My take on all of it is a possible Supreme Court submission that in the end and finally will define Date of Hire for folks in the business. It needs to happen and I'm gratefull to the AAA pilots for taking on the core issue of many past battles. I think they are a stand-up group. They have been through more than any pilot group and understand what is at stake here.

Maybe the time has come that DOH is history and the union concept too. Clearly this is not a pro-union website.

 

"Date of Hire" needs no further definition (and certainly not by the Supreme Court)....
And I would think a "stand-up group" would honor their own word, no?

 

My personal opinion is that the SC will refuse to hear it, if it gets that far. There is no way this case impacts a majority of the population, therefore, they will take a pass, and it will finally end there.

I wonder what USAPA's gameplan will be then. Kinda to hard appeal a loss at the SC.

 

How does agreeing to binding arbitration and then challenging the decision, make you a "stand up group?"

 

Do you mean the language that states the pay rates will be reduced until 12-31-09? Yep that ending date sure seems pretty weak.

It would if won give the "East pilots only" a raise because it is a function of the East contract.

You would think that as confident you are the East will lose the seniority fight and Nic will be implemented, you would want the East to win the LOA 93 pay dispute. Then when we do get a new contract the West would also have a new higher starting point for those negotiations.
I know its in vogue to hate the East on these boards but dont cut off your nose to spite your face

 

What most people seem to forget is that the company accepted the arbitrated seniority list as set forth in the Nicolau Award. That was done prior to USAPA. USAPA was formed to overturn or otherwise get out from that list but every legal precedent has set forth that the list after being accepted by the company is binding. The list is the list - everything being done now is just posturing.

Those standup guys also screwed the Empire guys, tried to screw the Piedmont guys and the Trump Shuttle guys and they lost every battle that went to court. Yes, they stand up for selfish and short sighted attitudes. We have management that routinely violates both contracts because we have a toothless union. We have no union legal advice we can count on, unlike with ALPA, we have lost our ALPA insurance poicies, we do not have the safety structure we had under ALPA, and, most importantly, we have lost adult supervision over the union. We have F/Os getting paid captain wages on flight pay loss, union officials driving new SUVs provided by the union, and we pay the highest union dues/agency fees for any independent union - 1.95 percent. They have managed to run up over $25 million dollars in legal fees in the last 2 years, suing fellow pilots.

Stand up guys my ass.

 

If they won that would be great. They just don't have a very good chance of being sucessfull. I think we're tired of watching the union give our dues money to lawyers to fight impossible battles.

 

If someone were to ask me what happened to the profession, I would present this post.

It's more than I am able to explain to but it is clear to me as a 35 year+ "Line Pilot" what gave management thier power.

When I started reading post like this on the internet by pilots 20 or so years ago, I knew we were toast.

You are the problem. You stand for nothing other than your personal gain.

This slaughter of our lifestyle was allowed to happen by the weak.

 

Were you logged in to a DOD computer in 1990? I didn't realize you and Al Gore had such a grasp on Internet things back then... I don't even think 14.4k modems were on the market in 1990

 

You miss the point and the topic was not technology. Is flying a hobby for you? Are you a real commited career pilot? What do you personaly have invested in the profession?

Or are you part of the lowest common denominator we have all come down to the last 20 years????????????