We should adjust our thoughts and expressions towards our airline for your issues?

How about folks speak their minds openly, without reservations, or threats? If you're not stable or confident enough to read those types of posts, maybe you shouldn't be operating heavy equipment?

:p

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Now that's funny! LOL!

Animosity............"riding cost tails"...............LOL!

You guys think you understand but you actually have no idea about what really matters in life. You point your hypocritical finger and bash us for working our system as you sit on your ALPA thrown. LOL!

Just curious, do you guys fly around bashes other pilots while you give yourself high fives and slaps on the backs? Is that SOP for your pilot group or is it SOP for ALPA members. If so then next time I’ll vote NO and continue to deal with our internal puppet (SAPA).

BTW, I show humility everyday when I hold my little girl and realize that all I do is for her and I'm terrified of what I can't control because of just how small we all are. Go ahead and spin it but I want to make as much money and have as much time off as I can finagle so that I can better her life. That's wants truly important.

Nobody says it better than JetJock...

And for me? Well I'm in Bozeman, MT and I'm about ready to have a great overnight...it's Snowing and I'm going to go enjoy life...forget APC and you anti-SkyWest mongrels for the day ;)

You are right. You should receive the respect you guys deserve. I was just calling it how I see it. The fact is there is a lot of animosity towards Skywest pilots whether you agree or not. I apologize if I bashed or made it sound like I was bashing Skywest. I have a lot of friends there and I hear their frustrations. I've come from a non union place and now work in a union place now and I just wished my friends benefited from some of the things I have now.

You area right as well. I was just trying to explain why some people were posting some of the stuff they are posting. I wasn't trying to say that anybody needs to adjust their thoughts or minds.

The animosity part is true as you read it everyday on here. Riding coat tails is also true unfortunately. I can repost the part of the SEC report again where Skywest management admits to it if you want.

Also unfortunately, we do have our share of pilot bashers. I don't think that is something that just happens at XJT or with ALPA members. Every group has it small percentage.

Trust me, I understand what you are saying. My job is like number 5 or 6 on my list of priorities. I work the system as well (from my ALPA thrown:)). I have two little ones as well and am very glad that I have the protections of my contract that allows me to spend the time with them as well.

My frustrations is that Skywest is so successfully that you guys could be thee best, undisputedly, hands down, no doubt about it, best airline to work for. And in turn, help out your fellow pilots that work for airlines that do not have it as good.

Nevets, what's wrong with being "arguably" the best ;)

hehe...nothing I guess if you want to settle for that.:)

At no point did I deny the "animosity" or the "riding of coat tails," I just think it's hilarious that you all truly believe we don't realize the obvious. That we are so blind sided by Jerry and friends that we'd gladly forfeit all human rights to have the chance to be employed by them. Don't be so naive!


We are "arguably" the best and even if we were "undisputedly, hands down, no doubt about it, the best airline" someone would argue otherwise.

BTW, add our bonuses and the fact that we don’t have to pay 1.95% in dues, to our CR2/7/9 rates and we’re ASA plus 4-10% (based upon what year you're in, what seat you hold and we have the w2's to prove it). Argue if you will but I voted yes for ALPA for other reasons than pay but the numbers speak for themselves and if you want to argue about just pay then there you have it.

SKW isn't perfect but their better than 97+% of the industry and their "arguably" the best. Call it "settling," call it what you will but that's why SKW's "arguably the best."

how much are they paying you after you rejected alpa
 

so what are the new pay rates at skywest supposed to be?

Sorry, I misunderstood your post. But at least some of the 65% don't realize it.;)

You are right that its not all about pay. Of course someone will always argue a point. But right now many people can make a reasonable case that XJT or Horizon has better pay and work rules. What I'm saying is that no one would be able to make a reasonable argument if Skywest pilots had true bargaining leverage, as you know.

No place is perfect but I do think its settling. And that is okay, I guess, if that is how you feel. But I personally wouldn't argue Skywest is the best and that is my only point.

By the way, union dues are 100% tax deductible. So the effective dues rate is a lot lower for many people.

I really don't care if you think we should have true bargaining leverage. That's our call, and we made it. Sorry to disappoint ya'll LoL :rolleyes:

The point is this. You are settling for less and just accepting how it is. How about a revolution? Perhaps challenge the system? How about asking for more. For restoring this profession. Sure you didn't release scope (which was a mistake by the major pilots) but since it was released you're riding your 70+ seater it all the way to your piggy bank. By comparing your paycheck to TSA, thats real impressive.

