I have been on a 900, and if the airplane is so great maybe you guys should demand higher pay for it................

That's a pathetic attempt at a rebuttal.

That's like saying: “Oh Ya! Well I slept with our girlfriend/wife!” :eek:LOL!

You're right; none of us are trying to get paid more. Not Pinnacle, not MAG, not Mesaba, not RAH or anyone else operating CR7's/9's or E-170/5. We love operating more profitable a/c for our companies while adding nothing to our pockets. Can you please stop pointing out the obvious as though none of us know it. Regardless of what you may think we are fighting this flight and one day, when XJT gets larger a/c, you will be too. Until then you can continue to think your airline will treat its pilots differently but remember the past is behind you and the future is always changing.

It’s sad that you can’t come up with a good argument about why your ERJ-145’s are better than the CR7/9 or the E-170/5’s. Don’t think about it as our CR7/9’s or E-170/5. Just make a case for the a/c? Can you? We’re talking about efficiency not pay.

………………………………………have a banana! :D

"flown by the RJ. LAX-SBA, LAX-FAT; SFO-FAT, SFO-SBA, SFO-RNO, SFO-MFD. There are more but I just wanted to name a few"

SAN - LAX

You've got to be kidding me??? That's absolutely AMAZING!!!:confused::confused::mad:

I don't think the EMB145 is better than a CRJ7/9, but I also don't think its any worse. The CRJ7/9 is still a super stretched CRJ-100 to me, and I have ridden on both the 100 and 900. I can't get into the efficiency aspects of the airplanes because I haven't flown the CRJ7/9 or the EMB170/5, but I assume the only reason you call them more efficient is because you can put more butts in the airplane, but burn about the same amount of gas. If I had to pick between a 170 and a CRJ7/9, it would definitely be the EMB170, a far superior a/c passenger comfort wise IMHO. My argument about why they will most likely use the EMB145 over the 700/900 is not because its better or XJET is better or any crap like that. Its simply that I think they are a better fit for the destinations they have announced. I don't think that the markets down in those areas would fill a 70 seater, plus I don't know if the CRJ7/9 would get out full on a 5500ft runway, the EMB145XR most certainly can, maybe someone who flies the 700/900 could let me know. Thats been my whole point, I don't know if the 700/900 needs to be wasted on those markets. I don't know how they have been lately, but when I did LAX to Mexico redeyes last winter for Continental Express, the airplanes were usually not full. There was a lot of competition from Mexicana and AeroMexico, and I know that quite a few LCC have popped up in Mexico that are most likely providing even more competition.

actually whats even more sad is that we are arguing over this........ I am watching BLOW and all the hot girls in the begining of the movie were "Stewardess'" man this industry tanked...........

Irony, sarcasm, satire indicate mockery of something or someone. The essential feature of irony is the indirect presentation of a contradiction between an action or expression and the context in which it occurs. In the figure of speech, emphasis is placed on the opposition between the literal and intended meaning of a statement; one thing is said and its opposite implied.

blow your load over your 70 or 90 seaters all you want. The only reason they are more "economical" is because 1) your not getting paid to fly 70-90 seats your getting paid as if it was 50 2) your flight attendants are getting paid next to nothing 3) you dont know any better to see anything wrong with this situation and demand better compensation/treatment. Your an RJ pilot making crappy wages and the only reason you get to fly that jet is because if a mainline pilot had to do it with mainline FA's it wouldn't be anywhere near as profitable. reality check.... your 70 seater isn't the "savior" of the regional jets you have been dreaming up in your head. Who the F cares what MODEL of an aircraft you fly... your still a regional pilot even if its a CRJ/ERJ 1,000,000,000.

This isn’t a hard concept to understand.

I believe in XJT’s 3Q report they stated they are still loosing money on the branded flying (for now) with something like 60-65% capacity (that's an average of 30-33 Pax on board). If course the CR7 or E-170 currently won’t work, the ERJ isn’t currently working either. Maybe they should be flying the 135? LOL! I don’t know the exact numbers so don’t take offense. Just repeating what a friend of mine at XJT told me last week.

