I don't think it was an attack on low timers leaving for a shiny jet job. I was only referring to you building a small amount of time and going to a BETTER regional. You'd be surprised what an extra 6 months can get you when you go to a regional that pays horribly, has poor work rules, and doesn't treat their pilots well. If you wait an extra 6 months (or less) and get into a regional that has a good reputation suddenly you wanting to get a job flying jets turned out a lot better then you had originally planned.

Hindsight is 20/20... you don't want to look back a year from now and realize that a low level regional was not the best choice even though you can start logging "jet time" "121 time" and get a seniority number. The sky isn't falling...sometimes when you slow down...you actually speed up!

You are arguing that you want to spend THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS for unnecessary training because you are short on money???:confused::confused: You want to use that "experience" so you can get on with the lowest paying airlines so you can pay off expensive bills? You sound confused.

But I want to help you!!
I really do. So let me explain your two options.

Option one (your way)
Pay $6,000 for training that you do not need. Ok, you are down $6,000. Then you can use this so called training to get on with an airline. The only airlines that this will help you get on with are TSA, PSA, Piedmont, Mesa, etc... So you get hired at one of these airlines. They all pay about $20,000 first year. Then about $28,000 second year. Maybe $30,000 third year. Maybe $32,000 fourth year. Get the picture.

Option two (the good way).
Don't take that RJ course. Ok, that us + $6,000 you have to pay off your bills. I bet that will pay off a huge portion of your debt. Congratulations. You didn't have to do anything (except avoid that expensive RJ course). Get on at a busy flight school that pays well. At my flight school, instructors are independent contractors and make $35/hr. If you fly a lot, you can make more than at any regional airline. Work there for 6 months while you build up to 800-1000 hours TT. Instead of making $20,000 at PSA, you can make $30,000 easily building valuable experience. Take that extra $5,000 you made during that 6 months and pay off your bills. I bet that will pay off a huge portion of your debt. Now that you have the experience, get one with a decent paying regional airline (Skywest, Republic, ExpressJet). Make $25,000 first year, $35,000 second year, $60,000 third year. Get the picture. Take all that extra money and pay off your bills. I bet that extra money will pay off all of your debt.


Do you see what I am trying to convey. Taking the RJ course just costs $6,000 and puts you into further debt. Working for a low quality airline (the only type of airline that RJ course is going to help you get on with) will only make you less money and put you further into debt. Or you can stick out for six months, instruct, get some good experience (and good money), and go to a good airline. This is by far the best path if you are worried about your bills.


I am trying to help you. Don't take this the wrong way. You have a choice. You have a choice! Make the right one. I promise it will benefit you in the long run... Or you can shoot yourself in the foot. If you do, let me know how it feels. I won't be doing it.
Ryan

The question do the people at PSA getting hired with 300-400hrs have CRJ trans. courses? And does anyone have a good resume format? I'm sensitive because every thread ends up in the same debate. As a moderator to this site maybe you can help keep threads on topic and to not fall into the standard debate. This is a great site with lots of good info but look through the threads and see how many turn into a debate over high/low time pilots. It's rediculous when someone asks a simple question that a moderator thats suposed to be "helping younger pilots" stears the conversation to the debate that we are all tired of reading about. The situation is what it is. Help the younger guys make the best of it. I see you work for UPS I have a Capt friend for UPS that not only is encouraging me to jump in while its hot but is actually doing things to help out. So which UPS Capt do I believe. Of course I don't like to here negetive comments who does. But would you honestly flight instruct which I have been doing for 2 years or try and work your butt off to fly an RJ now i'm not as low time as other people that have been hired on but I'm still a little low I could wait another year but hey who says the regionals would be hiring in a year. I respect your input as an experianced aviator but in no way have I payed for my airline career. In fact I've had to work my rear off just to get as far as I have. But you know what I don't take it for granted when I do get to a Regional I'm not going to act like a premodana. I know that I won't know poop but h$ll I'm willing to work my butt off to get there and to catch up with others. Now again I'm going to try to take this post back to the original topic. Anybody got any info on CRJ trans courses and how much they affect PSA hiring decision. Thanks
for all the older guys who give their contributions and help younger pilots. If its building time or giving info its all good stuff and I thank you for it. :)

"I don't think it was an attack on low timers leaving for a shiny jet job. I was only referring to you building a small amount of time and going to a BETTER regional. You'd be surprised what an extra 6 months can get you when you go to a regional that pays horribly, has poor work rules, and doesn't treat their pilots well. If you wait an extra 6 months (or less) and get into a regional that has a good reputation suddenly you wanting to get a job flying jets turned out a lot better then you had originally planned.

