United Airlines Announces Launch of Senior Se
12-31-2009, 03:45 AM
#11
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Posts: 520
Originally Posted by contrail67
About 2 weeks ago United announced they are seeking bids for 100 seat aircraft....if the notes are for aircraft, logic would lead one to believe the money would go towards 100 seaters....not 70-90's, but in either case....ALL flown by mainline.
they better be
12-31-2009, 05:26 AM
#12
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Originally Posted by UAL T38 Phlyer
I see two possibilities:
1. Using the money from this offer, United acquires 70-90 seat RJs to fill the void of the 737s and starts doing some "Mainline" RJ flying to actually serve smaller markets and grow the business. They make money, and are able to pay back the notes.
2. They blow the money and buy RJs for affiliated carriers, pay a "per departure" fee that actually makes it more expensive than Mainline, lose money, and start selling off routes, equipment, facilities, and shrinking the business.....
United became huge after profitting from Pan Am's blunder in a similar fashion. I hope it doesn't happen again, with UAL in the role of PAA.
1. Using the money from this offer, United acquires 70-90 seat RJs to fill the void of the 737s and starts doing some "Mainline" RJ flying to actually serve smaller markets and grow the business. They make money, and are able to pay back the notes.
2. They blow the money and buy RJs for affiliated carriers, pay a "per departure" fee that actually makes it more expensive than Mainline, lose money, and start selling off routes, equipment, facilities, and shrinking the business.....
United became huge after profitting from Pan Am's blunder in a similar fashion. I hope it doesn't happen again, with UAL in the role of PAA.
12-31-2009, 05:30 AM
#13
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Position: 737
Posts: 190
Will anyone lender actually work with an EETC after United tried to void them in their last bankruptcy? EETCs had a lower interest rate when they were less risky. Since the latest rounds of bankruptcy, I'd guess that assumption is no longer a solid bet--and corporate bonds is all UAL can sell.
Past actions have consequences--something bankruptcy lawyers often forget.
Past actions have consequences--something bankruptcy lawyers often forget.
12-31-2009, 06:57 AM
#14
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Originally Posted by rickt86
I guess I will type how y'all want it, MY GUESSES TO THE OP ARE:
1. UAL is RUNNING OUT OF MONEY, and if they CAN NOT raise capital, will file CH 11 AGAIN
2.They need CAPITAL for the 787/airbuses they claim to be adding to the fleet over the next few years
3. and this one I like the most, they want capital for the mergers/buy outs that Tilton is obsessed with seeing all over the US airline industry, IE UAL wants to merge with CAL, and this will require some serious CASH ON HAND
BASICALLY, the only thing that has keep UAL in business since 2002 is the fact they mortgaged everything they owned, basically putting them XXbillion in debt, which MEANS, all those creditors have spent twice as much as they originally gave them in hopes they recover and pay it all back
ITS LIKE, someone on a blackjack table that loses $500, after betting $50 a hand, and instead of walking away, starts betting $100 a hand in hopes of winning back what they lost.....double or nothin
1. UAL is RUNNING OUT OF MONEY, and if they CAN NOT raise capital, will file CH 11 AGAIN
2.They need CAPITAL for the 787/airbuses they claim to be adding to the fleet over the next few years
3. and this one I like the most, they want capital for the mergers/buy outs that Tilton is obsessed with seeing all over the US airline industry, IE UAL wants to merge with CAL, and this will require some serious CASH ON HAND
BASICALLY, the only thing that has keep UAL in business since 2002 is the fact they mortgaged everything they owned, basically putting them XXbillion in debt, which MEANS, all those creditors have spent twice as much as they originally gave them in hopes they recover and pay it all back
ITS LIKE, someone on a blackjack table that loses $500, after betting $50 a hand, and instead of walking away, starts betting $100 a hand in hopes of winning back what they lost.....double or nothin
#2 is off a bit........the initial cash deposit was small and deliveries won't even START until 2016.....
All things 787: United Airlines buys 25 787s and 25 A350
12-31-2009, 07:27 AM
#15
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Posts: 1,619
Originally Posted by Bwipilot
Will anyone lender actually work with an EETC after United tried to void them in their last bankruptcy? EETCs had a lower interest rate when they were less risky. Since the latest rounds of bankruptcy, I'd guess that assumption is no longer a solid bet--and corporate bonds is all UAL can sell.
Past actions have consequences--something bankruptcy lawyers often forget.
Past actions have consequences--something bankruptcy lawyers often forget.
12-31-2009, 09:15 AM
#16
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Position: forever fo
Posts: 2,413
Originally Posted by Cycle Pilot
Skywest never flew J-41's... 
You mean E-120's...
Very good post, by the way!
You mean E-120's...Very good post, by the way!
12-31-2009, 09:36 AM
#17
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Position: 737 FO
Posts: 260
Every time I read something about United leveraging even more of their assets, I keep hearing that Door's song:
This is the end
Beautiful friend
This is the end
My only friend, the end
Of our elaborate plans, the end
Of everything that stands, the end
No safety or surprise, the end
This is the end
Beautiful friend
This is the end
My only friend, the end
Of our elaborate plans, the end
Of everything that stands, the end
No safety or surprise, the end
12-31-2009, 09:59 AM
#18
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Position: Le Bus
Posts: 382
Originally Posted by QCappy
Every time I read something about United leveraging even more of their assets, I keep hearing that Door's song:
This is the end
Beautiful friend
This is the end
My only friend, the end
Of our elaborate plans, the end
Of everything that stands, the end
No safety or surprise, the end
This is the end
Beautiful friend
This is the end
My only friend, the end
Of our elaborate plans, the end
Of everything that stands, the end
No safety or surprise, the end
12-31-2009, 10:03 AM
#19
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Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 260
Originally Posted by SOTeric
nice....the loss of thousands of front-line jobs...you know, people like you.
If you look at their financial data you will see that they are over 130% leveraged right now. In case you don't know, that's not good. The more you leverage, the harder it gets to overcome the debt. Of course I wouldn't expect many people in this country to understand that since most are in debt up to their ears.
12-31-2009, 11:39 AM
#20
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Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,545
There seem to be a lot of experts that are saying United is among (if not the) best positioned airline when the economy recovers. After all, last time the economy was roaring (late 90's), which airline was doing the best?
It doesn't bother me one bit when people underestimate it. It just further undervalues the stock price, and allows people who are smart to profit from the success of a good airline.
It doesn't bother me one bit when people underestimate it. It just further undervalues the stock price, and allows people who are smart to profit from the success of a good airline.
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