Mesa Training Contract
 

Anyone here bail on Mesa and now are being threatened to be taken to court for the "contract"? Just wondering if anyone has dealt with this (one way or the other) and what the results were. I know this topic has been discussed on here before, but I am looking for Mesa in particular. Thanks.

I think Mesa is having enough fun in court as is without taking on this issue...

Does it suprise anyone that theyve got to the "beatings will cease once morale improves" approach?

Didnt think so.

Got a certified letter with a pay or else warning...sent it back refused.

I just left there in November and went to RAH and haven't heard anything yet. I was only there 8 months. Ive heard both sides of the story, that they have followed up and they haven't. If you get a lawyer you pretty much could get out of it. B/c they won't waste the money on taking it to court. Good Luck! Shouldn't be a problem....lots of Mesa guys over here!

I have heard of people getting threatend but as far as I know nobody has been sued.

I heard they had a new "pay_as_you_fly" program...
Makes sense... how else can they pay the bills?

On a serious note. If they escalate, get a lawyer if only to protect your credit. The threat of them having pay additional settlements in court should quiet them down.

My advise is stay one year and then take your PC/PT and then quit.

Good Luck!

This is a great thread. I am curious how it turns out for the pilots that decided to leave before the one year contract was up. Please let us know. I know there are many of us looking at leaving before one year is up but with the low wages I feel like I am barely getting by and dont need to pay off a contract if I do decide to leave. Mesa has great crews working here but in my short time here I can tell the Company could care less about its people.

Gotta letter, and a phone call. We'll see what happens next. I would have stayed if the aircraft I flew wasn't cut. Nothing like working somewhere that they don't need you. I called the others in my groundschool, and they received letters and phone calls, but nothing else. The worst that can happen is a hit to the credit report, as far as I can tell. My pennence for the sins of working the regional world!

Please let us know how it turns out- I debatingv on leaving early myself.

Got an un-certified letter stating "pay in full w/in 5 days or suit will be filed in Maricopa County Court". They have sent several certified letters, but I refused to accept them. That place blows, and treated me like poop. Total bill is less than $2,000.00, and I really don't want to pay it. Any thoughts?

I got a letter a month or 2 after I left (middle of 2006) and just got another the other day. Didn't sign for the certified letter. Sounds like a mass mailing in an attempt to get any money they can. There must be literally hundreds of us out there who left before one year, and if they can get just one of us to pay up, it'll pay for the cost of all those letters and then some. I don't plan on responding, or paying. I'd rather pay a lawyer twice the amout Mesa thinks I owe them then give any more money to JO and his entourage of liars.

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They have to know that there's no money to really recover. Their own business practices have ensured that those who leave are usually broke, and will continue to be so for some time. I wonder what they expect to gain?

I'm not sure they have any rational thought process remaining...maybe just lashing out at the employees who are causing their business to fail?

How did you know that it was a "pay or else" letter then?

Mesa loosing pilots like crazy on all equipment- I want to bail also but cant afford the training contract right now but in a couple months I will start throwing couple resumes. Is there any first hand experience out there with mesa actually taking these contracts to court?
The way I look at it is Mesa cant uphold to the pilot contract why should we worry about upholding training contract.

JRA ed down to eight days off a month and probably more to follow. So much for minimum of 10 days off a bid for line holders.

It isn't worth it. Get the hell out now. I haven't looked back once. They have tried to get me on the contract...so far I've beat them on it. Even with the contract...it isn't worth the pain and heartache (literally...my doc let me know I dropped my blood pressure 10 points when I left Mesa). LAMA is the best thing you can do for yourself!

Training contracts aren't legal unless you sign a promisary note. They cant do anything with you credit because you didnt purchase anything. Im sure you didnt give them you credit card infomation on the day you sign it right.

Another thing thats not legal in most states is, having the employee pay for their uniforms. This is illegal in the state of Washington and many others. Look up this information on the department of labor website.

They had to train you for you job. If training contract were legal and save money, then Mcdonals and Burger King would have them too. You dont see them sending out letter saying "I trainned you on my fryer and you used my training to benifit youself at Wendy's."

Just keep ignoring those letters!

I sent Vagabond a message hoping that she'll chime in on this thread. She's our resident lawyer. I'm sure she could give some generic advice. Regardless, you guys need to speak to an attorney. May save you quite a bit of headache because it's my understanding that there isn't too much that is legal about the contract there.

Thanks, Pilotpip. I have never seen this training contract or do I know the circumstances of how people signed one or did not sign one. Any advice I give is going to be so general as to be less than useful. If anyone has a specific question, please feel free to PM me. Or contact a lawyer of your own.

General contract law - there must be an offer, acceptance and consideration. There is no contract without these three elements. Once there is a contract, either side must abide by it or the side following all the terms may sue you. You then have defenses you can use to say why you did not follow through with your side of the bargain. It's a long, drawn out process. In first year law school, students spend an entire semester just on Contracts.

I don't mean to be coy, but I can give more meaningful advice if I know specifics. Besides, I've been told more than once that since I'm a lawyer, I don't belong in a pilot's forum, so I'm not too inclined to post "advice" here anymore.

