and 12-20+ years at the majors). Not bad but remember that it’s going to cost you $60K+ just to get your licenses and then you still need a college degree to work for Mainline so add to it another $20-$40K. Regionals don’t care about a degree so you can work on one on the side after you get hired, that is if you want to move on, if you choose to stay at the regional level you’ll top out in pay around $125ish after 18+ years. Your first few years will be spent making wages between $20-$35K until you upgrade. Then you’ll be making around $60K as a new regional captain.

All in all it’s still a good career but not great. If you live in domicile, like I HIGHLY recommend, you’ll have a lot of spare time for your art. Plus being an average airline pilot pays a lot better than being an average artist.

Something else you need to keep in mind: an airline career is one big guessing game. You can get hired by an airline that goes out of business after 5 years and since your experience isn’t transferable when it comes to wages and seniority, you’ll have to start over on the bottom of someone else’s pilot list. Or you could be hired by an airline that has a great management team and expands into the next Southwest. As a pilot you have ABSOLUTELY NO control over your airlines future seeing that you’re nothing more than skilled labor. Only your Mgmnt team has control of your company’s direction.

Ever heard of Braniff International Airways (BI)? They were one of our nation’s largest airlines until 1982. Then one day my dad woke up in Chile with no job. He and his fellow pilots thought their airline was healthy only to find out otherwise. He was a Captain making BIG money and after he got home, if he wanted to continue to fly, he’d have to start all over on someone else’s list making 20% of what he was pulling at BI. In comparison, an office manager at Enron with decades of experience was able to use that experience to find another job making close to or more than he or she was before Enron’s collapse. You will not find that in this industry so be very weary and do your research before you sign on with an airline. Otherwise you may end up with a Lorenzo, Ferris, Hulas or Orenstein at the controls of your future. Being an airline pilot is like playing career roulette; one year you have a great CEO and then next the devil can take over and 5 years later your jobless. If you don’t know who Lorenzo (70's TXI, 80's NY Air & CAL, 90's EAL and then banned), Ferris (70's-80's UAL), Hulas (present day TSA : GoJet) or Orenstein (present day Mesa) are then try using the search function

Best of luck and take care.

JetJock16: That is the most realistic advice I have ever received. After my tour of FlightSaftey I will consider starting my training now. Those figures are very interesting, I cannot imagine 60% of the pilots being replaced. It's a real shame how the industry has gone down the toilet. I mean pilots are responsible for more human lives than a surgeon or a doctor and only get paid a fraction. It's really nice to get advice from real pilots, thanks.

Alterbridge: Thanks for the advice, but how could someone create any money form real estate in this economy?


There are plenty of ways to make money (don't listen to the media). Do some research and you'll see--it could actually be another outlet for your creativity as it is a necessary skill in real estate. But, contrary to what the late night TV shmoes say, it ain't get rich quick (unless you want to screw people over).

I believe you said you were 19 in your original post--what I wouldn't give to be your age again and take a different career path.

Make flying a hobby. Seriously. Learn it well, but make it a hobby.

Alterbridge: Well, I would not screw people over, thats just me. I just have so much creativity and drive burning inside me I don't want to waste it. I will research real estate, but are there any particular areas that you have in mind? Flying as a hobby seems to be the vibe I'm getting from a lot of people. I would always pursue it as a hobby, regardless of profession.

Remember that this is not the job it used to be but it is still a respectable one. In the end, if you make it to retirement, you'll realize that it's all luck. There is a bell curve and on that curve there are the lucky ones who are current mainline Captains who have had solid careers and on the other side there are those who have been furloughed 3 times and haven't make more than $40K/yr as they bounced between carriers. I wish you the best but it's truly all just dumb luck and your future position on the curve is currently unknown.

As for the retirements, take a look at this thread. It only shows the schedule for DAL (includes NWA), UAL, CAL and AA but you can see the yearly retirement numbers.
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/ma...-schedule.html

Also, when and if you start training for your future in aviation, take ownership of your choice. You are the only one who is truly responsible for your future so if you fail it’s no one else’s fault but your own. Be very picky about your flight school (many have failed and ran off with their students money, JetUniversity and Makarion come to mind) and your airline.