NO PROBLEM! Did a 5650’ runway with 76 Pax on board, we left 0 bags behind, NO CG problems and a jumpseater (CR9). NO PROBLEM with either a/c. Since I’ve been flying the CR7/9’s I’ve never had a CG issue and I’ve never left a jumpseater. From ATL-TUS with nearly 18,000 lbs of fuel and jumpseater……….no problem. On the other hand landing weight restricted can hurt anyone on very short flights with alternate fuel. But I’ve never had that problem as well.

I’m sure the E-170/5 performs the same. Although I’ve heard from some SA jumpseaters that the E-170/5’s burn a bit more fuel with the same engines (a/c’s a bit heavier and not a slick, or so I’ve been told).




BTW this conversation is like a contest of who has the bigger “root.” Bottom line, a/c engine and system technology has come a long way in the last 10-15 years. Newer a/c are most always going to out perform what they were designed to replace.

while i think your tone was a little harsh and condescending, you hit the nail on the head. until people pull their head out of the sand and demand more this ain't gonna get any better for any of us.

Did you just figure most all this out yourself? Bravo!

First, get over the pay! We are ALL fighting to get paid what we think we're worth. If you think we're not than you're a bigger moron then your posting implies.

Second, SKW FA's make more than most Nationals and some Major airlines FA’s do. Yes they are under paid but when you compare them to mainline they are pretty closer than you think.

Third, the reason why all businesses exist is because someone saw a need and that person/business had the ability, that's what ALL airlines are capitalizing on right now. Yours included!

Fourth, No ******! Sorry, just had to say it because your ignorance is unbelievable.

I don’t care what a/c I fly! I just want to get paid what my skills demand. Most of us are of this mind set, the other’s are still in rehab for SJS.

Look around, we’re all fighting for improvements. Some more so than others but we all agree we don’t get paid enough. Bottom line we deserve more money and a better QOL.

It seems that a lot of posters on her assume that just because you work for an airline you must agree with the way it and its labor groups are run. Do I like the fact the we get paid a 5% BHO on top of your 50 seat rates, NO I want more. Rome wasn’t built by one person and it wasn’t built in one day. Yes one person started but 100’s of millions continued the effort, even today they work and fight.

Change happens, always!

BTW, I voted Yes for ALPA! I voted Yes for my future! I voted Yes for my family! & I voted Yes to fight! Not because SKW’s a bad employer, their NOT, but because we deserve more!

my ignorance? from your posts you seem to be the guy that walks into a bar and goes "i fly 90 seats"

yeah your really fighting for better wages ::sarcasm::. How about you guys fight for the better wages BEFORE you start flying the airplanes. YOUR ignorance and YOUR pilot groups ignorance or SJS screwed up your pay. You are regional pilots and now your acting surprised that your getting paid as such? just because you had big dreams of flying the "big iron" and didnt care about pay at first doesn't mean you can turn around now and say "well everyone thinks we are a joke and how about better pay." That is what you are a joke... the only people who are laughing is management. they win we lose but hey have fun flying your 90 seats around. the chicks at the bar dig it and maybe you can go back to your fancy aero college and give a pep talk about how flying "big" jets is SOOOO COOL!

SJS at its finest here folks. Too bad the pilots in those jets are too busy being mesmerized by all the seats behind them instead of looking at the future.

PS... i did figure it out on my own its common sense champ and maybe you should rethink your "90 seaters are the future" routine. I was condescending in my posts because you and otter or whatever set the tone for the posts early on.

So we should like you because your taking away higher paying jobs at the major level? because thats where the NEED is coming from isnt it. Major airlines have the routes, they win on concessionary contracts from their work groups, and then they bid it out and there you are. you are willing to work for almost half as much on a nearly comparable aircraft, worse work rules, and with little or no regard for the profession because its your their pilots first 121 gig.

look this isn't the blame game. its not your own personal fault and was unstoppabe by just you. you needed a job and took one but dont lie to yourself and tell yourself this is a good thing. Very little good can come out of this and it will take years to get this flying back to the major level.

"Look around, we’re all fighting for improvements. Some more so than others but we all agree we don’t get paid enough. Bottom line we deserve more money and a better QOL."

The truth is you dont deserve better pay or QOL. Those aircraft should be being flown by mainline pilots who DESERVE the pay and QOL. Who had the pay and QOL until somebody came in an underbid them.

