How about everyone, quit lecturing each other?

Right? For the most part, all of you older gentlemen are professionals. Act like it, even on an internet forum.

JetJock, am I a victim of SJS considering that Ive spent the past 4 years of my life with the military as a meteorologist? Now making a career move to fly for a living, with a wife, a house mortgage, and a car payment? Am I a victim, simply because the minimums at some airlines are lower than SKW? Am I a victim if I get picked up and hired by ASA, XJT, PSA, PDT, at 500/50?

I'd be cautious about throwing around the SJS title. I'm even not that naive to throw it around at ERAU, UND, MAPD, or DCA guys.

Don't worry - I'm not lecturing you. :) Just wanted to set the SJS issue to rest.

I'll grow out of what? I'm not the one sitting here insulting you. I just don't agree with you, perhaps you'll grow out of it. I still contend that the SkyWest pilot group, as a whole wishes not to take anyone else's flying, and I STILL contend that you sir will walk right onto one of the Comair birds that are currently flying under the ASA certificate. No one at SkyWest is a scab, and you, using that word, shows your ignorance. I spend far more time around this pilot group than you do, and I am far more familiar with the overall pilot attitude at this company. As for our recruiting, we turn away about half the people that interview with us. Every single one of them has at least 1000 hours, and many of them come with turbine time. Snot nosed and inexperienced is pretty far from the truth when compared with the average new hire at ASA or most any other rj carrier.
Second it's funny that you say now that SkyWest pilots make more money, because if I remember correctly, a couple months ago you spent many posts trying to convince me that SkyWest pilots we're dragging down the industry by undercutting everyone else. So which is it? Does JA treat us really great, and crap on you? Or are SkyWest pilots dragging the industry down with our low pay? You can't have it both ways.
Also let me correct you on an assumption you made about our pay, we only make 150% percent if we are called on junior man, with the exception of the next two months, open time that is picked up is paid at our normal rate.
As far as union busting moves, LAX for sure wasn't a union busting move. They tried to grow the ASA side, and the finances just didn't work out. If anything they were trying to throw you guys a bone. Closing the SLC base, maybe, I'd have to look closer at how much flying you were doing when they closed it and compare it to now. Honestly I don't know, so I won't comment on it. But if they DID increase the SLC flying for you after they closed, shouldn't you be happy about that? As far as opening ATL on the SkyWest side, I agree, it's sh*tty, but I think it's just salt on a wound from before, when we got the -900's. The base was inevitable after we got the -900's. I don't think it's going to be that small much longer. But I don't think you'll like that much either.
Anyway, I wish not to fight with you, I've had nothing but positive experiences with every ASA crew I've dealt with. I did my sim in Atlanta, and they were all very nice, don't hurt the reputation of your own pilot group by being a jerk. Make your points, complain about management, whatever, but to insult entire pilot groups based on the opinions of a small few, is pretty ignorant.

Any olive branch extended must be reciprocated. To that end, of course you're right about cocky pilots everywhere (I've even been called that myself) But the situation at Skywest goes well beyond that. Non union pilots are taking union pilot jobs as the owner of your company uses the tactic of shrink us, grow SW to try and reduce our quality of life and prevent the union from happening at Skywest.

You, as a member of the Skywest pilot group have very little control over that. I think we both realize that. What makes the debate so visceral, is how the dreaded slick hair touts it; bragmatic that "the threat of a union is better than a union". I know I sound like a broken record on that quote, but you can't imagine the self restraint it required when I rode next to this jackass on the crew bus in SLC. Can Skywest pilots stop JA? Maybe not, but voting in the union for the greater good would be a great first step. The problem I fear is that most pilots at SW don't want to stop him. They want fast upgrades and express lane to the Legacy, and they don't care who's back they step on, on the way up.

As I've posted in previous strings, when Skywest pilots (most that is) debate the pro's and Cons of ALPA, I never hear the moral arguement that other pilots are paying with the dues, time, effort, and risk to better the industry. THE THREAT IS NOT FREE and it is being paid by thousands other than the skywest group. Is ALPA perfect? Hell no. Far from it, but it is necessary in our industry. All pilots reap the benefits from it, so I think it is fair that we all get on the team.

I'm not lecturing you on this; as you've stated you voted yes. I hope that you are using whatever influence you have to help inform the other members of your pilot group rather than wasting your well chosen words on an old wind bag like me.

Stick

P.S.

ASA "another ****ty airlines" that's not name calling. Hell, we made that up about ourselves!

You're not insulting me? The last I checked calling someone ignorant, is an insult, just not a good one.