Here’s another link for you:
Mistakes
or
Potential

LOL! God those crack me up.

Also have you ever heard the quote, "I'd rather be a failure at something I love than a success at something I hate." .............George Burns................RIP!

How about this?
 

I,ve seen some great art in regards to aviation so give that a try .
As far as flying for a living all I can say is too each his own on that score .
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.




Fred

JetJock16: Thanks for the links, needed a good laugh. My future is in my hands, I will not allow myself to fail. "For me life is continuously being hungry. The meaning of life is not simply to exist, to survive, but to move ahead, to go up, to achieve, to conquer" A.S.

Didn't mean to imply that you would put the screws to unsuspecting folks. But there are dirtbags out there who will and won't think twice about it--all for the quick, easy buck.

For starters, check out a website called realestateinvestor.com. There are a few tons of information/education on that website (although more and more it seems to be another venue for some folks to advertise the products/services they have to sell. If you look beyond all that you'll see that there is a terrific amount of info on this site. Things like wholesaling, lease-options, short sales--odds are that you haven't heard of any of these things and that's ok.) Plenty of real estate investing blogs out there as well with some real life experiences.

I suspect that if you can channel some of your drive and sit down for a couple of hours a day and read and learn about real estate stuff for the next few weeks/months and then take action on what you have learned, you will be very well postioned (enviably so) to be financially free by age 30 if not sooner (just my opinion).

Now, I am FAR from a real estate expert, but I truly think that this is a wonderful time to, at the very least, do some serious research in this field to see if it might interest you.

Nice, I live my life based upon the three fundamental choices:

Adapt, Move or Die

The choice is always yours and if you ever have any questions feel free to PM me. I won't boost your ego and I'll always shoot you straight.

Best of luck my friend.

He makes a good point.

If you want to simulate a week in the life of a pilot, take that flight sim and try this:

Regional Pilot:

Get up at 0400 on Monday and dress for work. Since you probably don't live in your base, you will need to commute. Hop on a city bus and ride it around town for a few hours (keep in mind, each bus you get on MUST have an open seat, otherwise, you must wait for the next). This is your commute.

Okay, so now around 1500, go back home, hop on that computer, and start your trip. Fly four legs, each an hour long, in real time. Prior to each leg, go out to your car, check the oil, tires, and coolant level (to simulate a preflight), then balance your checkbook (to simulate filling out a manifest). Try to finish these four legs in and the other tasks by 2100 when you are released from duty.

Now you have 10 hours of rest. Stand outside for 15 minutes, then drive 15 minutes to your "hotel" (any place that isnt home), and enjoy your time off.

Day two show time is 0700, so get up, dress, eat, etc., then head drive back to that computer to be on time. Today you have seven one hour legs with departures at 0800, 0930, 1115, 1245, 1415, 1555, and 1720. Remember to preflight and fill out that manifest each leg. At 1835, duty out and drive to that hotel.

Day three show time is 0530. Seven more legs today. You are scheduled to be done at 1700, but the weather has gotten crappy. Your second leg departs 90 minutes late. Also, extend the taxi time of the fifth and sixth legs by 30 minutes. You finally duty out at 1945.

Head to that hotel.

Day four show time is 0400. Had you stayed on time yesterday, you would have had 11 hours of rest, but becuase you finished late, you only had 8:15. Between the drive to and from the hotel, your need to eat a meal or two, and time required to shave, shower, and s@@t, you net about four hours of sleep. The good news is you only have five legs and the weather has cleared. Things go well, and you finish up around 1300. At last your trip is done.

All you need to do, is commute home. Hop on that city bus for another four hours, then head home.

Corporate pilot:

Monday morning your boss wants to depart at 0800, so have everything ready by then. He shows at 0810, and you are wheels up by 0815 for the 1:30 hour flight. His meeting will take all afternoon, so plan a 1700 departure. During the dead time, go sit at your local FBO. Fill your time by reading, watching tv, dozing, or playing on your laptop. The boss gets back at 1730, and you get back to base by 1900. Post flight, drive home and you are home by 2000.

