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SandMan2 11-11-2023 11:20 PM

Offset Localizer
 
(I can't seem to find the answer to this anywhere. Prepping for an interview.)

If we have an offset localizer (up to 3 degrees), when the value is positive (e.g, 1.75 deg), we'd expect to see the runway on which side of aircraft?

I'd assume a positive value means the final approach course would bring you in just to the right of runway, and the runway would be left of center from the cockpit perspective. But I can't find the answer anywhere online. Thanks for the help.

Beech Dude 11-12-2023 02:01 AM


Originally Posted by SandMan2 (Post 3723383)
(I can't seem to find the answer to this anywhere. Prepping for an interview.)

If we have an offset localizer (up to 3 degrees), when the value is positive (e.g, 1.75 deg), we'd expect to see the runway on which side of aircraft?

I'd assume a positive value means the final approach course would bring you in just to the right of runway, and the runway would be left of center from the cockpit perspective. But I can't find the answer anywhere online. Thanks for the help.

FAA charts have the nice little arrow on the smaller airport diagram to visually depict how youre approaching the airport.

The main thing is the rwy hdg v LOC. It the LOC is 270 and your course is 267, the rwy will be offset right. If your course is 273 it'll be left. Then consider wind correction on final and that'll give you your answer on where to look out the window.

Good luck.

rickair7777 11-12-2023 06:48 AM

Sigh. The answer to that question is visually obvious on the chart.

Interviewers should not be asking questions like that without the chart in front of you. That's kind of like having you draw the overhead panel from memory :rolleyes:

Not picking on the OP. Hopefully it's a well-paying job if they play games like that.

trip 11-12-2023 10:26 AM


Originally Posted by Beech Dude (Post 3723389)

The main thing is the rwy hdg v LOC. It the LOC is 270 and your course is 267, the rwy will be offset right. If your course is 273 it'll be left. Then consider wind correction on final and that'll give you your answer on where to look out the window.

Good luck.

Final answer?

JohnBurke 11-12-2023 11:13 AM


Originally Posted by SandMan2 (Post 3723383)
(I can't seem to find the answer to this anywhere. Prepping for an interview.)

If we have an offset localizer (up to 3 degrees), when the value is positive (e.g, 1.75 deg), we'd expect to see the runway on which side of aircraft?

I'd assume a positive value means the final approach course would bring you in just to the right of runway, and the runway would be left of center from the cockpit perspective. But I can't find the answer anywhere online. Thanks for the help.

Where you'll see the runway depends on winds aloft, regardless of the offset.

SaintNick 11-13-2023 12:15 AM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3723619)
Where you'll see the runway depends on winds aloft, regardless of the offset.

best answer. Stupid question

APCHCLIMB 11-13-2023 06:22 PM

Pop quiz, hot shot. Are PAPI Lights:
Red Over White
-or-
White Over Red

If you don’t know without looking you’re not a real pilot.

rickair7777 11-13-2023 07:41 PM


Originally Posted by APCHCLIMB (Post 3724154)
Pop quiz, hot shot. Are PAPI Lights:
Red Over White
-or-
White Over Red

If you don’t know without looking you’re not a real pilot.

Neither?
...................

Beech Dude 11-14-2023 02:00 AM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 3724160)
Neither?
...................

This ^^^^^^^^^^

JohnBurke 11-14-2023 08:08 PM

Red over red, you're dead.
Red over white, you're alright.
White over white, you're out of sight.

rickair7777 11-14-2023 08:11 PM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3724584)
Red over red, you're dead.
Red over white, you're alright.
White over white, you're out of sight.

RTFQ
...................

JohnBurke 11-14-2023 08:26 PM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 3724586)
RTFQ
...................

The question didn't stipulate that one has to fly the approach upright.

APCHCLIMB 11-17-2023 12:30 PM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3724588)
The question didn't stipulate that one has to fly the approach upright.

Aaaaaand you would be the exact person they’re NOT looking to hire.

JohnBurke 11-17-2023 12:34 PM

I would be exactly the person who didn't apply for the job, because it would be a significant step backward.

kevin18 11-20-2023 05:30 AM


Originally Posted by SandMan2 (Post 3723383)
(I can't seem to find the answer to this anywhere. Prepping for an interview.)