Tell Mesa ALPA to get rid of the training contract with their next contract. What a bad way to trap employees. Make working there so bad, and you can't afford to leave. JO is sick.

Most all of my friends that joined LAMA haven't paid a cent.

I am a LAMA and I recommend it more than anything to anyone with 8 days off a month. My schedule at my current company is stellar. Days off everywhere, higher pay with better work rules, and maybe 1 MEL a month. Oh yeah, and management cares about us, isn't moving to China and isn't getting sued in court again. Ahhhhh LAMA really is nice now that I think about it again.

Whats LAMA?

It's a funny-looking South American herd animal (spelled llama). In mesa-context, it's Life After Mesa Airlines...they even have little lama stickers for your flight bag.

Oh ok, I'm in LAHA then!

LLAMA to be exact:

Lovin' Life After Mesa Airlines.

Peace out!
:D

Mesa Sucks!!!!!:D

Anyone paid yet? They have taken my amount from $2800 down to $1500 in the last few months in an effort to get me to pay. Does anyone know if they have taken anyone to court yet? I just can't stomach giving those bastards $1500.

I have eard on here how Mesa breaches the contract as far as work rules, although I am not sure how (everyone just says "they don't honor the contract"). If THEY breach a contract and were doing it before you left, isn't the contract null and void. How can you break a contract that they have already broken? Follow the logic?

Two entirely separate contracts. The promissary note is not mentioned in the pilot contract. It is signed during the 1st week of indoc, before you ever see a union pilot contract.

Bad logic.

haha. Cops and Lawyers. They're all the scum of the earth until you need one.

Got a nice "call us back or we will sue you" phone call today. I tell you these people have no soul. If you are considering working for this place...DON'T!!!!!!

Anyone else have luck getting out of it. For those who did settle, what seems to be the majic number they will settle for? 50%?? Thanks.

They sent me a settlement letter for $1500... the original amount I owed (after they kept my last paycheck) was $2800. Goodbye tax return :rolleyes:.

Haven't heard of anyone actually being taken to court yet. I've managed to drag this out for months now, each month they take the amount lower. $1500 is supposidly their "last offer". I'm going to send it in pennies coated in a pound of dog feces.

I have heard they have now filed suit against lot of people. Anyone know if this is true?

This used to come up a lot with the Gulf of Mexico helo pilots. They found that the companies really couldn't do anything to you because it's a form of indentured servitude or something (they had a few cases go to court and support that finding). I'll try to find something more substantial than just my cruddy memory.

When receiving collection agency calls, use the following phrase, "Under the Fair Credit and Collection Act, do not ever call me again regarding this matter."

If they do call, keep a record, then sue 'em in small claims (or superior) court for the harrassment. They may end up paying YOU the amount of the debt.

In some states it is not legal to keep a last paycheck to satisfy company debts. One might want to do a little internet research on the topic.

Yup,

Here is a current list.

http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.go...Mesa+Air+Group

You can use the search function to find specific pilot names as well.

Did you have an employee number when you were one week into indoc? Were you getting paid? :confused:
At Lakes you don't get paid (when I was there) until after you finish your checkride, so you are not an employee when you signed the letter. :cool:

BTW...may not be an issue in the future...but I know guys who signed the CA contract with a note at the bottom:
"This is VOID if I am downgraded or do not finish upgrade."

Its not all bad (sorry about the format):
Case InformationCase Number:CV2000-012780Judge:Barton, JanetFile Date:7/10/2000Location:DowntownCase Type:Civil Party InformationParty NameRelationshipSexAttorneyJonathan Ornstein Plaintiff Male PAUL NALABANDIAN Mesa Airlines Plaintiff None PAUL NALABANDIAN Daniel Defendant Male Pro Per Case DocumentsFiling DateDescriptionDocket DateFiling Party7/19/2000 AFS - Affidavit Of Service 7/24/2000 NOTE: P3 SERVED 07-12-2000 7/12/2000 IPH - Injunction Prohibit Harassment 7/14/2000 7/11/2000 RRR - Req Restrict Release Address 7/12/2000 Plaintiff(1) 7/10/2000 PIH - Petition For Injunction Of Harassment 7/12/2000 Plaintiff(1)

Word on the street is that 50% seems to do the trick. I hate to say it but that might be cheaper and simpler than attorney fees and bad credit.

Uhh, Lakes has the most ironclad training contract in the industry. There is a set precedence in case history. GLA pilot tried to claim duress and failed, miserably, to prove his case. Since you sign the contract prior to employment at GLA you cannot claim duress, well you can, but you don't have a leg to stand on in court.

http://wyomcases.courts.state.wy.us/...?CiteID=448863

GLA is unique in the fact that they put a notification of the training contract in the pilot application, which you have to acknowledge (think, paper trail). They are also quite unique in the fact that you are not an employee 'till completion of the checkride. You sign the contract prior to employment. There is NO way you can claim duress.

At MAG, you sign the contract after you start work there (after you quit your last job), you will be fired from MAG if you refuse to sign. You have no choice. Couple that with the fact that MAG is completely unable to prove (on paper) that you knew about the training contract prior to employment.

With all that said,