Regional salary
 

What is the yearly salary of a Regional Airline (ASA, Comair, Air Wisconsin) Captain with say 15-18 years in?

Here are a couple links that show a bunch of airlines' pay rates:

http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com/a...2005030344.htm

http://www.willflyforfood.cc/Payscales/PayScales.htm

enjoy

Honestly, it's not bad. I've been doing some research by talking to people outside of aviation, looking particularly at people with my college major: meteorology. You hear alot of people upset with their salary on this forum, especially the regional dudes. Through my research I actually found something sorta funny: I'd probably have greater earnings potential spending a career as a regional airline pilot than spending a career as a meteorologist or related scientist. I hear pilots on the forum saying how us young guys should give up flying and go into "normal jobs" where we'd "make more money". If I were to change paths and use my meteorology degree instead of my pilot qualifications, THAT would actually be the pay cut. Crazy, huh?

You need to compare apples to apples, because I guarantee that hour for hour you will make much more as a meteorologist. The pay as fourth or fifth year captain in the regionals works out to about 8-10$ an hour. Some with duty rig and better work rules may be better, but for the time you spend away from home and the crappy schedule, christmas, thanksgiving, birthdays, etc.,etc.etc, the pay is very low. It is very time consuming and can be hard. Any captain should make 100,000 a year in the regionals for what you put on the line and the responsibility, not to mention the cost of getting your ratings and the terrible pay up to date. People see the end result and think pilots are so rich, there is much more to it.

There are many variables, but if you make some assumptions about a 15 year captain...

1) Decent line w/ no reserve
2) Enough days off to pick up volunteer flying
3) The option to minimize long layovers, or just do daytrips...
4) The option to make extra money as a check airman.

$70-$100K is a reasonable pay range, let's call it 85K. If you do one 3.5 day trip per week (minus three weeks vacation), you get paid: $20/ hour away from home.

If you are on duty an average of 12 hours each day, you get paid: $40/ hour of duty.

If you use your travel benefits a lot, you might want to factor that in...aside from commuting we use over $20K/year of travel, which is alot.

Now the good news about time away from home is that it's not all bad...I work out more on trips, and when you're actually asleep, it doesn't really matter where you are.

Your right, and it can also be variable for a meteorologist, because different weather jobs have different life styles. A forecaster at the NWS or a private firm will do shift work, often times weekend/overnight/holiday. All you do is show up and forecast for 8 or 10 hours (from experience, accurately predicting the weather is very hard). If you do environmental consulting then it's more 9-5, plus perhaps some travel/field work, and you often times have to take work home with you. Then you have your research professors who teach and do more liesurly research work. Those jobs are nice. It costs alot of money for them too, because to attain the highest levels you need a masters or PhD on top of your BS, which can be very expensive if you have to pay for it yourself.

A person's salary, in any career field, is always a very subjective thing. You may be able to make more as an environmental consultant but you may hate the work, and would rather forecast. Unfortunately, not only is it hard to do an apples-to-apples comparison, but even then it may not tell you the whole story. Airlines pilots are (usually) paid per flight hour with additonal pay from per diem, duty rig, etc. A meteorologist is almost always paid on a fixed salary, with shift forecasters also getting an override for overtime, holiday, etc. There could be other bonuses as well. My analyses, therefore, just looked at the amount of dollars you walk away with at the end of the year. Beyond that, your "satisfaction" is going to stem from how much your enjoying your job.

I'm working part time at a mall retail store while going to school. It's a good company, good products, decent salary (would get free health benefits if I was full time). My manager makes about $65K by running the store, managing everything, and dealing with angry jackass customers. Christmass time was a stress nightmare. It's a cool, good job for a college student like me, but I wouldn't want to do it forever.

The biggest thing in the end is if you can look at your life and say your happy. My closest mentor is a super-senior 777 FO at Continental (mid 40s), and he's gotten pay cuts just like everyone else at the legacies. He typically does those long-ass flights from EWR to asian cities, and is divorced (I don't think it had to do with his being away from home), but has two great kids. He says he's loving his job and loving life.

MikeB525,
Real quick since we are talking about meterologist. Whats the lifestyle and salary of a TV news Meteorologist. My degree is in Broadcasting and I used to see those guys when we visted the TV stations.