If we have an offset localizer (up to 3 degrees), when the value is positive (e.g, 1.75 deg), we'd expect to see the runway on which side of aircraft?

I'd assume a positive value means the final approach course would bring you in just to the right of runway, and the runway would be left of center from the cockpit perspective. But I can't find the answer anywhere online. Thanks for the help.

I’ll take approaches I’ll never fly for $1000 Alex… seriously, my company is removing localizers from training next year because they’re outdated with rnav approaches now.

hercretired 11-20-2023 05:38 AM

please tell us what company is asking such stupid questions

so we know where NOT to apply at

trip 11-20-2023 02:07 PM

I'm still trying to decipher what's positive vs negative?

JohnBurke 11-20-2023 02:42 PM


Originally Posted by kevin18 (Post 3726332)
seriously, my company is removing localizers from training next year because they’re outdated with rnav approaches now.

United is not training localizer approaches any more?

Pilsung 11-20-2023 03:01 PM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3726538)
United is not training localizer approaches any more?

JB- perhaps learning the difference between VASI & PAPI is a more important question…?

JohnBurke 11-20-2023 03:28 PM


Originally Posted by Pilsung (Post 3726549)
JB- perhaps learning the difference between VASI & PAPI is a more important question…?

It's a visual approach aid; both keep you out of the dirt.

It was a bad question, hence it's construction, and did not deserve a sserious reply.

The notion of abandoning localizers because they are "outdated" is equally idiotic.

However, when considering where the runway will appear in the windscreen when breaking out, as noted before, it depends entirely on winds aloft. If there is no wind, regardless of whether the runway is offset, if one is on a localizer, the runway will appear at 12 o clock, but angled slightly away. Any significant wind aloft can put the localizer at the 10 o'clock or 2 o'clock positions, or greater, and that is a far more important thing to consider, than the ramifications of an offset localizer on a calm day. Winds aloft determine where that runway will appear when one breaks out, and where one should be looking.

As for imagined or invented terms such as "positive or negative" with reference to the localizer, those serve only to confuse the reader and provide no useful information with an explanation as to what the questioner means.

2StgTurbine 11-21-2023 03:17 AM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3726557)
It was a bad question, hence it's construction, and did not deserve a sserious reply.

It speaks volumes of a person's character when they can't admit to even a minor mistake.

TiredSoul 11-21-2023 03:43 AM


Originally Posted by SandMan2 (Post 3723383)
(I can't seem to find the answer to this anywhere. Prepping for an interview.)

If we have an offset localizer (up to 3 degrees), when the value is positive (e.g, 1.75 deg), we'd expect to see the runway on which side of aircraft?

I'd assume a positive value means the final approach course would bring you in just to the right of runway, and the runway would be left of center from the cockpit perspective. But I can't find the answer anywhere online. Thanks for the help.

In the Western world (standard alphabet or whatever other criteria) from left to right is increasing, right to left is decreasing.
Same as clockwise compass numbers increasing and counter clockwise decreasing.
So in a no wind condition offset “+” is to the right.
Anything less then full scale we’ll call it good.
Final answer.

JohnBurke 11-21-2023 11:08 AM


Originally Posted by 2StgTurbine (Post 3726650)
It speaks volumes of a person's character when they can't admit to even a minor mistake.

'

It speaks far more when one refused to cop to a mistake one didn't make. Read.

kevin18 11-23-2023 07:57 AM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke;[url=tel:3726538
3726538[/url]]United is not training localizer approaches any more?

That’s what I was told at my last CQ, at least on the bus.

USMCFLYR 11-26-2023 02:12 PM

Obviously the offset is the number of degrees from the final approach course - it isn't a positive or negative number.
You can tell this somewhat from the aiming arrow on the figure (at least on the AIS plates.

CX500T 11-26-2023 02:54 PM


Originally Posted by kevin18 (Post 3727359)
That’s what I was told at my last CQ, at least on the bus.

Same here but at the other guys.


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