11,700 hours for captain
 

I noticed in the some of the articles about the Air France flight that the captain had about 11,700 and around 1500 in the A330. Is that number of total hours small for a captain flying transoceanic passenger flights? I don't know so that's why I'm asking. Just to prevent any confusion, I'm not trying to conclude the captain lacked appropriate experience either. I just saw that number and would have thought a captain would have had more total time considering about 750 hours a year are flown. Just wondering.

Not at all. Some will have less some more at that point in their career.

Say he did fly 750 hours a year That is 15.6 years flying experience. Lets knock off say 1500 hours for time he had before getting hired at Air France that is still 13.6 years line experience at Air France. And that is assuming that he flew an average of 750 hours a year. Which is a bit high given vacation time sick leave training etc.

I did a little research on this. He had 11K with AF. I believe he was with Air Inter prior to this. Came to AF in 1988 or so. I would assume his total time was above 15K, at a min.
Experience was not this issue.

I just read an article that said he may have been in the bunk..Wouldn't make any difference what kind of time he had from there.

Well, he's certainly been a pilot for many years. As a European pilot, he's most likely to have logged most of that time in International overwater ops.

Make no mistake, his training was very indepth particularly when it comes to international ops and route climatology.

AL

To add to that, after a certain point, additional hours under the belt does not indicate the quality of the pilot. Like my instructor used to say, when you flew last is more important at that point. However, experience is clearly not an issue in this case. Both pilots were experienced pilots.
But, that does not preclude pilot error because even experienced pilots do make mistakes.

Not to mention if he had been doing long hauls since he started flying the 330, he's probably not flying more that 30-50 hours a month. Thats a lot of overseas flying to get to 1500.

I began with the assumption he started at Air France with somewhere around 3000 hours. If he had been hired in 1988 and averaged 750 hours, he would have logged close to 15,000 hours, 18,000 total. Of course, I don't know what the work rules for Air France are so that can have a big impact.

The number just sounded a bit low for a captain, but I was only wondering about the total number of hours, not how or if it related to the accident. Thanks for the information.

I'd be willing to bet he was asleep (probably not anymore after the bumps started) or at least relaxing back in the back at the time of the accident.

I find it almost humorous the speculation that he had "low time" and that 11,000 hours whether or not that is total time is low....

hiring / flight times are different in Europe vs the US
many pilots there get hired with a major (AF, BA,...) right after flight school and an "ab initio" program. I have met quite a few pilots there getting hired with a European carrier at 3/400 hrs..
the FAA vs JAA ATPL is a different ball game too but that's another debate :)
So if he got hired at 350 hrs and flew 65 hrs a month on average that s 15 years with 2 years on the A330

For whats its worth, I've flown only 200 hours this year..I'll be lucky to hit 500 hours by the end of December.

At my rate I'd have 22 years experience...

Ab-initio guys get hired at the regionals and the low cost carriers. Getting hired at the majors is a different story!

Ab initio is a very demanding and proven track but it's rare these days.

I doubt AF was his first gig!



Al

From what I can gather, he was at Air Inter prior to Air France. (Not his first gig at all)

I don't know how this thread drifted to this topic but this is not entirely true. Lufthansa and British Airways have had Ab Initio programs for years and have hired new pilots with very little time to fly their mainline jets.

Not that it's important, but someone made a comparison and the subject was raised.

Ba has run Ab initio programs for years but most of their pilots come from other carriers. Ab initio classes are rare and the numbers are very limited.

Either way, the direct entry or ab initio route to IOE completion is no walk in the park by any standards.


I don't think many AF pilots are ab initio either. The AF pilots were well trained and experienced but still subject to the elements of the SHEL model.


AL

I just sat up front on Iberia/KLM flights and was talking to the f/0's.......both were full ab-initio and they stated the majority of new entrants are. 11,000+ hrs is a good bit of time for an EU pilot, my good friend at Lufthansa flies about 8 out-n-backs a month (about 4 hrs of flying a day).

We've got guys upgrading to captain on the 777 and A330 with 6000 total time. The provision is that there is a minimum of 4000 jet and 1000 in type. So it's not unusual to have sub-10,000 hour pilots in command of an intl. widebody.

With Air France work rules I doubt he'd fly more than 500 hours per year. The French love their vacation time.


Typhoonpilot

Thanks for all of the comments. As I said, I wasn't trying to draw a conclusion about the captain's total time and the accident. I saw the 11,000 number and thought it to be lower than I would have though, but many have explained that number is not low and how hiring in Europe can be different than in the US. Thanks again.