How much does your 777 FO make per year? Here is my story. I am 37 years old commercial single engine pilot with around 460 hours. I will get my multi and CFI this summer. I was originally wanting to be an airline pilot. But after hearing and reading all the negativity on this board and others (which I dont understand why these people tell others not t pursue aviation yet they have been doing it themselves for years) that I am reconsidering. I realize there are other flying jobs out there as well. I am considering flying for law enforcement. I have found a department that flies 172's/182's. After some experience there, if I dont stay , I may go to the FAA and be a aviation safety inspector or flyi for thre flight inspection field office. Or I may teach aviation at a regular college or university. I dont mean a starving CFI.I mena an actual college professor in the aviation deparrtment. That would require me to geta MAsters degre in aviation or education which Iwant to do anyway.

I am not limiting myself to justairlines. I know thats what everyone thinks about. And dont get me wrogn. It would be great to fly from LAX to Hawaii to Japan. But I am not sure if I want to start out at a regional being 29 years old making 20K

I Think Dogpilot is off a little bit.

"The pay as fourth or fifth year captain in the regionals works out to about 8-10$ an hour"

Thats about $21K a year. I'm a 6 yr. CA at a regional and made over 70K.
Not the best, but a little better than $10.

N6724G - A little confused here. Are you in broadcasting or metrology? Are you 37 or 29? I'm maybe wondering if you are really 17 and getting ready to go into college.....Hmmmmmnnn?

But I'll play along and hopefully this info will help. As posted above there are websites that give exact pay for specific airlines as they are regulated by a contract. As for people on these forums saying to stay out of aviation you really need to consider the source of the info. I for one am close to 40, been in the biz since I was 18 and have worked for 6 companies from tour flights to Island hopping, to regional and major airline work only to have been furloughed after 9/11. Am I ticked off? Not really. Life hands us some crazy turns and we adapt. If you can't or don't like adapting then definitely stay out of aviation!! The biggest problem hitting the airline industry now is the 'race to the bottom.' There are regionals that are willing to work for less and less $$. They in turn slash current contracts and/or offer pilots food stamp wages and there are pilots STANDING IN LINE for these jobs! It's no different now than back in the day when I flew Canyon tours and made $700/mo. But then I knew there were regional jobs that would pay more and a major airline job that would win me the lottery. But if you have been following aviation and have seen that UAL has 1800 furloughed, AA 2800, DAL 540, US Air 2000, and my old Co NWA at 700 and climbing. The management at the majors wants to hand over all the short hop and small plane flying to its regionals - ie. Loss of pilots and flying at the majors, and therefore less jobs at that high pay scale.

For your situation best-case scenario, you go to a flight training academy pay big $$ and end up with a regional job inside of a year. You are then stuck there at $20k/yr for 4 years until upgrade then go to $45k/yr. You can hang there forever and grow to $80-100k/yr depending on if you want to fly a lot or become and instructor or Chief Pilot. You could then go to a cargo company or charter company and fly larger aircraft with not so good work rules but be making larger $$. And finally go to the majors in say 10+ years once all the kinks are worked out and retirements have swung the hiring back into motion.

Take some time, read some posts on all of the forums including major, regional, cargo and fractional and also do some time at your local airport talking to some pilots (corporate, fractional and regional.) If I were you and have the metrology degree, not the broadcasting, I would stay there and look into working for a carrier that needs in house weather. Netjets has a very impressive weather dept and most majors also have in house weather. I have no idea what it pays. You could also get your dispatchers license and go that route. With those two choices you are home nightly and will get so see your kids grow up!

Good luck.

Baja.

$70k at 250 hrs a month TAB / 30 days = $9.33 I think that was where he was going with the low wages. If you were to compare your $70k with a regular 9-5 5 days a week for $70 I think we all know who wins there?!?!?

BTW - your 6 yr capt job at $70k is the same as a 6 yr capt was at Pan Am flying the whale in 1980. Go figure eh???

Baja.

Mike, if your manager was doing his job, the customers would not be angry. Are they angry about the products or the service? Don't forget that those 'jackass customers' are putting you through school and putting food on your table.
I went to Tony Romas for dinner the other night with my wife. They were very busy with a 30 min. wait for a table. We decided to eat at the bar as there were two open seats. After 12 mins sitting there without being acknowledged by the bartender, I decided to leave. On the way out, I asked the hostess to pass to the manager that he just lost my business do to poor service. She politely asked me if I would please tell him directly as he would really want to know why I was displeased. I told my story to the manager who was very apologetic and asked if I would please reconsider and that he would seat me immediately. He personally seated us, brought over a waitress and personally introduced her and instructed her to comp our first round of drinks and a free appetizer of our choice. Do to his superior management skills in turning a disappointing situation into a great dining experience, I will continue to frequent this restaurant. Studies have shown that a customer that has a poor experience will tell an average of 9 people whereas a customer with a positive experience will tell 3 people about it.