Tuesday's departure is 0800 again. At 0930, you get a call from the boss saying the flight is canceled today. Reschedule it for tomorrow.

Wednesday 0800 you depart on time for a 45 minute flight. The boss wants to return at 1500. Around noon, you walk over to the BBQ place across the street for lunch. Just as your food arrives, your phone rings: the meeting was cut short, he is at the airport and wants to leave now. You box up your lunch and jog back to the plane, rush through a preflight and fly home.

Thursday, departure is scheduled for 1200, returning at 1700. Sitting in the FBO, the clock passes, 1700, 1800, and 1900. At 1925, the boss shows (he decided to take the client out to dinner). You fly home, put the plane to bed and are done by 2100.

Friday, no flights.

Saturday starts a three day weekend. The boss wants you to fly him and "a couple friends" to Vail to go hiking. The plan is to leave at 0800 for the 3:50 flight. When the gang arrives, "a couple of friends" ends up being seven people eiach with a couple hundred pounds of gear. Luckily, you expected this and didn't fuel the plane. As you load the bags, the fueler arrives and you tell him half tanks. At the same time, you tell your boss that a fuel stop is required. He understands, but one guy (a pre solo pilot) chimes in with, "I thought this thing could make it all the way there on one tank." You explain the weight issue to him and he gets it. But, having done such a good job teaching him weight and balance, he decides he wants to ride in the right seat. He does, and for the entire flight, he bugs you with questions and his own "expertise". You spend the weekend in a hotel, while your budies back home are having cook outs.

What he said.

What he didn't say was all the crap that you could experience on those 7 leg days (by the way, when was the last time you ate?).

Or about missing your commute home and having to spend hours of wasted time in a grubby crash pad with some log-sawing SOBs.

Great post.

Real Career
 

Learn how to make a real living first. Then goof off with flying or art. Neither really offer any stability.

Skyhigh

Thanks. I would have said more, but I didnt want to be pessimistic. ;)

FLYjsh.... That Was CLASSIC.......:D

Justin,

All the above advice is spot on as far as the industry these days. The only thing I would add is, if after you tour Flight Safety, see if you can get a (Discovery) flight I believe it's called to see how you like being in a plane. If you decide that a flying career is what you truly want, then the next step is getting the best training for the money.

Two bits of advice that I recieved when I was in your shoes that I'll pass on to you.

1) Flight Safety is a great Flight School but it does come a a rather high price. If your family can afford the costs up front thats great no prob. However, there are many flight schools in your area that offer flight training at significantly lower prices.

2) MULTI ENGINE TIME IS EVERYTHING!!!! Get as much as you can!!! Most professional flying jobs (but not all) involve operating twin engine aircraft, wether it be a light prop, corporate turbo prop, regional jets etc.., you get the picture. Many of the first companies that you will fly for are looking at you multi-engine flying experience.., the more the better. 100 hrs ME time is usually the minimum so again the more the better! Look for Schools that offer a multi engine flight training program. ATP and Ariben Aviator come to mind.

If you haven't done so already, take a look at the "Airline Profiles" link on the right side of the APC home page. Look at the hiring minimums for Cargo, Part 135, Regional Carriers. It'll be difficult to find because few are hiring right now but they are there.

A good example I drew at random was Compass Airlines
They are a regional Jet Carrier that operates the Embrear 175. As you scroll down the screen look under the "Hiring" Tab and you might find this type of info...

Minimums:
1,500 TT : (Means 1500hrs (TT) TOTAL flying TIME required)

1,000 ME: (ME means Multi Engine Time required)

Eligible for ATP: Basically means that you need to have passed your Airline Transport Pilot Written Test.

Current class 1: You have a current Class one Flight Physical

Again this is just an example but it gives you an idea of where you need to be in order for this carrier to even consider you as a hiring candidate. There are many other carriers who's hiring mins will vary higher or lower so look around, do your research. Once you begin flight training, you'll learn much more about the industry from other students/Instructors and so on.

Finally, you should pursue a NON-AVIATION 4 yr degree (ART perhaps). This way if the flying thing doesn't work out or a furlough come's along.., you have a back up profession to fall back on ; ) The 4 yr degree also fills the "Degree" square in your resume when you are looking for jobs at the Major Carriers years from now. In any event it's a good thing to have to be competitive for hiring.

