"Are you receiving disability payments?"
 

The 1st Class paperwork asked this question and I answered "no", but soon I will be receiving VA disability payments as part of getting out of the military and having a few things that qualify.

What happens when I check "yes"?

Been getting a first class for close to two years now while getting benefits from the VA and it has never been mentioned.

USMCFLYR

Same here...4 years disabled vet w/1st class. I just don't give them my rating.

Under legislation passed this year, the FAA can get your VA records from the VA directly. You don't have to "give" them your VA rating...they can just go get it. I think by answering that question in the affirmative, it is putting a flag on your medical that the FAA can then go check against VA records and decide if they want more information from you or not...I see it as a slippery slope.

I'd like to get the legal definition of "disability pay" - if removing a few hundred dollars before tax and giving it to me "tax free" counts as "pay", I don't see even filing a claim as worth it for $10-20/mo. If I cross the 51% threshold and get a whole other check for disability, I think it opens a can of worms. On one hand, you're >50% disabled and getting concurrent receipt for life altering injuries suffered while in military service and on the other hand, you're holding yourself out to the FAA to be in perfect health and able to be entrusted with the most scrutinized, legislated, controlled, and monitored career field in the history of the world.

And I've got a friend about to retire who completely pulled his VA claim because of this (he's returning to Northwest...nee...Delta)...

Damn, that sux....I didn't know that the FAA could pull your records like that without you knowing. I'm not gonna worry about it. I'll cross that bridge if I ever get there.

WHOA!
I never said this :)
I hold out to the FAA that I can pass their 1st Class physical which is a LONG WAY from being the specimen of perfect health.

USMCFLYR

I'm sorry; I was being generic in my statement and in no way making any accusations or allegations to anyone at all - just the building scenario I see on the horizon.

This is about perception management. As pilots, we know that passing a 1st Class physical does not mean you are the specimen of perfect health, however, the flying public does not and the FAA bureaucracy may not now, if only to manage their perception.

An airline pilot is the most scrutinized and regulated profession there is or has ever been. No other profession, not the guy sawing open your skull to perform brain surgery, or the ER trauma doc who does on-the-spot surgeries and certainly none of the other high-paying jobs like high-end lawyers, stock brokers, or CEOs of Fortune 500 companies subject themselves to the sort of regulation that an airline pilot does. Nobody walks into the ER, presents his government credentials and advises the surgeon he will be getting evaluated today, on the spot. Nobody from the gov't goes into the Dr's office and demands to see his licenses, training records, or certificates of medical worthiness of any of his equipment. Nobody gives him spot quizzes. Nobody changes the rules a surgeon follows in an ever expanding regulatory nature while pairing him with a new surgical team he's never even met every time he slices someone open...and then gives him a surgical check ride.

But pilots do. All to protect the public's perception that we are somehow superman, able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.

Make no mistake. This is not about health, it's about perception management and bureaucratic creep. Imagine the public hue and cry when the NTSB reveals during their next accident investigation resulting in loss of life by the paying public that the captain was a 30% disabled veteran receiving disability "pay" from his service. How do you think that reads in the newspapers or on CNN? We know that can mean anything from minor hearing loss to bumps and bruises and even old (middle) age creeping up on retirees in their 40s added in a cumulative equation understood only by VA bureaucrats to mean you're going to get 30% of your pay tax free...which is probably only $20-30 for most guys. Yet these are "ailments" that do not affect us in any appreciable way from anyone else in their 40s.

I promise you, that's not what will be on CNN. And the FAA sees a way to grow their bureaucracy under the pretense of saving the flying public from 'unfit' pilots. First, they'll go after the gross offenders...and frauds (which is where this originated), but answering 'yes' to that question on the medical tags your name for VA cross reference.

It's about money. Feeding the bureaucracy. Hiring more people to monitor us evil sneaky pilots...because we are the most controlled, monitored, regulated profession.

Hmm, so what about 70%? Haha. Could very well be that in a few months!

Oh I know T2.
I was making a joke about the difference between the VA disability and the FAA 1st Class.
In my case - my disability did afect my 1st Class in that I needed waivers in the military and SIs from the FAA. Mine is well documented. I've heard stories of others who might have been less than truthful between the two, but there can be reasons for the disability that have nothing to do with something on the medical (a small loss of hearing for example). You might be a 10%er for hearing from the VA, but as long as you have a conversational ability with the AME then it doesn't matter. My AME actually gives me the old standard hearing test that I took in the military!

USMCFLYR

Many folks have collected VA disability while holding a 1C medical. Of course it all depends on the nature and severity of the disability. But don't lie to them...

The FAA sent a bunch of folks to jail only a couple years ago by cross-referencing some federal(?) disability database with the FAA medical database...any matches who did not report their claimed disability condition to the AME went to jail. It was not the VA database though...they probably wouldn't have the political nads to target vets like that.