I think everybody should take a deep breath and calm down.

RJ's are flown by regional airlines because main line pilots allowed their scope clauses to be gutted. If the mainline pilots would have drawn the line at props years ago, the regional industry as we know it today would have never developed. Once the camel's nose was under the tent it was too late to stop the explosive growth. It is pretty hypocritical for mainline pilots to hold regional pilots in contempt when they were the ones who said it was OK in the first place.

The important issue is getting the pay and QOL at both places improved and where it should be. Follow pilots are not the enemy, you've got to get big bonuses to fall into that category.

Blah! Blah! Blah!

I've been in and around this industry far longer than you and frankly pilots like yourself are exactly what's driving our profession down. You’re just another pilot who starts spouting his/her mouth off before ever doing any research. That fact that you’ve made these comments with out truly reading any of my postings is amusing. It shows that you’re a one sided individual, which is the worst kind to be.

SKW is non-union, I’m sure you didn’t know that? So how exactly is a single pilot going to stop an airline form flying CR9’s? Explain that to me so I can have a good chuckle. Without unity a labor group has not balls. That’s SKW for you, no unity, but we’re working on it. Do you have any business common sense; do you have any business experience, how about business knowledge? Obviously not, you may say you do but your postings tell a different story.

You know we can sit here and trough jabs at each other, but fighting with you is like fighting with Pee Wee Herman. You’re a waist of my time.

As for the SJS comment. LOL! That’s a good one. Go back and read my postings again.
When I was hired at SKW I was offered the RJ but I’d have to wait almost 2 months, so I asked about the EMB-120. They said there was a ground school starting in 2 weeks but with my experience the RJ could be mine. I laughed and told them I don’t care what I fly, I want the seniority. So I took the EMB and by the time the RJ class started I had almost 200 pilots below me.

Just in case your reading compression skills are MIA again as you read this posting, I’ll sum it up for you. I don’t care about what I fly; I only care about my family, my future and myself. I’ll fight beside my fellow pilots for every penny we deserve but here at SKW no one can stand up because we have no protection from Mgmnt retribution. But you’re ignorant and don’t understand what I’m talking about. So go on and post a rebuttal, I need to laugh a bit more.

Get off the a/c will “YA.” I don't care if it's a B1900, we deserve more. I have to say that you're a real work of art. A real cool guy on that pedestal. By any chance are kin to SkyHigh?

BTW, I deserve a hell of a lot more than I'm getting and any pilot at any level deserves just as much as any mainline pilot who deserve more. A pilot is a pilot, regardless of whether he's flying a 747 or a B1900. Don't forget the only thing that changed about the 747 pilot was time; they both have the same skills. Yes a 747 pilot position deserves more money but both pilots deserve to get paid very well and have good to great QOL.

You’re a hypocrite but please keep posting, I'm enjoying your ramblings.

I completely agree but some just don't understand. Their just to caught up pointing fingers and blaming each other instead of learning and going forward.

O.K., thanks for the insight. Now as far as XJET losing money, its due to start up costs associated with shifting airplanes out of the COEX fleet and into the Delta and Branded fleet. Our revenue has increased, but we had a lot of airplanes that had serious down time. Now, as I said in a previous post, for me this is not a EMB-145 is better or worse than a CRJ700/900 thing, its simply that I don't think there is a demand in the Mexico market that would require the CRJ7/9. Would you agree?

Based upon what you said and I've seen, I would agree. But more seats for close to the same cost allows for you to make more money during the peak seasons.

Personally I see XJT's use of the ERJ as common sense. If XJT wanted to use the E170's it would cost them for more money in start up cost than it currently is. Buying new a/c, training new pilots, new sim instructors, new ground instructors, new curriculum, Mx professional, parts, certification, ops spec and so on. The cost would have been much higher to bring a different a/c on line. Now they can test the markets and if there is growth they can make the decisions about larger a/c down the road.

Regardless I wish you guys the best of luck.

I agree, I think getting bigger a/c would be more harmful than helpful. Also, there is no way XJET could get financing for bigger airplanes with our stock price. We just haven't put enough confidence into the investment market yet, and who knows if we can.