You can contend that I would fly a CA plane all you want. It only shows that you didn't actually read my post. Not only did I say I would, but I said "better us then SW". I'll slow down for you.... that is an admission that I would fly that plane, I'm just glad it at least went a fellow ALPA company.

"As for our recruiting, we turn away about half the people that interview with us. Every single one of them has at least 1000 hours, and many of them come with turbine time" Are you dillusional? Yes, it's true SW is holding firm on the 1,000 hour thing and I applaud your training department for that, but turning away over half? That's B.S. I had a very bright,experience, female Captain from SW who is in your training department on the jump seat the other day. She said that for the first time they couldn't fill a class and they were taking "just about anyone they could get that had the time"

if I remember correctly, a couple months ago you spent many posts trying to convince me that SkyWest pilots we're dragging down the industry by undercutting everyone else. So which is it? It's easy to make a point when you miss quote people. I never said that SW pay was dragging down the industry, infact I have said many time that SW does NOT fly the 70 for a 50 seat rate as many have, rather I point out it is a blended rate. Of course that has been improve to an over ride now, inpart because ASA's union said "hell no" to the pay cuts JA tried to forcedown our throats.
Now, what I did say is that JA used that as a tool trying to get a blended rate out of us. Pay cuts for us, vacation bidding was also effected. So, SW did lower the industry thing because JA tried to pay us like you on rate but not give us all the benefits and bonus programs that you recieve that make you so well compensated. Lose some of the emotion, stick to the facts and I think you will not only see that I'm correct, but you'll make a more convincing arguement.

They tried to grow the ASA side, and the finances just didn't work out. If anything they were trying to throw you guys a bone. Closing the SLC base, maybe, I'd have to look closer at how much flying you were doing when they closed it and compare it to now. Honestly I don't know, so I won't comment on it. But if they DID increase the SLC flying for you after they closed, shouldn't you be happy about that? You have got to lay off the Huka...LAX was JA trying to grow ASA? Wrong (but you should be getting use to that) we transfered a few aircraft (5 in total) from ATL flying, that can hardly be called growth. The SLC numbers are facts, it has started trending the other way, but for atleast 6 months it was fact. Then you are crazed enough to say that we should be happy about that? Happy about having yet another base yanked out from underneath us? Happy about having to move our families, sell home, forced to move across country to an area that few of us had any desire to live? Yep, your right, I'm being "ignorant" again.... I should be happy.

don't hurt the reputation of your own pilot group by being a jerk. That wouldn't be another example of you throwing out insults would it? It must be a warm fuzzy place inside your head.

I am not speaking for my pilot group, I'm speaking for me. If my fellow ASA pilots agree (as many of them do) that it is a major concern with the attitude of the SW group, then good. For those who don't, feel free to express your view point. I can hardly call this a debate since you fill your post with "I don't know" and misquotes, so I will gracefully bow out of this "discussion" with you. Beating my head on the wall with a mental amputee is pointless (Now see, that was a good insult!)

The only thing I have to say is.....the minimums are WHAT THEY ARE now, theres nothing you can do to change that..... Isn't it fair for people to take advantage of that and fly for a regional. Are you saying that if 10 regionals lowered the mins to below 800 when YOU HAD 800 hours, that you would have turned them down and said NO, I am going to fly my 152 for another 600 hours.......... You cannot blame people for taking advantage of the minimums right now (I am not talking about places like mesa, etc...) But there are respectable regionals with lower mins.... I am sorry that the mins were not this low when you got hired, but stop beating up on those of us who happened to catch the industry at the right time......We can't control that! Thats my 2 cents

Not everyone, I had an offer from ASA and XJT but held out for SkyWest. The fact that I live in SLC was a very strong factor in that decision however.

I agree and I'm doing what I can to educate; the moral issue doesn't get much consideration but it should.

Take care and see you on Echo.

Jet

Jesus, if this is a true:mad: story I think some things have to change......... The sense of entitlement is beyond sickening.........society as a whole has just let mannerisms and common courtesy out the window, and when it comes to jumpseating. I have seen some very polite, respectful individuals.............and then I have seen some arrogant jackasses. The few times I have jumpseated on CAL, SWA, or USAirways, I have always had my license, medical, passport, and ID out in hand and asked them if they would be so kind as to gimme a ride, and all of them have been very pleasant and respectful in return, yet on many flights that I was working, I have come across some clueless people, mostly young F/O's that went from ZERO TO HERO in 3 months... The majority of the Jumpseaters I have had experiences with have been from CAL. Most CAL guys have been very polite and respectful, as well as most RJ Ca's, however some CAL F/A's have said, "Hi I am your jumpseater" which is annoying, because your not a godamn thing until the CAPTAIN says so after you show the common courtesy of asking him/her.................Those of us that work in this industry together, need to treat each other with more respect and not have such a sense of entitlement..............