Well one good thing, there is no where on the medical form of to how much disability one's receiving. I'm 90% in service and can still pass a 1st Class. You get 10 points for just getting stitches. 10 points for having sinus issues. 10 here or there adds up quick. My AME knows my rating, but it's not required for the paperwork.

Good advice everyone, thanks! This issue is the only thing that has been worrying me, kind of out of my hands. I won't lie, so we'll just see what happens. I'll list the stuff just to see if anything jumps out at you as definite bad ones and for me to just stand by and wait to lose my 1C:

1. Migraines controlled on approved FAA medicine
2. lower back pain no meds.
3. Rhumatoid Arthritis approved FAA meds
4. CPAP machine.
5. Reflux with approved FAA meds.

We shall see! I felt like I answered everything honestly.

Yes, and as of this summer, the FAA now has the ability to just go get your VA records...

This was the first step. Why do that? Why not target the AMEs too? It's not about health or safety, it's about growing your bureaucracy which equals money...it's always about money.


You missed my point. They can now simply pull your VA records. If you report it, they can just go VFR direct to the VA and pull your records. If you don't report it, I guess they can just search for you in the VA database and if you pop up, you're done.

Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get me! ;)

Regardless of what's happened in the past, the FAA pursued the ability to actively go get VA records for some reason or another and now has that ability. If you think they're going to stop at enforcing people who don't report it, I believe you're a bit naive, but that's my opinion only (until the FAA shows their hand).

Knowing bureaucracy for what it is, I'm sure our over-controlled, over-regulated, over-monitored, over-legislated career will lose another tiny bit of liberty sacrificed on the false altar of safety for nothing more than perception management.

I just wish I knew where they were going with all of this. I'm about to retire and I'm not sure it's worth the lousy $25/mo I'd get even to have to interact with the FAA any more than I have to...

Never said I didn't report it. There is no where on the AME's paperwork to document a rating. OKC know's that I'm a DV. That is on my paperwork. My AME only also knows my rating. I had to provide proof of being a DV during my flightcheck application/package.

Remember is the medication/treatment that one my need for what ever their condition may be that kills a physical.

That wasn't directed at you, it was general. I'm just saying you don't have to report your rating, they can go get it for themselves now. Since this is a done deal, the $64 question becomes, 'what are they going to do with that info?'

No worries. I do see where you're coming from. If asked, I will tell.

Good discussion. I have the VA paperwork in hand now to file. I have a current Class I and asked this exact question to my local AME. He told me as soon as I begin receiving benefits to check the box and briefly explain in the comments that it is VA disability, not limiting and no medications required.

Needless to say, I am still hesitant to file the paperwork for the 4-5 minor items I'd have evaluated.

Has anyone heard of any issues with the FAA and VA disability?

1,3 and 4 jump at me.

You'll need proof of "control" over time. i.e. Do you have the Dr's report post CPAP, indicating the issue was resolved? I opted for the surgery and don't have to lug the CPAP around.

Lower back pain - have Kidney stones been ruled out?

Migraines - Guide for Aviation Medical Examiners

Disclaimer: I'm not a Dr. or Airline guy - I'd suggest researching these items in depth.

Good Luck!

Mo better link Guide for Aviation Medical Examiners

N9373M,

Since you opted for surgery, did that negate your VA rating for Apnea or were you able to keep it as 50% disability?

Not applicable for me (not a vet) - good question though. If CPAP fixes it and you can still keep the 50, logic would dictate you could keep it with surgery, but we all know about logic and....................

Oh, but you're not paranoid if they really are out to get you!

This thread reminds me of how the state of Florida, in the late 80's, cross-referenced DMV records with FAA medical records; hundreds of pilot got caught up...grand jury's, getting fired, etc.

I believe there will very soon come a day when the FAA begins cross-referencing perscriptions and even other medical records with FAA Airmen medical applications. The government is pushing increasingly for electronic medical records (part of the trillion dollar stimulus) and with Obamacare...you get what you vote for!

For what, $30/month? Is your Class I worth $30/month? It isn't an issue now, and I can't fault your AME's advice given CURRENT FAA actions, but I don't trust any bureaucracy any farther than I can throw it (which generally isn't far), so it's not worth it to me.

You can file later if you want - yes it's easier now, but not impossible later.

If, however, you can tally up 50%+ and get concurrent receipt with stuff your AME is happy with, I'd go for it because that's a different risk/reward ratio.

OK, so the 1st Class medical is still issued with your disability and you're in the clear. What about company applications? Many ask if you are a veteran... and if you are disabled.