For the record, ExperimentalAB you trusted that your CEO Jerry would be better than ALPA, but he is not. Unless you can explain how the pay proposal is acceptable.

Also, for the record:
Remember saying this back in October? http://airlinepilotforums.com/showth...984#post251984
Do you just love Skywest, because to get by you have to work less than the min days off per month? Is that why you love it!? Well due to the fact that some of us do want to have "much of a life outside of work at the moment LoL..." I want to thank you again for not only whoring yourself out, but also for thinking its funny. LoL.

Definition of unnessesary whoring yourself out to Jerry and friends:

Can someone clarify for me? I'm new to this. So does this mean there is NO MORE Midwest at all? Or just the Skyway portion? I take it that means the Dorniers and 1900's are all gone, but the 717's still remain operated by Midwest...am I correct?

Skyway was Midwest's regional - SkyWest will now operate exclusively as the Connection side. Midwest will still be there...is that what you're asking?

Yeah...wow. I'm broken hearted. All I ever wanted to do was fly the dornier's lol.

This type of post is exactly why there is animosity towards Skywest pilots. Your call affects the rest of us whether people admit it or not. Like I said before, a little humility would go a long way.;)

I'm voting No for the "Payraise". Anything less than the cost of inflation is ridiculous. You guys really need to worry about the TSA's, Mesa's, Pinnacle's, and Gojets on here. When people are asking if they should work at Colgan it's surprising how many people will come on here and just say get your PIC that's all that matters. Stop worrying so much about skywest and focus on your ALPA brothers (and yes I did vote for ALPA). Cut the supply of Pilots off at these places and you will see pay come up. The regional industry needs a little consolidation.

Skywest is the best!!!

WOW !!!! You should send your whole paycheck to ALPA !!! You won't owe any taxes.

NWA757-

Who do you work for boss?

Honest question.

Which "first tier" regional? Having tiers in this industry is like trying to rank special ed children.

I was just pointing out that the effective dues rate isn't necessarily 1.95%. I only bring it up because Jetjock was comparing Skywest pay with ASA pay minus the dues rate. I was trying to make it more of an apples to apples comparison. Don't you agree?

you can't be serious.. wasnt the cost of inflation last year somewhere in neighborhood of 6%? you really think that you can achieve a COLA like that from ANY airline? the highest Ive seen at the regional level is 1.5% at Eagle, I think.. now, I'm not here to argue whether or not we deserve that or not, b/c I'm sure we'd all agree on that issue.. and I'm sure I'll be made fun of for accepting something lower than I think Im worth, but as for right now, I'll be voting yes when the chance comes.. in my opinion, there were too many people expecting too many things from this pay proposal.. and a COLA that matches inflation is just one of many unrealistic expectations

I dont think we can get 6%, but as a second year f/o I think we can do better than 0.32% on only -200, and a whopping 0% on -700

Keep in mind, besides the mighty 000000000000.32% pay raise to $35 now for a second year FO, you'll still get 1% on Jan 1, 2009, then 1% on Jan 1, 2010, in addition to whatever your normal longevity increases are through Dec 2010.

1 $19.50 12.82% $22.00 $22.00 $22.00
2 $34.89 0.32% $35.00 $35.35 $35.70
3 $35.97 3.14% $37.10 $37.47 $37.85
4 $37.08 3.16% $38.25 $38.63 $39.02
5 $38.22 3.35% $39.50 $39.90 $40.29
6 $39.41 3.15% $40.65 $41.06 $41.47
7 $40.63 3.10% $41.89 $42.31 $42.73

Vote early, and vote often.

Since dues aren't effectively optional at ASA, surely they figure into the comparison. And we could quibble that those dues are paid with taxable money to get the tax deduction, but sure, it's not EXACTLY 1.95% in actual cost. I'm confident that there are tax situations where is may be more.;)

First off, ExperimentalAB you talked a big game, NWA757 posted something about your previous posts and you chose to ignore it. Why don't you address that.

Second, JetJock, you overreact to almost every post about SKW. Nevets has been nothing but calm and reasonable, but you continue to put way too many exclamation points in your posts

Third, Tony & other SAPAs, that pay proposal was garbage. It would barely be competitive in todays market (considering XJT, AWAC, Horizon all have better) and is hardly an agreement that could hold us over til the next agreement. How can you offer us a proposal that actually pays less in some circumstances!?! I was hoping to prove that we could raise the bar, but this isn't even close. I want to send a message to management that we will not accept scraps. This poor pay scale is more proof in my mind that SAPA really does not have much bargaining power.