Here's something for everyone. Mesaba Mgt wants to throw out the pilot contract and force terms on them. One of them is the pilots will take a 19.4% paycut! &%#%$!@*! that! It really is a race to the bottom........

NWA has taken close to 40 % and DAL is at 49%...what's another 19.4% between friends?

Management can suck bypass....

Baja.

Just for your info.. 39% cut in salary, 41% total cut in overall pay and benefits at NWA. Will be voting today!

Dogpilot and baja are the only people in the world who thinks he ought to be paid for the 100hrs a month he spends SLEEPING in a hotel and spending time checking out the layover city. That is not working! Everyone knows airline pilots spend time away from home (just like military folks), but they spend a lot less time away from home and the pay usually makes up for it.

I think regional pay is fine as long as you are young and you only spend about 5 years there at max. I am 22 and I plan to be at a regional in under 6 months. By the time I am 27 that means I would potentially make $65,000 a year. That's plently for me at 27!

For people who think regional pay is low, think of it as your "starting job" as everyone else in the non-aviation world does.
EXAMPLES:
Baseball players in the minor leagues (Less than $1000 a month)
Airline management that starts out as CSR's or flight attendents. (Low pay)
Store managers that start out as minimum wage clerks. (Minimum wage)
ETC...

I mean, I have an aerospace engineering degree and I am making the same as a CFII as many of my friends in the industry. My work is fewer hours, easier, and I downright LOVE my job.

My point is you need to "learn to walk before you can learn to fly." A few years at a regional is ok if the result is a major airline career at $150-$200K a year later on in my career. As long as all flying does not switch to regionals, this is ok.
This is where USAir took the right course on making the EMB-190 a mainline jet.
This is where Mesa took the WRONG course. Anything 75+ or so belongs at a major. No more 90-100 seat jets at regionals.

BAJA,
You did misunderstand and got your posters mixed up. I am neither a journalist or a meteorologist. What I said was I have a Degree in Journalism. I never said thats what I did for a living. I am a police officer and I am also in the army national guard. I have a commercial single engine land lisence with about 400 hours. When I return rom military duty, I am going to get my multi engine and my CFI

I'm not one to start a fued but have you seen the movie "Waiting". Cardinal rule here, "Never mess with people who handle your food". Trust me after you see that movie you will never pull that crap again!

My point is you need to "learn to walk before you can learn to fly." A few years at a regional is ok if the result is a major airline career at $150-$200K a year later on in my career. As long as all flying does not switch to regionals, this is ok.
This is where USAir took the right course on making the EMB-190 a mainline jet.
This is where Mesa took the WRONG course. Anything 75+ or so belongs at a major. No more 90-100 seat jets at regionals.[/QUOTE]


I totally agree with the last statement that anything above 75 seats belong at majors. NWA used to fly the DC-9-10 with 78 seats. Now Steel'in wants to give the 100 seater to NewCo, the so called new regional airline of NWA, Inc


Good luck spending only 5-6 yrs at a regional. There are guys who said that 15+ yrs ago and are still at regionals

I've had mostly great experiences working with the customers at my store, it's just those few people who drive you up the wall. Alot of it seems to stem from my store's return policy. We give you a 60 day trial period with each product (90 days for certen items). In order to get a your money back you need to bring your origional reciept (and origional credit card, if applicable). If you don't have those we'll still be happy to give you a store credit thats good at any of our 300 nation-wide locations. I've seen lots of people get really mad when they don't have the reciept, etc., and aren't satisfied with the store credit.

As for the question about broadcast, it's a wide and varied thing. You need to have good stage presence and, lets not kid ourselve, look and sound appealing. You must have personality. The TV Weatherman job used to be sort of a joke, but it's become more serious, and more and more broadcasting companies want real degreed meteorologists to do their weathercasts. I think you can still do it with a journalism or communications degree, but it may be harder to get.

