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Old 04-30-2008 | 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Ray Blaszak
Ok its not really a dumb question. I've always been fascinated by military aviation and just curious as to what tactical stuff the pilots are doing! I guess I brought that on myself didnt I?
There can be several crews on board. Once done with the mission (or sometimes before the mission), the "transition" phase of the sortie begins. This can be 30 minutes to 2 hours (ugh) in the Traffic pattern.

Every month, at least in the heavy world, there are training requirements every pilot needs to make. X number of ILS approachs, X number of Visual Approaches, X VOR approaches to a circle,X number Go Arounds, 3-engine Go Arounds, 3-Engine Landings, etc.... Of Course, Tactical Arrivals, which is the pattern most civilians find strange and I would need a power-point to explain.

Now multiply those training requirements times 6 pilots on board, and you're gonna have a busy day in the pattern...you might not even get everything done that day.

Is it boring...not really, except for the non-pilot crewmembers (Load Masters, Boom Operators) they usually look annoyed the whole time.

That time in the pattern really keeps you proficient, especially as a reserve guy. I might do some of those things once a year in the sim at my airline job, anything other than an ILS is abnormal. Had to do a VOR approach into Mexico with my airline last week, it was actually the first time I shot a VOR in the ERJ since I was in the sim last September...man was I rusty.

This proficiency allows us to be woken up in the middle of the night after not having flown in almost a month, go fly to Timbuktu to an airfield we've never been, and execute a perfect circling approach as if we did it yesterday...because we've done it a million times in the pattern.
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Old 04-30-2008 | 09:41 AM
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Also Ray, there are quite a few types of patterns that must be flown in some aircraft. We fly takeoff flap, landing flap, no flap, and ELP (emergency landing patterns (engine out)..and two types of those) patterns. All have to be flow for proficiency. Actually a lot going on when the patterns come one after the other in the overhead.
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Old 04-30-2008 | 11:13 AM
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Just for the record, C17s do zero IFE practice approaches in the jet, all done in the sim.

Anchorage approach strongly discourages multiple instrument approaches. And I generally shoot anyone on a local who wants to do a bunch of instrument work anyway, the sim is excellent for that and it burns a hell of a lot less taxpayer money.

So what you're seeing is straight up VFR pattern work, different types of patterns/landings. I recently flew a 4.3 local of straight pattern work here to get everyone's requirements done. Blastoff hit it correct, like most heavies we rarely do a local with "one" crew. There's always multiple pilots with different requirements.

As with the UPT guy, I enjoy pattern work, but after a few hours of it my brain turns to mush.

Our fighters rarely do more than a couple patterns. If you're seeing a lot buzzing around the pattern it's because a lot are coming back. They launch and recover in waves--you're not seeing one guy do 18 patterns, you're seeing 18 guys do one pattern. And if you're watching during a Red Flag recovery, you're seeing 40 guys do that one pattern.
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Old 04-30-2008 | 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Sputnik
Just for the record, C17s do zero IFE practice approaches in the jet, all done in the sim.

Anchorage approach strongly discourages multiple instrument approaches. And I generally shoot anyone on a local who wants to do a bunch of instrument work anyway, the sim is excellent for that and it burns a hell of a lot less taxpayer money.
Ya, in the Tanker we only get to the sim once a year. Everything is done in the pattern...even getting an engine pulled on departure.

I imagine it would be tough to do that at Elmendorf with the conflicting final at Anchorage Int'l.
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Old 04-30-2008 | 12:46 PM
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I enjoy the Air Force especially when their nice enough to let me jump out of their perfectly ok airplane. But, Ill be driving around and just curious as to what they were actually doing. And what do you mean when you are referring to "overhead".
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Old 04-30-2008 | 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Ray Blaszak
I enjoy the Air Force especially when their nice enough to let me jump out of their perfectly ok airplane. But, Ill be driving around and just curious as to what they were actually doing. And what do you mean when you are referring to "overhead".
Military Overhead Pattern. Instead of entering the pattern on downwind or 45-to-downwind like you would do in a 172, you enter the pattern lined up with and overhead the arrival end of the runway at 1000-1500 agl (with the aircraft clean and at high speed), enter a hard left or right hand "break" turn onto downwind (while simultaneously slowing and configuring flaps/gear), and then a continuous base and base-to-final turn.
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Old 04-30-2008 | 01:26 PM
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When you see the Raptors or Eagles come screaming in then going into a hard left bank--that's an overhead.
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Old 04-30-2008 | 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by FLY6584
"2"

I'm in UPT right now and I'd have to say that I have more fun in the pattern flying overheads than I do out in the area flying aerobatics. Getting upside down and pulling G's is cool and all, but nothing compares to yanking and banking in the pattern at 200kts and 1000AGL with 10 of your buddies.

There's a WHOLE LOT more going on in those circular patterns than you think Ray. It's too bad you can't fly overheads in the civlian world.
Oh but there are - you just might not know about them. ABQ, SAV, FSM, FOE being a few examples. Now many of these civvie fields have a reserve componet located there.
Wait - rereading this post right now - did you mean civilians airplanes flying an overhead approach? If so....sorry for the misinterpetation.

USMCFLYR
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Old 04-30-2008 | 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by USMCFLYR
Oh but there are - you just might not know about them. ABQ, SAV, FSM, FOE being a few examples. Now many of these civvie fields have a reserve componet located there.
Wait - rereading this post right now - did you mean civilians airplanes flying an overhead approach? If so....sorry for the misinterpetation.

USMCFLYR
Can't say I've heard this, but now I might go try?

N1Cessna2: Tower, N172 3 miles south, request overhead
Tower: N172, report initial, I'll call your break
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Old 05-01-2008 | 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by KBAR
Can't say I've heard this, but now I might go try?

N1Cessna2: Tower, N172 3 miles south, request overhead
Tower: N172, report initial, I'll call your break
Let me know how that works out for you >G<
Hey - it is efficient. Who knows - maybe you'll start a trend!

USMCFLYR
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