Industry Morale?
 

Who is happy at their regional jobs? Anyone?

Curious. That's all.

I’m content. Making a lot of money. Drive to work. Upgraded quickly. Was able to get involved in some fun extracurriculars that are also padding my resume and giving me some more schedule flexibility. Still lots of Mickey Mouse BS and interesting new ways to bend/violate the contract but I stopped letting that bother me. It is what it is and all regionals do it. Schedules kind of suck but it is what it is. Happy I went where I went but by no means enjoying any kool-aid.

Yes. I like what I do, and I like where I do it.

Is it my final stop? I hope not. If it is, though, then I'd like to think that I'd still enjoy the job.

I’ve worked manual labor, desk jobs, turned wrenches... all for a much lower hourly rate than working as a pilot at a regional. Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to make more and I think we should. But I got a sign-on bonus, make enough to pay the bills, drive 20 minutes to work and fly airplanes for a living. People complain too much about this job. It is what it is - a means to an end and it’s a lot of fun... significantly better than digging ditches. You can be more than happy if you want, or miserable too. Lots of people in both camps from my experience. As with most things in life, 90% is perspective.


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Your "perspective" is a bit off. Every other job the hourly rate is for every hour you're at work, not just after the main cabin door is closed and the brake dropped(your actually real hourly rate is probably less than 1/2 or even a third of your actual duty time).

I’m pretty sure he knows what his paychecks are and what his quality of life is compared to his previous jobs. But thanks for your comments on setting him straight.

There's 100k+ CAs living in base and there's sub 50k FOs that commute. I'm sure the morale is linear to that.

I’m reasonably happy, it’s a choice to remain here for the remainder of my career and I’m good with that as of now anyway. I can say with full honestly that if the AA, DL, UA called tomorrow I would decline it. I live in base, I see my wife and kids, I get most everything I bid for, and I make great money all things considered. But that is just me.

I disagree. I sold cars and worked as a locksmith. Spent a lot of hours “at work” not getting paid at both. Like I said it’s all about perspective. I’m not saying I completely agree with the way the pay works or even agree that it’s a fair wage for the type of work we do. That said, I’ve thought the same about a lot of jobs I’ve done. And then I’ve had a couple of jobs where I got paid stupid money for doing tasks so mundane and mind-numbing that the payout wasn’t even worth it. Just offering my perspective- for me, personally, it’s the most equitable exchange of services rendered for a financial return that I’ve ever personally experienced and, to the point of the OP’s question, it is definitely possible to be happy in this job.


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News flash folks, it’s a job. I don’t know very many people who wouldn’t change a few things about their jobs.

It’s also somewhat like higher education. You make sacrifices for the future.

I’m happy to have my job. If there weren’t a line of people out the door ready to take my place I might have something to complain about.

In terms of perspective, how about the fact you do have a schedule, you don’t have to load the bags or fetch the ice and coffee, and you don’t have to wash the plane?

When I see someone in this profession complain all I think is entitled... Then most of the same people are dying to tell someone they don’t belong because of THEIR attitude or whatever other reason they can dream up as to why this job is only for those that are “tough enough.” It’s comical really.

Regional is comparable to a white collar job. Tradeoffs between the two... more time off in airlines but typically less career compensation than white collar (after you account for training costs, dues paying, and lost time value of money).

White collar will usually be there for weekends, holidays, and two weeks off at Christmas.

But regionals are better than most blue collar, and all unskilled jobs.

Majors are better than all of the above, only a very few niche professions might be better than upper tier majors.

For those that aren’t happy with their profession, I can guarantee with 100 percent certainty it ain’t the profession causing you to be miserable, it’s the way you CHOOSE to lead your life. Free country right? Find something better for yourself or formulate excuses.

The comment was to clarify the reason for the "much lower hourly rate", but thanks for your comments on setting me straight.

:rolleyes:


:rolleyes:


:rolleyes:

I’m very happy. Obviously I’m looking to move up, but if it doesn’t work out this is a great job that I’d be happy to do for the long term.

If you’re looking for happy people, ask the thousands that don’t post here. By its very nature, Internet blogs and boards are where the complainers hang out.

Very underrated post

I'm just here for the free pizza.

Been at my regional almost 5 years. Captain making 6 figures with a great schedule. I commute but the commute isn’t too tough with 7-8 flights /day. I’m happy, but at the end of the day it’s a regional. There is only so much happiness to be found.

Unfortunately this isn’t something unique to the aviation industry. Once you move up to a major, you’ll be saying the same eventually. Happiness is all in your attitude towards life.

The way airline compensation works, those at the regionals are subsidizing those at the legacies. And those with low seniority are subsidizing those with high seniority. If you never move-on from a regional, you never get your market value. Nor if you come to the industry late. Mid-forties military hires will be subsizing those on top of the list for their entire career. Those that die young tragically never get a true-up. Imagine what your value is if your airline liquidated... Happiness is a state of mind, but nobody likes paying for somebody else's boat..