I think that the problem with jumpseaters is that they really don't understand that it is a courtesy, and they aren't familiar with the etiquette involved around that privilege. Maybe getting denied would teach zero to hero FO's that they need to use a little tact. I have never seen a captain jumpseater be anything but polite and pleasant to have in the cockpit, it seems to always be young FO's that haven't figured it out yet. As far as the demanding FO jumpseater with the special flight case he would have been watching the airplane taxi away from the gate as soon as he told the FA where he had to sit "just in case". Looks like he still has some jet rescue hero delusion left over from his private pilot days. What an a$$. Luckiest ride he ever got.

On a positive note ....I got the call from ASA this morning to come down for a July 9th and 10th interview!!! I am very excited and looking forward to it. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I ve been burried in the ATP Gleim and studying the ASA interview gouges as well as reviewing systems on my current multi....we ll se what happens.

CONGRATS and GOOD LUCK!!

thanks! I a looking forward to it

Mregan,
Your over-studying. I did the same thing and had no problems.

mohaupt thanks, I appreciate it, I'll try to relax and just do what I know how to do :) Are you with ASA now...if so how do you like it? Is it true theres no RSV on the 200??

200 reserve is like a month now. Dont believe some of the bologna you hear on this site. Everyone here is cool. Contract talks resume this week i believe. Just get in somewhere get experience and take it one day at a time.

Ps. i caught mohaupt sleeping in class today....

HAHA thannks hendefea, thanks for the advice, I ve heard great things about ASA, too many people bash themthough from what it seems, anyways we 'll see how it goes do you commute or live in base?????ANd how is training??

Also how was the interview I hear it is somewhat tough??

No prob. Dont sweat the interview...fly alot of rj flight sim before if u can. thats what most people fail on. read the gouges on aviationinterviews.com and youll be set. As far as living.....its pretty hard to commute when ur on reserve and what not....i would plan on living in atl.....its pretty cheap.

Ahh man! you caught me?! Darn, I thought I was sly. Training is a joke, so far real easy(as you can see). Contract talks are this week (thursday and friday) I am sure the outcome will be good.

Do I like ASA, hell yes! I would give you reasons why but they are not for a public forum, plus hendefea might tell some ;-) send me a Pm if your intrested. On a public note, you just have to believe what you feel, sure there are some disgruntled pilots but thats everywhere. I am just happy to be here knowing that in a little over a month I will by flying a jet.

Hendefea are you my sim partner?? ;-)

~Mike

I have my resume in with ASA and am awaiting a call. I have 650TT and 60ME. Any thoughts on why I may not have been called?

They are probably just busy. After I got the call they lost my stuff and I had to start from scratch on the day of the interview. That was interesting. Give them a call at the end of the week and talk to a pilot recruiter, they will give you some decent info.

m

I talked with an ASA pilot today, and he said that ASA was in dire need of pilots. He said he knows of guys that were hired with 225TT/30ME. He said it takes those low time pilots 1.5x's longer to go through sim training than other hires, which would be expected.

This is why we don't let apprentice members vote on contracts! It takes a year for the kool aid to wear off. :eek:

Up until a couple of years ago it would have been because you have 650TT and 60ME.

I suppose you're right, Stick...just bugs me that others may not take me seriously because they dealt with some hot-shot newbie FO like he was talking about...! Oh well :cool:

But to all you more "experienced" Pilots out there - don't let us young guys get away with murder...educate us if you see something you don't like!! Otherwise we'll never learn and you'll find yourself forever bashing us on APC ;)

Hi everybody. I read these forums a lot, but very rarely have anything to add.

I just got a call from a pilot recruiter at ASA today to do a phone screening tomorrow morning (so quick replies are appreciated). Is this a way to just find out more about my background and experience, or are they going to ask technical questions like in an interview?

I have an interview with ASA July 9th and 10th. I got the phone screening the other day. It s a piece of cake, I was actually driving in morning traffic while I was tlaking to him. He was a nice guy. Easy questions, jsut like hows your flying job now??? Do you like it?? Have you ever failed a checkride??? Do you have a 1st Class Medical??? Ever been arrested?? Stuff like that, it s not a tech interview at all so you dont need to study for it :) Best of luck, I cant wait to interview!

