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-   -   Colgan Air must be up to something (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/23115-colgan-air-must-up-something.html)

Seggy 03-03-2008 11:57 AM


Originally Posted by plasticpi (Post 332685)

I don't see how any of this is a bad move. It's progress.

How can you call this progress when we get a memo the other day about them changing our pay rules when it comes to MX cancellations AND just throwing new hot reserve credit times out there?

Progress would be if we were negotiating a contract.

The Juice 03-03-2008 12:00 PM


Originally Posted by plasticpi (Post 332685)
I don't know why some people are trying to complain about things that are helps to them. Yes it could be better. Yes these are small things. But, would you rather not have them at all?

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Pocket your $200. Take a shower before you head to the airport when your reserve is activated. Feel a little bit better about commuting.

I don't see how any of this is a bad move. It's progress.

It is progress but we must not be naive to think they are doing this to be nicer to us pilots. Maybe I am cynical but I find it odd how they are giving when the union drive is getting close to get going again.

What we need is work rules with protection. They can give and take their rules away whenever they want and we are left with nothing. A contract will not allow them to change things when they dont like something.

An example of no rules is that happened to me recently. The changed my reserve period the day before from an AM reserve to a PM reserve so they could activate me for an evening show. I was amazed how they can just change a posted awarded schedule to whatever they need for whatever they want. What can I do? Nothing! Who am I going to call and complain to? the Chief Pilot...yeah like that is going to happen. We do not have a contract which says what they can and cant do and that is what we need most of all.

HSLD 03-03-2008 12:11 PM

Just curious if organizing cards are out on the property at Colgan? If so, US Labor law requires employers to maintain "laboratory conditions" while organizing attempts are underway.

This is a pretty common ploy for an airline to attempt to rebuff organizing efforts at no cost or risk. It works like this: The airline promises improvements to work agreements only to rescind the improvement due to DOL requirements. The effect is that the airline paints the union as a problem - not a solution for the pilots. When faced with the prospects of unionization on the property, most managements will pull out all the stops to rebuff organization efforts.

FlyJSH 03-03-2008 12:18 PM


Originally Posted by plasticpi (Post 332685)
I don't know why some people are trying to complain about things that are helps to them. Yes it could be better. Yes these are small things. But, would you rather not have them at all?

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Pocket your $200. Take a shower before you head to the airport when your reserve is activated. Feel a little bit better about commuting.

I don't see how any of this is a bad move. It's progress.


Don't get me wrong, I will take whatever scrap is thrown my way. All I am saying is that these things ARE scraps: grand gestures which cost almost nothing. These scraps we eat, are not given out of the kindness of B's heart. They are measured responses to some problem HE has: on time performance, shortfalls in staffing, some of these silly pilots who want a union..... who knows?


No management (airline or otherwise) "gives" workers pay raises, better working conditions, etc. Management spends money to improve the bottom line (ie. higher pay attracts more applicants, more applicants means I can choose the cream of the crop, the cream of the crop produces a better product, I can sell a better product for a higher price, I make more money).

FlyJSH 03-03-2008 12:21 PM

What does "laboratory conditions" mean? I don't quite follow

Seggy 03-03-2008 12:25 PM


Originally Posted by FlyJSH (Post 332711)
What does "laboratory conditions" mean? I don't quite follow

the 'status quo'

FlyJSH 03-03-2008 12:34 PM


Originally Posted by HSLD (Post 332703)
Just curious if organizing cards are out on the property at Colgan? If so, US Labor law requires employers to maintain "laboratory conditions" while organizing attempts are underway.

This is a pretty common ploy for an airline to attempt to rebuff organizing efforts at no cost or risk. It works like this: The airline promises improvements to work agreements only to rescind the improvement due to DOL requirements. The effect is that the airline paints the union as a problem - not a solution for the pilots. When faced with the prospects of unionization on the property, most managements will pull out all the stops to rebuff organization efforts.

so for those of us slow on the uptake....

Workers: We want more money.
Management: There is no more money.
Workers: We want a union.
Management: okay. Oh, by the way we found more money and were going to give you a 20% increase, but since you are going union, we can't give the raise. See how bad unions are?


or am I completely lost

Dash8Pilot 03-03-2008 12:35 PM

Has crew scheduling been pretty understanding if commuters have difficulty getting to work and occasionally end up getting there late? I only ask because a commuter policy is a double edged sword. If crew scheduling typically works with pilots, then the policy forces you to come in a couple flights early, just so you will be listed in case you don't make it. If crew scheduling typically tries to get you into trouble for a missed commute, then the policy will be a huge help.

Seggy 03-03-2008 12:38 PM


Originally Posted by Dash8Pilot (Post 332732)
Has crew scheduling been pretty understanding if commuters have difficulty getting to work and occasionally end up getting there late?

NO!

[filling up space]

skidmark 03-03-2008 02:25 PM

Colgan is definetly up to something. Yes the commuter policy is a necessity. Its about freaking time. And parking and uniforms don't really cost them anything to management. For once I agree with monkey boy. The pay scales have not changed!! Maybe I will give my free uniform to the homeless guy at the stop light in Manassas. So he will beg for more. Just my 2 cents.

-Skidmark-


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