Originally Posted by teddyballgame (Post 1279438)

Not too deep at all. In fact, I think you've hit the nail right on the head.

Obviously, pilots are free to make whatever wardrobe choices their companies allow.

What amuses (and saddens) me is the number of pilots who think they are somehow "getting over" by not having to wear a hat anymore; when in fact, the hats optional policy at several carriers was merely a bone that was thrown to the pilots by the managements who were pillaging their pay, benefits, and pensions.

I've had colleagues at two carriers tell me that the policy came from pilots not wearing hats to "protest" their treatment in bankruptcy. So management just came back and said, "Okay, from now on, hats are optional."

So much for the big protest.

The same thing applies, at least at a couple of airlines, to those dork..., I mean "cool-looking" leather jackets. On one property, that was the crumb that was flicked to the pilots after their pension was stolen.

And the fools had to pay 400 bucks out of their own pockets for the jackets!

"Yep, I may have had my pay and benefits slashed, and had my pension stolen, but hey, I get to wear this swell leather jacket, and I don't have to wear a hat anymore. Yessir, I'm really sticking it to the man!"

Umm... no you're not.

Originally Posted by LeftWing (Post 1279412)

>Businessmen don't wear stripes on their sleeves and shirts
>We're not businessmen
>We're not even really white collar (not saying we're blue collar either)

We are crewmembers that operates machinery.

Originally Posted by Ottopilot (Post 1279469)

This isn't rocket science. You are hired by a company. Your employer has a uniform policy. You follow that policy.

This doesn't not make you a "company man" or "cool aid drinker". It makes you an employee. Not following the policy makes you unprofessional. It does not help any cause you might have.

Originally Posted by Airway (Post 1279488)

I hope you felt the same way about unfulfilled obligations from management. All this belly aching from both sides about hats.. Some people like wearing them because they like the way it looks, or because they're bald, or because they have some insecurities--and some people hate wearing it because they look goofy with it, or because they don't like hat-head, or because they don't like having stuff on their head, whatever, but this could all be solved if you give them the option. If wearing a hat makes you feel special, by all means buy one. Otherwise leave the rest of us alone.

For what it's worth, ever since hats went optional at my airline a year ago, I have only seen 2 people wearing them. That should tell you something.

And as far as all this "professionalism" talk, yes, you should wear a clean uniform at work, but doing so will not compensate for poor flying technique and judgment. I've flown with great pilots with wrinkles in their shirts and scuffed shoes, and awful pilots with atrocious work habits wearing crispy pressed uniforms and glossy shoes.

Originally Posted by tsquare (Post 1279509)

Your argument is ridiculous. Leave you alone? While I might personally leave you alone, the company has every right to expect and demand that you wear the uniform in it's prescribed manner. You do NOT have the right to defy that and leave your hat at home because it makes you look goofy or whatever lame reason you have for not doing so. What I find interesting in your missive is what I have bolded above. Are you saying that you do not own one? Just a friendly suggestion. Buy one. And not because it makes you feel special or whatever. Because if the company decides to press the issue and start fining guys and/or sending them.... YOU... home, what is your argument gonna be? Like purple drank are you gonna demand that DALPA defend you? What will be your defense for openly defying company policy? Your previous airline made them optional and few pilots still wear them. And that is relevant here... how? It is the company's perogative to make them optional, not yours or mine. Until they do...

I agree with you concerning piloting skills, but neither argument has anything to do with the other.

Originally Posted by Ottopilot (Post 1279469)

This isn't rocket science. You are hired by a company. Your employer has a uniform policy. You follow that policy.

This doesn't not make you a "company man" or "cool aid drinker". It makes you an employee. Not following the policy makes you unprofessional. It does not help any cause you might have.

Originally Posted by KillingMeSmalls (Post 1279461)

I think you missed the point of my post.



We are professionals, that's why we wear suits. Stop trying to degrade and water down our profession, we get enough of that from management. Take your self esteem issues somewhere else please.