I appreciate your response..... If anything I am completely humble and appreciative to have this job. I study my ass off and try so hard, and get advice from line pilots on what to do, procedures, etc.. because I KNOW I dont have the experience most do. I know what you mean about the attitude thing, but that is one thing I DO NOT HAVE..... You can bet I will be taking advice on EVERYTHING from my captains, and coworkers for years and years and years to come...... There is so much for me to learn. It just upsets me sometimes when everyone blames us low time pilots, there are some of us that are SO appreciative to have this job and so LUCKY that the industry is what it is right now.....like stated before, anyone would be crazy to turn down these oppurtunites, just so they could have more respect when they go to a regional having say 1500 hours.... I may not have 1000 hours, but I am going to try just as hard if not harder in my training and on the line, and listen to every single word and advice people with more experience have to offer....... just my 2 cents

Thanks for the response. That's what I was expecting from the screening, but just wanted to make sure so I wasn't caught off guard. I'll be there on the 9th and 10th to interview as well. See you there!!

Great hope to see you there! -Matt shoot me a Private Message w ur info name, email etc. when you have posted a few more messages and we can discuss -Matt

Keep updating. Keep flying. Hang in there. They will call you. Stay persistent.

I have to assume that when/if I get hired with ASA, I'll be on the CRJ200. But, I was wondering, is aircraft assignment always based on age in the hiring class, or are there any other factors? The reason I ask is that I'm already CL-65 typed (full type...no SIC limitation), and I'd love to get the 700 if there was a slot available. If there's someone else in my class who is older than me, would they still get the opportunity for the 700 before me, even though I'm already qualified in it?

The number 1 consideration is "needs of the company" If every ATR pilot in the company got on a bus and drove off a bridge then everyone in the next class would be going to the ATR. This could happen, The ATR pilots wouldn't be use to the speed of the bus and could lose control! KIDDING- the ATR crowd is really cool-

The fact that you already have a type (but I assume no experience, because you list yourself as a CFI) will help in getting you on the CRJ. There is no CRJ 700 type rating, therefore you will get hired, go through the entire CRJ 200 program. If there is a need for 700 pilots, then someone in your class could get assigned to that, and you could probably trade with them for that spot. This scenario is unlikely. Odds out of Vegas say that you will go to the 200 and then later bid for the 700. Longer reserve time keep a lot of people away from it, so if the 700 is what you want, then you will get it probably within 6 months.

Hope this helps,

Stick

Any chance any ASA guys/gals could post information on company benefits, health, uniforms, flight benefits, etc.. I have seen the profile page but was hoping for something a little more in depth. I appreciate the help.

Thanks for the insight. You are correct. I'm a CFI/CFII/AGI/IGI with a CL-65 type, and have been instructing in a CRJ type rating program for almost a year (~600 hrs of instruction given in CRJ-200). I know with a few other airlines I've researched, the aircraft you start on is what you're required to keep for a certain amount of time. Maybe that was just for different type, like an AE ERJ FO wanting to get on a AE CRJ. (?) I wasn't aware that I could bid for a different aircraft so soon.

I have no problem admitting I'm a complete newbie to this stuff, so I may be way off base with this. I still have a lot to learn. But, my reasoning for wanting the 700 was the slightly higher pay, and IMHO, a better future for the 70 seaters versus 50 in the long run. From what I've been seeing, it seems like more regionals that operate CRJs are wanting to get more 700s and 900s, as opposed to the 200s. Another factor for me would be destinations. I'm assuming that most of the international routes that ASA flys that require extended overwater are 700 routes. If that is the case, I'd like the international experience.

Like said before, it all depends on the companys needs. Eventually the regionals will phase out 200's as they are no longer in production and other parts of the world are starting to have a need for them ex: china, india, etc. When you do get an aircraft assigned to you, you are usually seat locked for about a year after ur checkride.....however the company can change that pretty much whenever they want.

Also like said before, everyone goes through 200 training (unless ur atr) and then if and when u do get to the 700 part...its only a few classes and like 4 sims anyways....so its really not that big of a deal. 200 reserve is at about a month and the 700 a few more than that. But with the day to day changes of asa these days (people leaving etc) anything could happen.

Your experience will help you no matter what. The pay is the same the first year so if i were you i wouldnt worry about it.....theres nothing u can really do right now except just get in and get started. After a year you could probably bid any plane u want anyways. Dont worry bout it

Cool. Thanks for the info. :D

Hmmn,

So it wouldnt hurt to put in a resume with 420/50ME if they are desperate???

The month of July is set aside to polish up ME instrument flying, procedures and maneuvers :D

Don't plan on getting a -700 tomorrow...It is true that 50's have already seen their glory-days, but there are far too many to let go in the next few years. They'll be around for awhile yet.