my thoughts exactly. like people on here have said before, delta is trying to comair proof their flying. and yes, they will move flying around (already happening). lucky for us we didn't do anything to get this flying, so we have a lot to fight for, and the company has a lot to lose.

not exactly true...

the initial aircraft are a "test" and based on performance and ONLY performance if Pinnacle meets the requirements then it is possible for an additional 16 -900. SLC and LAX were discussed, but due to high COL in LAX, it was suggested a wait and see approach. Also Mesa and recently Express Jet have been dabbling in LAX. Mesa not so lucky and I don't know about Expressjet.

Historically, Express 1 (former Pinnacle) signed a 10 year agreement for only 54 RJ's, that became 75, then 97, then 129, then 114, then 129 on the backs of NWA and XJ pilots. don't forget, NWA is slightly different animal then DCI. DCI has several carriers that don't fly very many aircraft for them because they can split up amongst all the DCI carriers.

so uh,,, what part of my statement was not true??? you didn't say anything that is contrary to what i said.

the only thing "guaranteed" is 16 aircraft, that is it.. no more, no less...

IF Pinnacle can meet and exceed the predetermined performance initiatives, then DCI may grant an additional allotment of aircraft with NO pre-determined locations.

The aircraft that are unofficially up for consideration are 16 that Mesa are currently operating and that is also provided that MESA does not turn around that operation. My guess is expressjet was put into LAX as an incentive for MESA to step up and if Expressjet succeeds I would guess they would get first shot over Pinnacle who is 6 months behind ExpressJet in operating for DCI.

All I am saying politely is you are counting chickens before they hatch and as with everything in aviation, don't count on it until it has been on the property for at least 6 months, that is all...

fair enough... but you even say the 16 900's are "guaranteed" but they aren't here yet.. we have filed with the DOT to fly out of lax, slc, and other west coast cities with aircraft greater than 65 seats. i am not counting my chickens before they hatch. i will probaly be long gone and at a major by the time all of this pans out. i dont care if pinnacle gets the jets or not. we as a pilot group did nothing for them, and we are so understaffed we wont miss them either.

I agree with you on all counts...

Uncle Phil got a good deal with the Q400's and CRJ's. They have firm orders on those, but your are right it really is not guaranteed.

The city pairs I saw for the -900 were interesting, up and down the coast and mexico and canada. My only response to it is it may be wishful thinking. We don't have the staffing and will not have the staffing by the time all 16 are on the property.

If it all happens, I hope there is a contract or it really will not be worth it.

The real interesting part I think will be when the rates are decided in Mid December. It will either be an exodus or standing room only for the equipment. I am hoping for exodus, otherwise I can see the boys on nonconnah maneuvering to split the pilot group further with Delta flying.

i too am hoping for the exodus... one good thing is that what ever pay rate we get, we are going to change it in negotiations... so if it is a good rate, we will go a little hire during negotiations. uncle phil had a chance to put this all down over 2 years ago.. now he has got this pilot group so riled up that we wont take a crappy offer.

The arbitrator will decide the pay rate for the -900, if the contract should settle shortly thereafter we will have little to no position to get a better -900 rate. if the contract drags like most of us expect, we will stand a better chance of higher rate for the -900. The risk is.. if the arbitrator "caps" the 900 rate lower than what we will argue for, it can have an affect the -200 rate.

Uncle Phil I feel is waiting a little longer, right now a good part of the pilot group cannot vote. Those who can, may be enticed by growth and upgrades and lose sight of the prize. The senior pilots are dropping like flies, so it can be attractive to a really junior pilot to sign, especially since it appears everyone will be hiring in the next few years. Some have predicted that the decision on the contract will come to the junior guys who came from programs who "need" Pinnacle to achieve their career goals.

Ummmm, yeah because we dont have 9's in DTW, and yes you clowns always block the alley. Why dont you check you next ASAP report listing, should see a flagship that pushed back at MSP on the alley with a clearance from metering (by the way metering doesnt control the interior, thats ramp) and almost smashed into your company. I will omit the rest of things that you guys did yesterday, but does runway incursion ring a bell??????? And by the way there is no back way into the C gates.

I'm talking about MSP not DTW. I wonder why it takes sooooo long to park in MSP or DTW... Maybe if XJ would hire more rampers or make the one you have work harder we wouldn't have this problem of getting park in MSP or DTW and blocking the alley, trust me, we don't sit there and block it just for fun, it's to get park. Everytime I go to MEM I never have this problem. The only time those rampers were good was the 2 weeks that we had to fill out some aduit forms. After that was over, it was the same crap. No back way into the C gates? is that why i have to call ramp before reaching 79 to see if they want to bring us in on 79 or 95 to get to C25-C27? Can't miss it in the 10-7pages.