You start out in small markets; local affiliates of the big stations. It could also be radio. You may start at as little as 20K-25K. After gaining experience and a good reputation you can start to move up to bigger markets and higher salary. The goal would be to become weathercasters at major big-name stationswill make in excess of $100K, but it is very difficult to get to that level. An example is to be the primary weathercaster for the ABC News affiliate in a major city. Al Rokers are celebreties, few and far between, and make ALOT of money.

You hit the nail on the head there...the majors long term ideal plan is for ALL flying to be performed by subcontractors like mesa...each major would have 5 or 6 subs and could play them off against each other, almost totally removing the power of the strike.

If you think you will EVER get to a major, to say nothing of 5 years down the road (LMAO) ...the mainline guys need to grab their scope by the b@lls ...they should be flying everything >50 seats (which includes MY airplane).

MESA didn't take the wrong course...they're making money hand over fist, and in case you didn't get the word pilot welfare is not on mesa's agenda in any way, shape, or form. The AWA ALPA guys went wrong by letting their company outsource airplanes the size of DC-9's and F-100's. It's gotta start at mainline and those boyz gotta realize it...

BTW, the kind of manager who starts out as a CSR is a chump..he'll be a middle manager (maybe) his whole life and not have much to show for it...the big-time airline managers whom everybody loves to hate don't come from the CSRs or the ramp, they are high-end B-school grads with a whole different perspective on life...

Well, after a couple years of "checking out the layover city" I think you'll change your tune. We're not talking about Paris here you know...more like Tulsa, and it's the airport holiday inn (close to the airport but nothing else), not the downtown Hilton.

Military folks come in several distinct varities...young kids who are there to get some job training or college benefits, have no college, and DID NOT pay $50-100K for the privelege of enlisting. But they still make regional FO moneyt ($15-30k) ...

The elite folks (pilots, nuclear submariners, special operations) generally get paid WELL over $100K, PLUS all the sweet benies and the retirement. They didn't pay for their training either; most had their college paid for too.

When I decided I needed to buy my own airplane a while back, I simply volunteered for 6 months active duty to pay for it...

Just curious rickair7777, or for anybody else, why buy your own plane when you do it for a living. Thats the last thing I want to do is fly a plane, or go anywhere on my free time. I spend enough time away from home. Besides, I look at it as betting my ticket if I go flying for "fun".

I just like to fly (my family too), and GA is totally different from 121 ops. As long as your club has maintenance and ADs under control, there's almost no risk of violation in GA for an airline pilot...you're probably too smart to fly into B right? The only brushes I ever had with violations were when I was working as a CFI and trying to satisfy all the competing operational demands. And there's always the NASA form...

5 years at a regional.

If I join a regional with 1000hrs, mostly PIC.
I work as FO for 2 or 3 years (Well within reason considering the upgrade times I saw), and then work as Captain for 3 years.
I would expect to have 5000TT, and 3000PIC, probably jet. Reasonable?

Are you telling me that the airlines that are currently hiring (Southwest, JB, Continental, UPS, FedEx,...) will not hire you with those numbers. What happens in a few years when the rest of the majors start hiring again... I am sorry, but even given the poor hiring conditions of today, 5 years at a decent regional is a fair estimation. If you disagree, I'd like to hear actual reasons.

No deductive reasoning...Just cause one guy said that 15 years ago does not speak for the other 90% of regional pilots from 15 years ago who are flying for majors today.

There are going to be some retirements over the next 5 years, a LOT at USAir (maybe enough to recall most of their furloughs).

All the airlines you mentioned have huge stacks of resumes from RJ captains and military guys.

UPS, FEDEX you have to know someone (do you?). And their interviews are f*cking brutal. I know a guy who barely squeeked through at UPS, and felt lucky to have been hired. He was an RJ check airman... and his dad flys for UPS!

SWA is fun...first you have to buy a 737 type rating ($8K). That will give you a decent chance of getting called for the interview...a rough survey of people I know indicates that they hire abot 20-25% of folks who interview. So you interviewed, but didn't make it (for every winner, there's lots of losers and odds are you're one of them!). Now you have an $8K type rating.... Well maybe you get lucky and get called by JB or CAL...so now you're at their interview trying to convince them that you really have always dreamed of working there...but you first you have to explain why you have a 737 type on your ATP LOL (hint: there's only one possible reason for a regional CA to posses a 737 type).

