Every Regional Pilot question answered 2022
 

The answer: nobody knows

How long to hold a line. How long to upgrade. How long to get X base on Y equipment.

No. Body. Knows.

I get you are curious. I get you are a Type A planner. But the current data is representative of what happens in a 100 year pandemic, not what will happen after you get hired.

And current major hiring is calling even the continued existence of many airlines into question.

Welcome to the industry. Make the best choices you can. But no one can give you any useful prognostic information right now about timelines.

Every bit of this is true.

The attrition at some of the regionals is currently higher than it has ever been. The hiring at the legacies has set records in the last 2 months. There is more movement right now in the industry than any time in the last 20 years.

Major airlines are dropping their requirements to get enough candidates to fill classes. And it is only November. It really hasn't even started yet.

Right now, there is absolutely no way to tell which regional airline would be best for you in terms of upgrade and upward mobility. There are some really bad choices (avoid 50 seat airplanes for United, for instance), but no one has a crystal ball. You could choose somewhere with what appears to have the fastest training and upgrades, and they could completely fall apart operationally in the next 2 months and upend everything. All it takes is a handful of key pilots to leave (check airmen, managers, training department) and everything can get delayed.

One thing is for sure, if you are already at a regional, make sure your application is in and update it at least every other week. Even as a new hire FO, get that app in.

Make yourself as "attractive" as possible to the majors and be ready to go when you get your chance. With hundreds getting hired weekly, don't lose out on a LOT of seniority.

Here's the thing....I don't care about upgrade. I don't care of QoL. I'll live anywhere. I want the regional that will give me the most flight hours. That's all that matters. I want the most hours each month. I'll get to the other places I'm trying to go on my own whenever I get there. Which regional will allow me to come off/ skip reserve quickest and start building flight time?

Many of you were military. I'm keeping a bit of that mentality for this. I understand that you can eat your cake and have it too at certain regionals that provide better benefits, better time off schedules, etc. I'm going for the trenches. Fly when I'm on the schedule. Volunteer to fly on days off. I exist to do two things; chew bubblegum and fly aircraft. But where will I get the best opportunity?

Upgrade should be the number one priority for anybody starting out in the industry, not flight hours. But then again the quicker you accumulate flight hours the quicker you will be eligible to upgrade. Whoever is mentoring you right now, fire them.

“Most flight hours” and “don’t care about upgrade” don’t really mesh. Why do you want flight hours? After awhile right seat 121 time has diminishing returns on your resume.

You answered it didn't you? I don't care about upgrade opportunities at whatever company I'm at. But flight hours...that gives me the ability to put in the apps to the companies that I am interested at that I'd actually like to enjoy QoL, pay, etc at. The hours give me the ability to pursue who I'd actually like to work for. And it allows me to be competitive with company x, y, z that much sooner if I build my hours that much sooner. Is any of that not true?

Don't most major carriers want 1000-1500 hours? I'm personally not going to reach those FW hours without flying for a regional. The sooner that I reach those hours, the sooner those positions are an option. I'm not debating the value of PIC vs SIC time. One is obviously better than the other. But when applying for a job who says 1000 hours required, did I win the day as a 800 hour CPT vs a 1100 hour FO? I am, as the name says, a New Guy. So please, educate me if I'm wrong. Seriously. I thought time was king. If going CPT is sexier than hours, ok. I wasn't tracking that.

Unless you’re like the CEO’s son or something you can just toss the minimum hours for legacy carriers out the window. Those are the absolute bare minimum they will hire, your odds of getting hired at those hours are very low. Captain time is more valuable than FO time, and LCA time is more valuable than captain time. It is rare (although not impossible by any means) to get hired without any PIC time.

Dude...... I am at a loss for words...... find a mentor quick.......

Will do. I clearly have a poor understanding of this arena. Thank you for the advice.

Go to professional pilots of tomorrow. There are a lot of us there that are willing to guide you.

Just don't chew the bubblegum in a crew environment.

Are boiled eggs a good cockpit snack?

close 2nd to broccoli

I’d take that over tuna fish. How people think it’s okay to bring something that stanky into a cramped cockpit is beyond me.

Here is some real advice.

Fly a plane with a forward lav and learn to time your farts to when a pax is in the lav, and blame them.

You’re welcome

Like someone else said. Minimums are only there so that if John Glenn shows up to interview but only has 1000 hours turbine they can hire him. I have never once seen am FO go straight to Delta without ex mil.

I know 2 FO's that have gone to ual straight, but one had family at the director level and one was a former intern.

Competitive minimums are key. 4 year aviation degree, Board of directors at a non profit. 1000 hours 121 turbine pic. Recruiter. 4000 TT. And my friend JUST started getting called.