Another great website that I received tons of great advice was "JetCareers.com" Best of luck to you, Justin! If you have any other questions feel free to PM me, I'll be happy to answer them. Take care.

FlyJSH: If things were that bad for my entire career I would probably jump off a cliff or a plane...lol.

SkyHigh: I'm now looking at real estate, among other areas.

FlyJSHL: Some of you guys make it sound like aviation is a miserable profession.

Beechlover: Thanks. I will ask about the discovery. Some of the cheaper schools seem more like "pilot factories". I did not know pilots needed so much time on multi, thanks for enlightening me. I really don't know much about the business. I'm working on my 4 yr and I'm majoring in art, but I still have time to change my major...But, I really don't know how valuable a business degree is these days?

Yes, once airlines start hiring they will be holding strong to their hiring mins. At SkyWest we require 1000 total time, 100 hours of multi and a current 1st class medical; that's the minimum. There are many pros and cons to pilot factories, one pro is that if and when you start instructing for them you’ll build hours very quick. Over 80+% of many pilot factories students are foreign, it’s MUCH cheaper to train in the US with our civil system than anywhere else (Asia and Europe send thousands and thousands of students to the US each year for training). These foreign students are more challenging due to their poor communication skills but these students are on strict schedules and require constant teaching. If you start instructing for a pilot factory like Pan Am in Phoenix you’ll log almost 100 hours of flight time a month. Most of my friends who instructed at Pan Am easily topped 100 and sometimes pushed 120+/month. After a year or so you’ll be more than competitive for the regionals (probably sitting around 1500 TT & 250 Multi+). Bad part about a pilot factory is that they really don’t care about anyone other than their contracts. As an instructor they want you to work as hard as you can for as long as you can; no if’s, and’s or but’s (LOL!, that will prepare you for the airlines).

JC, I love random schedules and what FlyJsh is stating is not the norm. I average 14+ hours on overnights and 4.5+ legs a day. If you fly for Great Lakes then yes you’ll see a lot of 8 leg days. 7 & 8 leg days are not the norm at SkyWest even on our Turbo-Prop. You will have a few but they are far between. Most SKW TP 4 day trips only average 16-18 legs (pays around 20 on average) with the really high paying (22+ hours) ones topping 20 legs.

I bid a.m. trips so 90% of my trips start around 5 in the morning but I’m done by 2 or 3 in the afternoon. Plus with a.m. trips you tend to avoid most of the long delays that come as the day progresses.

There’s a bell curve for everything, on one side is the bad and the other the good. Remember that you will always here more bad than good because we all love to complain. It's not all peaches and cream but it's nowhere as bad as many make it out to be. The question is ……… do you like consistently random schedules with lots of change that have to be ran on time (LOL!)? If not then don't become an airline pilot.

What do you call a commuter pilot, or an artist, without a girlfriend???


HOMELESS!!



Go fly for the military for a couple of years.. it'll be the coolest ride you can imagine :)

Military is the most difficult aviation to qualify for. From my research, hardly any of the applicants ever get off the ground. Your definition of "coolest ride" does not fit mine, as I'm not looking for sheer excitement. I have no interest in flying for the military. Many of my family and friends are very successful in many careers, including art. An artist I have known makes more money than any doctor or lawyer and none of them are homeless. J. Lipking (artist)

JetJock16: "The question is ……… do you like consistently random schedules with lots of change that have to be ran on time (LOL!)? If not then don't become an airline pilot."

I worked for a company that always put employees on-call, I hated always having my life in a random flux. Are pilots that work for, say, Virgin Atlantic on the same type of odd scheduling or is that a regional thing?

Yes even mainline is random. One week your trip could start on Thursday at 5 am and end on Sunday at 8 pm. Your second trip might start on Wednesday at 1 pm and end on Saturday at 10 pm. Then you may have 5 days off with another trip that starts at 8 pm on Friday and ends on Monday at 10 am.