I know that federal jobs give preference and such to veterans and disabled veterans, but if a non-government job is asking if you are disabled... on a pilot application.... are they screening you out? Disabled is a broad category, if you receive 10% disability from the VA for tinnitus, are you 'disabled'?

Sorry for bringing back a dead thread, but I would really love to hear an answer to this, if anyone has some experience with this scenario.

I've been checking the yes box since it showed up on the application. No issues with the FAA.

Reviving the Dead
 

As someone who just began receiving VA Disability (I was floored) I read this thread carefully. I still have some questions- mainly about the from FAA 8500. When you check yes for anything in block 18, you must make an entry in the comments section. It seems some guys are saying they just simply check yes and move on. I am sure the AME and FAA want something in the comments box. What have you guys been putting there? Docs, what are you looking for? What documents do I need to bring. Do I simply bring my VA Letter with the percentages? I am an Army pilot and fly all the time with out issue. My issues are all small, and I can safely pilot and egress an aircraft no problem. I got my 1st class and checked no as my rating wasn't completed yet. It got completed shortly after and I am now receiving benefits. I am losing sleep though over what is to come next year, as I am getting hired by a regional soon (hopefully). Any credible input would be great. Thanks in advance. :)

1 & 4 will be an issue... Talk to an Sr AME.

I would list in the comments each item from your VA disability letter, verbatim. Just the medical label, no elaboration. The AME will discuss these with you and after learning your flying is not affected (and assuming that none of these conditions is serious) he will give you your medical.

After the first time, you will always check the box and in the comments put "previously reported, no change".

That's it, nothing to worry about.

Low-level VA disability is not the same as social-security "can't work" disability. It's just compensation for loss of QOL and/or additional medical costs which were incurred (or were likely incurred) due to military service.

It is my understanding that these people who went to jail were lying about disabilities that were disqualifying according toFAA. Heart atttacks stroke etc.

Transitioning and the VA Medical
 

Thanks, guys. This info is helpful since several of us are getting out of our squadron and moving on to the airlines, but we are all unsure of the VA medical piece and how it may affect the Class 1. We all have back/neck issues, but I'm assuming that half of the other airline pilots do as well. Our separation counselors are really pushing us to accomplish this step before getting out of the military.

Had the surgery for back while in AF, have disability rating and get paid for it. Checked the block with short explanation. Never has been an issue with my FAA Class 1 Medical.

Lifter

Most likely. But I wouldn't lie about anything, even if they'd have a hard time getting a judge to jail you over hemorrhoids, they can still pull all your tickets with little chance of appeal.

True. The high-profile cases were essentially SSDI fraud and these folks went to jail (and rightfully so). However, the FAA later did a study in N. CA in ~'07-09 timeframe and pulled medicals/tickets for many, many folks - most were able to just provide additional info and get their medicals back, a few had to fight to get their tickets back. The bottom line is the FAA used this study to make the case to congress to obtain access to the VA & SSA databases which they received in late summer '11 or so.

What they're doing with that access currently is anyone's guess. I'm assuming that right now they're just cross checking it when you tick the box to make sure what you put down jives with what's in your records. However, bureaucracies never shrink, so the ever-present "mission creep" could be interpreted as they will eventually actively cross-check everything. What will they do with that info? Anyone's guess. Maybe nothing....but bureaucracies have to justify personnel and money, so my bet is they'll do something.

I can envision a few worst-case scenarios that would be a nightmare for pilots...

+1. I have a VA claim in for my neck/back because it should rightfully be characterized as "service connected". I don't regret all the great flying I did in the Navy, but know it'll haunt me someday. So, I'll gladly accept any compensation for the pain that is coming as a result of it - and particularly as other retirement benefits are getting slashed.

It's just not that $30 a month, but the fact that the Government is responsible for treating that injury for the rest of your life. Meaning if it requires an operation later in life, it is all paid for which could save you tens of thousands.

I am getting my First Class medical next week, but for the first time with a VA 30% disability rating. I will let you know how it goes and if the disability rating provides any roadblocks.

Having a rating, or the value of the rating, is irrelevant. It all comes down to the condition(s) in question. I would guess the vast majority of folks rated under 50% can get an FAA 1C unless they have something specifically disqualifying (ex diabetes). If the stuff your rated for doesn't intefere with flying and is stable, you should have no worries. Bring supporting docs for anything questionable.

Thanks. The disabilities are for the shoulder, knee, and lower back so I don't think it should impact my physical.

I know I bumped up an old thread here, but it was the first result that came up when I searched google to see if a disability rating impacts a FAA first class physical. There is some good information in here so I think the thread is still very relevant.

Anything to report? Appreciate any info you have!

I never had a problem been with the same doctor about 10yrs the first time I showed him my 40% and military medical records. Never had an issue. I just always fill in the blocks as previously reported no change.