Hindsight is 20/20... you don't want to look back a year from now and realize that a low level regional was not the best choice even though you can start logging "jet time" "121 time" and get a seniority number. The sky isn't falling...sometimes when you slow down...you actually speed up!"

See now thats good stuff!
So my question to that is PSA a junky airline I have 430/45 I always planned on putting in to ASA because of the good pay and reputation and the QOL I would have by an easy commute from FWA. Same goes for Comair who I have some internal Req with but again I would have to commute. Should I just forget PSA and wait for "better regionals" PSA was a top choice because I would rather drive 2 hours to dayton rather than rely on airline commuting. I would just like to have more control if I could. The reason I want to stay at FWA is a new baby! and a wife with a good job that can support my poor butt through the regional airlines. Thus I can't instruct at some school with lots of students. Thanks guys :)

"As a moderator to this site maybe you can help keep threads on topic"

Why? It's called thread creep. It happens at all internet message boards. While it can sometimes be an annoyance, it can be equally educational. You have to learn to read through the creep.

"It's rediculous when someone asks a simple question that a moderator thats suposed to be "helping younger pilots" stears the conversation to the debate that we are all tired of reading about."

I'm not tired of it. If you didn't want a debate, then a simple "uh huh" in response to my friendly attempt to advise you on a better route would have been fine. Instead, you went off with your rant and now we are where we are.

If what I say bothers you that much, feel free to use the ignore feature....

I think if you do a search for ASA and Comair you'll find #1 that you will probably end up liking it better #2 you will make more money and #3 that your "internal rec" will pay off greatly...everyone is so desperate right now. Instead of an airline choosing you...you can choose where you want to go!

de727ups - ok for about the millonth time in my life i'm going to step back and eat some humble pie. :) Your are right that most forums creep ,however, this "debate" started on the secound post. however you are right it wouldn't have gotten nearly off this much if I wouldn't have ranted so for that I apologize. I should have let you give me your opinion so a question for you just to know from someone with experiance what is the right "hour level" to start applying? Thanks and sorry for being a craby little prick.

oldveedubs - I understand all that but on all of those airlines i would have to commute PSA I would not so are their work rules and pay bad enough to warrent commuting? I really don't know. I've been reading through the forums and most people seem pretty happy at PSA granted the pay isn't great but i'm not expecting much until upgrade anyway. FYI I get around 30hr per month at my current airport manager / CFI job and every once and awile about every other week some free twin time. So six months would only be about 180hrs.

thanks for all the input

I'm sure guys are very happy at first. I loved my 135 job when they graciously offered all the line service guys interviews for right seat king air jobs at 300 hours. Those of us who passed took the jobs and loved it for about 400 hours. Once we started to realized that we were able to work elsewhere for much better pay and treatment we began to get frustrated.

Getting a jet job at 300 hours will make most people happy but as you watch other pilots doing the same job you do for much better money/upgrade times/work rules and treatment you may not see things the same way.

Instead of spending $6000 on a CRJ class, take 1000 dollars to a bar in Houston where XJT pilots go or Lofty's in SLC where SKW pilots drink. Buy drinks for every pilot in the bar and I'll bet your new found internal recs will be much more powerful than any CRJ course.

I watch Mesa sit in ORD during ground holds and thank god I held out for block or better. I see TSA guys parked next to their GoJet brothers wonder what it must feel like to watch those psuedo-scabs (not real scabs) from their point of view.

Wow now that's some good advice. Although i think you got me and the OP mixed up. I've already taken the CRJ course and am just finishing up my CFI right now.

Who cares about 3rd year + pay and longer at the regionals. Just get in with a regional who will fly your a$$ off as quicly as possible. You need to build that tt and jet time to get on with a major here in the next 3-4 years. Except for a very select few, Turbine PIC will no longer matter in the near future when it comes down to getting on with a major/legacy carrier. We are now witnessing the beginning of the demise of the "regional" carriers. There are not enough pilots to fill the slots we have now, never mind in a year or two. PSA, for instance, will hire you originally to class but has had a 40%+ failure rate in or before the sim. So what does that mean to the average low timer? It means that #1, low timers are proving they cant handle the "121 jet transition" on a consistant basis. #2, because more and more are failing (no surprise), less are getting slots in the "right seat". Which means less can upgrade that need to, to fill the slots more "experienced" pilots have left behind to go to the majors/legacy's. Which means more cancelled flights due to lack of crews. Which means parking planes, losing money and bankruptcy. Bottom line, get your time as fast as possible and get to a major/legacy/corporate etc.... because its only a matter of a few years before the industry goes to complete and utter crap and everone is a miserable wreck once again. Senority is everything and only the ones who make it there first will still have a job in a several years.