I hope other airline pilots understand that the people on this board are not neccesarily an acurate cross section of SKW employees. There are many of us who do understand the concept of bettering the industry and wish to improve upon the shortcomings of SKW.

The status quo is 0% COLA, 0% pay raise until 2010. Would you think we'll have a better chance in 2010 with the current pay scales, or the proposed ones?

Would you want the E120 to not only get 0%, but to multiply that by the 0% they got in 2006 ?

Anyhoo, I surely hope that you do vote, either way. If you want to "send messages", the best one would be 90% of the pilots voting.

Vote early, vote often!

That is the first thing you and I agree with all thread.

And vote NO. See what happens. To me, if management decides to negotiate with you, that can only be good for the entire Skywest (and every regional airline) pilot group. If they decide to not negotiate, then it is a clear signal you need ALPA.

Please vote, whatever you decide, but I think you should vote NO!

Tony, first of all I too would like to send kudos for using your real name, but can you answer why management is so married to the idea of BHO, and steer away from just having seperate base rates for 700 AND and seperate rate for 900.

On a seperate more positive skywest note, I don't want to send up alarm bells in payroll if this is in error, BUT I have been getting cancellation pay and block or better based on the leg, not the day lately. This is a BIG deal in ORD, where I'll over block a couple hours on a couple legs and get the rest of my day cancelled. For example last thursday I was supposed to do LEX-ORD-YWG-ORD

LEX-ORD credits 1:30
YWG turn credits about 4

that day we blocked 3:15 on the first leg
and winnepeg cancelled
I ended up getting 7:15

Tony- did this policy get changed back, that's the third in a row in a month or two, or is the new girl in ORD payroll dealing out monopoly chance cards bank error in my favor?

I certainly will, but I've been posting via iPhone (good for short-thoughts LoL) and spending too much time in Canada where I cannot log-in. It is not being ignored...patience my friend ;)

COLA at XJT is 3%. This was increased from 2.5% in December of 2006 and it goes through 2010.

Any pilot at ASA who is in their probationary period (one year but sometimes longer) pay ZERO dues. Also, any pilot can opt out and NOT pay any dues (they may still have to pay a shop fee of 1.45%[which is tax deductable as well], depending on their MEC policy).

Yes, they can be figured into pay comparison. Im just saying that many people dont pay dues, some pay a shop fee, and some pay an effective rate less than 1.95% depending on their tax situation. But the effective dues rate can NEVER be more than 1.95% because someone who doesn't deduct it or is unable to, doesn't get part of their dues money back and therefore effectively pays 100% of the 1.95% (but never more). Its a simple tax concept, really.

So my point is that you can compare but its not an apples to apples comparison because there is always a large percentage of people who dont effectively pay a full 1.95%.;)

My response would be raise your expectations. Why should I CHOOSE to vote yet to something that decreases my buying power year after year. Sure i give up .32% but the message this sends to management and other airlines management that are currently in negotiations would be better in the long run. Plus it gives us a chance to see if management will come back to negotiate or just raise 1st year pay. Think of how it would effect morale if they didn't come back. Sounds less costly to come back and negotiate.

Since inflation was actually 6% last year, even more a reason to get more than 1%. It's not really even 1% because they are just moving that from the block hour override increases that the 700 guys are getting.

Don't you think we ought to get more than ASA?

Does a simple "exclamation point" or two..............or three offend you? LOL! :eek:

And by your second statement I gather that you have long term memory issues. I mean, no offense, but to think that we don’t “understand the concept of bettering the industry and wish to improve upon the shortcomings of SKW” is flat out ridiculous. In order for you to actually think this, you would have to have trouble not remembering past the sentence you’re currently reading. :confused:

Please understand that I'm in agreement with you and I've chosen to vote NO for the pay proposal but I feel I need to address your above statement.

This statement is actually incorrect seeing that a 1% yearly increase on CR2 rates is more than the 1% BHO increase. I block around 80-85 hours per month, all on the CR9, and I credit around 120+ per month. This means that my 1% BHO increases is only on my block (80-85 hrs) with 40 or so hours paid at straight CR2 rates. Where as with the CR2 rate increasing I’ll get the 1% increase on all of my credit plus a 5% BHO on my flight time. (I want my 5% increase on all of my CR9 line credit values)

Don't get my wrong, I do not agree with the 1% and feel we deserve much more, I was just explaining the error in your statement.

Simple, YES!