Basically your start and end times are almost never the same. Some trips may run with all early shows on all 4 days and your next trip might have 1 early show, 1 mid morning (say 10ish) and the other 2 days might be late shows around 2pm +. Bottom line is it's random but if you’re a line holder then you were able to bid on your schedule so you will know what your month will look like well in advance. You’ll know when your trips start and end and if they are a.m. or p.m. trips.

Now if you're on reserve you're on-call and at the mercy of the company, after-all a reserve pilot is one of the most junior pilots on the list and expected to be used by the airline to fill in the gaps. You might have a reserve schedule that's Sunday through Thursday from 4 am to 4 pm or 9 am to 9 pm. You'll sit at home or at a "crashpad" until you're called in. Your airline will expect you to be fit to fly and ready to fly whenever they need you. After you are contacted you will normally have 2 hours to report to the airport where you could be scheduled to deadhead (ride in the back with the passengers) to a location and then fly one leg back. Sometimes you'll get 2, 3 or 4 day trips but usually it something out and back. Reserve pilot normally only get 10 days off per month where lineholders usually get 14+. Life on reserve sucks but it doesn't last, you will get a line sooner or later.

Also, as a junior pilot don't expect weekends or holidays off until you're at least half way up the line holder list. Until then you will get a random weekend off here and there but nothing consistent.

JCharlton: The synopsis listed a page or two back by FlyJSH, although a funny read, is 100% accurate. There is nothing there that is not the truth. He actually left out some stuff, like if you were on reserve living out of base, you would have to commute to a crash pad the night before or the day of (if you are lucky). First year pay is less than $20k/year at the regionals. If you go corporate, you will be on call ALL THE TIME in most cases.

Even at the major airlines schedules are consistently changing. You could have a report time of 1300 on day one with a 2100 release and an 0500 report the next day. Dont expect weekends off or a consistent schedule at the airlines unless you are in the top 2-5% of your seat's seniority list. This can take 10-30 years depending on a lot of factors.

I am 24 and have too much invested to turn my back right now, I'm still going to try to give it a go in this industry.... time will only tell if it will be a good decision. Flying is a great job, but a horrible career.

Fair enough. Your company/seniority/base/situation is better than mine. I am glad somebody has it better than I. ;)

What I can speak to is my company and my base. The line in my simulation would have gone to a very senior person because it was "commutable" (late first day show, early end on the last day) and had 23 hours of credit (lots of flying and no long sits). At my base, we have about 45 crews. Looking at this month's bid package, of those 45 lines (monthly schedules):

* 10-12 were four day "commutable" trips (like in the simulation). Very senior lines.
* 8-10 were four day trips with all oh-dark-thirty showtimes (good for non-commuters, only okay for commuters since they only spend one day in the crashpad).
* 8-10 were a mish-mash of day trips (horrible for commuters), two days, three days, and random strings
* 5 were "stand-ups" aka "high speeds". A stand up is the last flight in the evening and the first flight out in the morning with 3-6 hours at the hotel (unless a plane breaks and you need to do a repo flight, then you can be up all night). Each stand-up is ONE 12-14 hour duty period. They are about as bad for a commuter as day trips.
* 10 were reserve lines (pilot is on call with a 90 minute call out time). They were about equally split between oh-dark-thirty starts, 1000 starts, and stand-ups. Reserve lines are generally awarded to the most junior.

Of all the lines, only about 15 had at least three weekends off.


I am a lucky guy because I am so senior, I can bid on, and be awarded my choice of reserve lines! :D I don't care about flight time and my guarantee will pay my bills (no wife, no kids, no car payment, efficiency apartment in base), so I mostly bid stand-ups (I like working the back side of the clock) or a better reserve line. It works for me, but my situation is a rare one.

JCarlton, I am not saying don't become a pilot, I just want you to know what the real life is like. Flying planes is a blast, but working the job is hard.

Good luck,
JSH

I believe all of you, its a little worse than I thought. I not giving up that easily though : ) I really appreciate all the advice and information I have been provided here.


Question: Attending FlightSaftey Academy or Embry-Riddle, would that speed up and open opportunities for a better position with an airline? I don't want to be jumping puddles for more time than necessary.

Virgin Atlantic bids on a 3-month cycle...!