I can see his logic. The logic is i.e., "make it easier to get us young, junior regional F/O's to the majors and then we wont have to be RJ captains". Of course, that wont solve the problem because there are only enough major airline seats to go around (about 1 for every 50 applicants in GOOD times, let alone bad), so there will always be a pipline of pilots languishing behind to fill in those RJ slots.

Unfortunately, economics has taken control and the cancer has spread way too far now. Treatment and cure were 12-15 years ago, but the patients scoffed, snorted and refused to admit a disease was in progress among them.

Now many of the younger, newer pilots at the regionals are slowly coming to the conclusion how bleak the future will be for major airline opportunites and desperation is taking hold.

I think the next suggestion of a "plan" to solve this problem will be, "please, please just hire me and I'll be your friend and fight this scurge with you !!!".

Businessmen (which is what airline management is) are guided by economics and profit, not be emotional pleading from one employee to other employees. That has never changed anything and never will.

The final train wreck seems inevitable and the only question is where will YOU be sitting during the collision ?

What is the difference between becoming PIC on a CRJ, E-190 or an MD80? Yes, an MD80 has more people on board, but what decisions are different? A PIC on anything has to make the same decisions about fuel, wx, mtx, crew, pax, etc. Just because your PIC on a MD80 makes these decisions any harder? Who has the most experience - A 9 year Eagle FO or a two year GOJet PIC? Yes, the GoJet PIC has more experience in the left seat, but who has seen more? Emergencies, wx, unrulely pax, etc. After a few years PIC is just a seniority bonus. Besides, the large regional jets are doing THE EXACT SAME FLYING as the mainline MD80, 737 guys. The only difference is pay, benefits. SO what is the difference if you upgrade into a E-175/190 or a 737?

Given ALL that...

Why would you exclude business aviation pilots from major airline jobs in your grand scheme to "save the profession"?

The majority of major carriers prefer that when a pilot upgrades to captain there, that he/she has experienced the command responsibilities of transport or high performance military aircraft before. All things considered, they generally would prefer that someones first taste of command not be in their large airline aircraft. There are exceptions as plenty of pilots have gone from regional F/O to a major carrier (even without ANY real PIC, i.e., interns), but from a competitive standpoint, they want as much experiece as they can get. In reality, your experience only gets you in the door. It's YOU that gets you the job and that is another reason why even though many WILL have that PIC, they will never get the "golden handshake". Again, the odds are not in your favor, but by all means go for it if you want it, but understand that 8 out of 10 qualified applicants wont get there, simply due to lack of available positions.

With the up and coming exposion of stand alone regionals operating large RJ's, there will be even fewer than in the past. It's that way with everything in life.The airline indistry is likely to return to the days of yesteryear where you had International and transcon "trunk" carreirs like TWA and United and "feeder" airlines, like Piedmont, Ozark, North Central, Allegheny, PSA, Southern, Mohawk, Airwest, etc. These carriers flew turboprops (CV-580, FH-227, etc.) and smaller jets like DC-9's, 737's, F-28's on strictly domestic short/medium haul routes. Soon you'll likely have another group of new "feeder" airlines that are again "stand alone" doing this flying with 100-seat jets and the majors are likely to revert to International, longrange domestic/transcon and certain other routes that will retain profitability. They'll be much smaller then now.

The writing is on the wall, but good luck in your goal.

Welcome to the Dark Side, Boiler!

SENIORITY SYSTEM in its current form is the root of all evils that plague this industry.

Stop and think about it...

When it comes to how much money you make, what is the one and ONLY thing that matters? Your qualifications? Your experience? Or is it only your date-of-hire?

Can you make a lateral move down the road in your career?

I'd love to fly for a regional in the US again. I was a regional captain 7 years ago, and look very fondly on those times. But quite frankly, I can't afford to, and I value my experience more than $20/hour. There are many others just like myself... but we are "irrelevant."

The whole system needs a major overhaul. Not just scope clauses, PIC requirements, etc.

There is nothing legally that excludes a pilot from being hired at a major with no real PIC time. What is excluding them is the shear number of qualified applicants. There are literally hundreds of qualified applicants for each opening for a major carrier. It's simply the law of supply and demand...... If the pool of highly qualified applicants ever dries up you will see the PIC requirement cease.

Well the concept has been around for years. In Europe, at least… oh wait… in the US too. Can you say Ab-initio?

There are people, 200 hour, who are assessed by an airline, then acquire type ratings on the 737 or Airbus, under a pilot cadet program. I know of some who, after 4 years with a particular carrier are already acquiring their command upgrade. Investment is pretty steep, but there is sight at the end of the tunnel for an upgrade.


By the way...Gulfstream had a similar program in the 90's... where some pilots found their way to CAL mainline.

Why would the "mainline mgt" ever want to agree on doing this?? How would that benefit them in their current M.O.'s?? A few reasons come to mind as to why it does not so 'easily' happen.....

**Mgt presently has a well constructed whipsaw in place between several groups. This is 'conveniently' there to impose the preverbal beatings till moral improves....don't think this is just coincidence.

**In having a seperate regional partner, Mgt already has cheaper/willing labor force established under a separate CBA (Take AMR EGL vs AA) to fly routes. Again, this enables Mgt to have a strong hand at the table in any type of future negotiations. Not the end all to be all, but again, bows well in Mgt's court.

**Would honestly like to see how the 'seniority' integration would work under one list (regional/mainline becoming "one"). Flow through?? We have seen just how well those have worked over the last decade. Ratio?? The 20+ yr RJ driver would get stapled to the bottom of the company 'master list'??? Or is he/she put ahead of a 10 yr mainline pilot??? I don't think that would go over too smoothly on either side of the fence.....not saying this is 100% impossible, BUT difficult at best when looking at the concept of bring together two groups.

It would be a nice 'pipedream', but there are a lot of moving parts that complicate the idea beyond simply making them into "one".

Or a Caravan, or King Air. Oh yeah, those folks DO the calculations and FILE the flight plan.

And some of us did the hiring. The reason for published minimums is to cut down on the number of resumes. We only hired folks who were most qualified, so why weed through 80 gazillion "I got a pulse and a ticket" applications.

But what do I know, I have zero shiny jet time.