To say you "don't care about qol' is really really short sighted. My guess is that 75% of airline pilots have a story about how they didn't expect to be at the regional level as long as they did. Speed bumps happen. Hell, I'm mid 30's and have seen 3 falls off the aviation industry. 2 of them added years onto my journey to the majors..... It wasn't that long ago that you "chose" whichever regional God saw fit to call you. At a minimum you need to think smart. Which regional would you want to be stuck at if the music stopped. Or at a minimum, if it took you an extra 3-5 years to get where you're going.

Planning for the best case scenario is a young man's game, and it's a losing one. I know.

I can name 10 right away that were non-mil and went to Delta and UA without being a Captain. The only thing is, with no degree they seem to want that PIC time. The few who just got hired at UA without a 4year were both captains at their previous regional.

Competitive mins historically are very different from competitive now

Cool
filler

Bump

Filler...

PIC time does not matter.

Can you elaborate on this comment?

It matters, but it is no longer something is required to get a call from a Legency carrier with exception to UPS/Fed Ex.

You have FOs with no TPIC getting picked up by Legency carriers, but they are usually Regional FO ~> ULCC/ACMI FO ~> Legency FO.

Usually a recent training event triggers the apps (types, upgrades) along with volunteering, LORs, job fairs/meet & greets.

HELP, what Regional to work for?
 

I'm in my last 50 hours as a CFI and I have 3 CJO, ENDEAVOR, PSA, and ENVOY, what I really want is to work for a WO carrier, I know flows are not realistic in the current state of the industry? but I was wondering if you were in my shoes, what Regional will you choose and why? I'll be commuting to any of their bases. so base is not a big factor for me yet, I'm planning on commuting for 6 months (end of my current lease) and then I'll be probably moving to base.

my head is divided:
ENDEAVOR: best pay but I hear if you get the CRJ-200 is a death sentence.
ENVOY: nice pay good bonus but I really don't want the ERJ145, bases are the best
PSA: Gets ready of the CRJ-200 or ERJ145 problem, but I hear they are over staff, and bases are not great,

So any objective advice will be help full.

Go to the one that will get you to class to the line quickest. Don’t get caught up on the jet so much. If can, consider expanding your options as well to Skywest or Republic as well.

Your goal should be get some time and be ready to bounce ASAP to a ULCC or ACMI in order to make that leap to to a Legency if that is the plan.

Do you want to work for delta? If so go to an AA wholly Owned regional. If you want to work for AA go to Endeavor. Don’t go to a Wholly Owned if you actually want to work for the parent company. Post Covid they have no real interest in hiring from their own feed,

Neighbor of mine has a Delta Interview in 3 weeks and he just finished Sim Training for Captain upgrade. No PIC time yet, and likely won't be any if he's hired since his airline's IOE is backed up 8 weeks.

good on him!

The neighbor I already mentioned above has that situation. He works for an AA Wholly Owned and would like to be with AA mainline since he lives in CLT. But at a recent job fair AA wasn't really interested in talking to him yet. Now if he gets a job offer from his upcoming interview with Delta he'll send that to AA and point out that's he leaving anyway. He said that has worked for others, when AA sees the competing airline job offer they went ahead and offered them a class date.

Keep us informed if it works for him. Good luck to him.

I totally don’t get this. The company treats you like trash but then suddenly changes it’s tune when you have another offer? If they didn’t want to honor your loyalty the first time and screwed you then, why would you then want to go work for that company when they suddenly change their mind?

I, too, do not understand this… playing games just to waste everyone’s time…

This is where I am at. I wouldn’t want to work for a company that treated me like they didn’t want me…

They just want cheap labor. If you’re gonna leave their cheap labor feed anyway, they’ve got nothing to lose by interviewing you.

Forgive what I know is an outsider question, but unfortunately I have 7 years left before I can retire from my current LEO career and start ATP school. So I’m looking for the quickest route, just like everyone else is. You say LCA is better than Capt time. How does one become an LCA, and do you have to make Capt first?


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LCA stands for Line Check Airman. You give checkrides to Pilots and CoPilots in the actual jet. So yes, I imagine you'd need a fair amount of time as a Captain before being selected as a Check Airman. Unless you're married to the boss's daughter or something.

Mad Libs #43 - Regional Reckoning

If you live in (a city), you probably still want to work at (a major airline based in that city), even if they won't hire you directly from the (the same major airline) WO that you work at.

Answers that work:
Charlotte... American
Atlanta... Delta
Houston... United

Or throw in your own goofy answers, because it's Mad Libs.

You may actually not need very much CA time, 1000 hours is often enough... it's going to be more important that you have a good 121 training record, and that current LCA will recommend you. Start networking with LCA early. Obviously CFI/IP experience helps but that's technically not required (even a line CA is assumed to have an instructional role per the regs).

If it's a small, boutique regional, then yeah it might be a good 'ol boys club.

at my ex very small regional, with the shortage, I was being asked to apply to be an LCA with 400 hours of TPIC.