Welcome to the airline industry. It’s called seniority and that’s what you choose to sign up for with complete transparency. This would be my only gripe about this industry, coming from a life where my personal abilities and effort rewarded me with far more compensation than my peers. But now I get to laugh at my peers in this industry that choose to go the extra mile for the company because their number will never change. Happiness is still a state of mind, we all knew the rules before we agreed to play the game.

No doubt. My favorite thing about this industry is listening to labor complain about management and then watching the cram down on fellow aviators under the guise of seniority. Good times if one believes life is a stage and you're trying to enjoy the show..

I enjoy my job and where I am at. Beats the hell out of living under the sea for weeks and and months at a time. Just saying.


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That’s not what I hear from those at major/legacy airlines that I talk to. Night/day difference between regional flying and flying for a major. Regardless I work hard to diversify my income stream so that I don’t have to fly forever. I don’t want to be doing this beyond 58-60.

Yep, the quality of life and schedule efficiency is barely comparable. Pay scales only tell a small part of the story. Different job. I would guess the majority at majors/legacies would quit the industry before going back to a regional for the duration. They know what they didn't know..

It’s all perspective. It’s funny to see regional complaint threads exist when less than 15 years ago pilots would pay for training at their regional and then make $18 hour and < $40 an hour as a captain.

But yes, If you’re miserable at your regional, you’ll eventually be miserable
at your major. I’d be willing to bet money on this based on years of observation.

Sort of. Bigger planes generate (a lot) more revenue. The only way pilots justified very high pay was that in the dawn of the jet age the planes got larger... MUCH larger, so the pilots could rationalize that if they got A pay for flying B number of pax, they should get X pay for flying Y pax. Pilots actually didn't get paid much when they flew four engine radials with 30 pax.

In fact RJ pilot compensation is probably pretty similar to what Dan Roman got in the DC-4, accounting for inflation. It might even be better.

That was how we got to where we are, but the mainline guys are DEFINITELY in the drivers seat. They wouldn't care if regional pilots got paid more, just not at THEIR expense. So they tolerate the whipsaw while at the same time negotiating for scope to limit the impact on their careers.

That's not changing, major pilots are not going to expend negotiating capital to "save" the regional pilots, especially since there's a perception that the majority of them are younger noobs who might have a just a touch of entitlement to things they haven't earned.

As a member of the lost gen, I can certainly relate and sympathize but I also need to make up for that lost decade financially and am in no mood whatsoever to cede any of my slice of the pie to somebody who soloed when I was teaching FO's to be RJ CA's.

Any other discussion is wishful thinking... wish in one hand, poop in the other and see which one fills up first :rolleyes:

There's truth in that, but frankly it's MUCH easier to be happy at a major if one is so inclined. I was usually happy regardless, although it certainly helped that I didn't expect to stay forever.

My wife is actually noticeably happier with major schedules, so that's a win if nothing else.

Operators are not too concerned about how compensation is sliced. They would agree to a flat scale across all airframes if the price is right. Some already do. Some pilot groups get more for flying larger equipment but divide it among everybody. Door pay is even being considered to level NB and WB pay. Those at the top are finding domestic flying more to their liking apparently. Union leadership is mostly responsible for how compensation is sliced and, I don't disagree, that's not changing very fast. But all it takes is one very ambitious go-getter to speed things up...

Morale is highest the closer it’s been since the latest pay increase. Morale is lowest the closer it is to the next pay increase.

It’s even lower the closer you get to furlough. Just saying.....

About once a year historical pay rates get brought up, and for some reason I’m always fascinated. I’ve read a little about compensation in the late 40’s and early 50’s, but a contextual reference like that sheds a lot of light.

You’re a knowledgeable guy, maybe you’d have an idea. Any thoughts as to what a Pan Am Captain might make on a Boeing 314 or first generation 747, adjusted for inflation?

314... no idea. I'm guessing not that much since it was all new back than and big bucks for labor will not happen until the business model starts generating a lot of revenue.


Early 747... that's the mile marker for when the jet age had arrived in force. Also about the time that pilots started making really big bank (because airlines could afford it). Those guys could have gotten paid more than we do today (adjusted for inflation). Pilot pay peaked 60's - 90's, although it's back on the rise.

My sense is that the industry was pretty hard-scrabble in the early days and then got a little better in the 30's and 40's as pilots got unions. Money was secondary, the unions were initially about safety and schedules.

50's and 60's got better yet, and then off to races when the jets took over and business expanded.

Hourly pay was modest in those early days, but it was supplemented by passenger tributes and offerings to His Airworthiness. :D

Cool info, thanks.

I’ve always said exactly this. So many pilots lack any sort of perspective and have never worked crappy jobs. Talk to some people and you’d think being a pilot is the worst job there is. I’d love to be making more money and think we all deserve more money, but come on

I got hired at 22 at skywest and am a captain at 25 years old. I do commute to an average line but all things considered its a pretty good time. The people you work with will make or break your experience.

CV-880 F/E paid $1000. a month, CV-440 F/O $800. in 1966. Not bad for the time.

$75-95k in today's dollars. Not bad, but not huge bank either. But context matters... was that entry level, or did you need years of experience just to get there?

I recall erly 70s Flying Tigers top pay reported around $125K.