I agree, I think getting bigger a/c would be more harmful than helpful. Also, there is no way XJET could get financing for bigger airplanes with our stock price. We just haven't put enough confidence into the investment market yet, and who knows if we can. Also, I agree more seats for same cost means more money, I just think the bigger RJs are better on different routes. Thanks for Best Wishes.

jetlock i wrote word for word "its not your own personal fault and was unstoppabe by just you" but maybe my reading "compression" skills are off again. I am not going to respond to the rest of your personal attacks after this because your ignorance is laughable. you dont know me, you dont like me because i am deflating your dream of being a mainline pilot in your 900 so lets keep it civil. I have my opinion, you dont know me or my past, i dont know you other then what you post and likewise so dont assume anything about me just because you cant make a factual point.

I think the reason your resorting to personal attacks about my business experience (MBA grad, BS in finance, owned my own business for 3 yrs, volunteer for alpa) is because you really have no leg to stand on with your arguments. SO far EVERY statement i have made about your situation, your airplanes and their similar types, and your pilot group have been backed up by what you post. Sure your a little long winded, big on the personal attacks, and you dont care what others in your profession have to say but in trying to make fun of my posts you have agreed to everything i have stated.

I know this is an impossible conversation to have with you as you will still carry on and believe you deserve to be treated like a mainline pilot, will be in it only for yourself and your family, and will think that as long as i get mine i dont care. Its sad to see people like you in this industry. You have said nothing to defend yourself other then "we are fighting for it". Your airline just voted down a union and i am sad for you guys. Your pilot group continues to work for peanuts (which you an i agree on) and all you can say is " we are working on it" and "rome wasnt built in one day". If this is ROME then your the part of the group burning it down not building it up.

SOrry for being wrong about SJS but your posts about how great the 70 and 90 seaters were just seemed like the classic propaganda from Aviation Universities. Sounded like someone swimming in kool aid and still does.

Believe what you want. From someone who is an "idiot", "ignorant", "stupid", a "Moron", a person who has no "business common sense", "business experience", or "business knowledge" i emplore you to look at your position objectively. I doubt you will and you will post some smartass, self-important ramble about how your soo right because "you will stand up and fight". I call BS. talk is cheap

ps. I do actually know quite a bit about Skywest as i almost worked there but decided not to. I like your company and think its one of the best. The problem i have is with regionals flying 70-90 seats for such miserable wages and the self-righteous stupidity that those positions seem to breed. i know very well that i could work for a company that did fly those aircraft but i would know that it was a major setback for my profession.

I think XJT is doing the LAX flying on an at risk basis and not under a capacity purchase agreement. This alone would make it better for Delta to use XJT over SKYW unless SKYW will fly for Delta on an at risk basis. Also, the 145XR is a better jet to use on thin routes that cannot support a 70 or 76 seat CRJ. The 50 seat CRJ would be weight restricted in most of those mexican cities while the XR would not. If they could fill up a 76 seat jet on those routes and SKYW would fly them on an at risk basis, then I'm sure SKYW would be doing the flying. Hopefully in 2 or 3 years all those routes will be flown by Delta in a 100 seat jet and all you SKYW and XJT guys can get hired by Delta to fly them. Maybe then we can all quit calling each other names and go back to the important things in life.

That would certainly be better than all these stinking RJs rolling around. I fly one, and I wish they were never created.

but those 100 seat jets will still be rj's, just the stretch versions of the junky 50 seaters...

The first 10 we had in LAX were on a CPA agreement. the additional 8 (so far) are being flow on a pro rate type of deal.

Only 10 can be operated on a CPA because of the "most favored nation" clause in the CPA we have with CAL.

Hopefully, they wouldn't be CRJs and if they are, maybe Bombardier can think a little outside the box and do something other than just stretch a /200.

I love our f#&king CPA with CAL... It's almost like CAL wrote it for us before we were IPO'ed just to make sure XJT was worth at least $16 a share when we were loaded up with debt and then sold down the river like a Thai hooker. I'm glad they didn't load it up with high-rates and handcuff-like red tape clauses just so that they could make a little cash on XJT when their real plan was to drag us across hot, freshly laid asphalt by our nuts. Asphalt that it still just a little wet so it sticks to the bottom of your nuts and burns them untill you get it off.

Wow, that makes for a pretty interesting picture if you use your imagination.