Once you hit that 5000 window, you need to know someone, get the interview, and succeed at the interview. The odds aren't good. More than 5000 hours may increase your odds slightly but not much...eventually the majors will start asking themselves why you have 9000 hours and have not been hired yet...they will assume that you have tried and failed elsewhere, so why should they waste THEIR time and money on you. There are always exceptions, but few and far between.

This is the way it is TODAY, and could change for better or worse (but I don't see fuel prices going down, my wildest fantasy is they don't go up anymore)

Sorry - got your confused with Mike who is meterolgy...But as you see above you say your are 37 and then say 29...just kinda strange - maybe you ment 39?

And for the moron that thinks you shouldn't count time away from home - What do you think work is smart guy? It's something you do when away from your family and you get paid for it. So are you saying you would be fine doing a 7 day trip, one leg each way and the the rest of the time in a hotel and be happy getting paid for flight time? Get a grip guy!

That's where the problem starts - new young guys can't wait to work for $19/hr flying a plane...Wooooooooooooohoooooooooooooo!!!!! I'm a regional pilot now - look at me!!! It's all fun and games until someone gets hurt - and you know who that person is smart guy??? It's you when you wake up, have a wife - two kids and a house and you are still making $60k a year (topped out) wishing that UAL/DAL/NWA/CAL job was there to pay the big bucks - but it's gone because the majors gave all the flying away to your little carrier. Starting to get it yet???? You know what the average pax thinks when they know the pilots are making a combined salary less than they do? They are scared!! Time for you to get scared as well!! Think about it!!

Baja.

Maybe his dad *used* to fly for UPS, but the nepotism rules prevent relatives from being hired there. If your mom's brother-in-law works for UPS in any capacity other than handler, you can't work for UPS.

rickair7777...just wondering...nough said. About the majors.....everything that has beeen written is true. UPS, Fed Ex, SWA,.......need recomendations.
Good luck to anyone who gets a job with those. I have'nt applied ...yet. Waiting with what's going to happen with NWA. If NWA goes under... will look for a job with the us governmet. Only need 7.5 years to get a pension with them. AIM HIGH!

I don't get it - what's wrong with flying into class B?

Whats wrong with flying into class "B". Well nothing taking the proper procedures, equipment, and certification requirements. However I almost got myself in some trouble about a year ago up in Chicago because of my recent lack of VFR flying. Vowed right then and there I wouldn't go "tootling" around class B any more :D , or take the local flight instructors word for the dimensions of the local airspace when my ticket was on the line. Well just say that controller said a few words I've never even heard before.

XtremeF150

Wondering about me? I have never been to an interview and not been offered a job. I actually have a standing offer that I will take when my family circumstances improve. I'm not bitter, if that's what you're getting at. I'm actually one of the lucky exceptions. But I know that I'm VERY lucky and not everyone will have the same opportunities so I try to provide realistic info to people who are trying to make realistic career decisions. My advice is based on the composite experiences of lots of professional pilots who I know. Some of the readers here don't know any professional pilots at all, so maybe the info will be of use.

Thanks for trying Baja, but what can you say to a 22 year old that knows it all. He's got the plan except for the furloughs, pay cuts, and going up against 5000 other guys for the same job. After he walks the street a few times wondering how to feed the family and hoping to not have to move again maybe the light bulb will click.

After reading all this I have to wonder why ANYONE would pick this job. Do you all really love flying THAT much? I have recently come to terms with the fact that I do not. The sacrifices don't seem worth the 'ultimate' payoff of flying for the majors, which isn't even a sure thing: ridiculously low pay for the first few (or more) years, being away from family for half the month, sitting in a cockpit monitoring systems for hours on end, worrying about furloughs, not being able to switch companies and keep your status, pay cuts, etc, etc

With that said, I do love flying, but I'm talking about taking up family and friends in an Arrow for a short day trip to somewhere fun. The majority of posters here make it seem like a horrible career, but justify it with their "love of flying."

Thats my point exactly Uncle Bose. These people profess to love flying so much and yet the dter people from pursuing it.

I got an idea. Why doesn't everyone who HATES flying as much as they portray it on this board just quit their job. If you really HATE it that much. I could work as a CFII for the rest of my life and LOVE the hell out of it. Make more than the average american too at age 22.

The FACT is that you have provided me with NO FACTS that show my plan is flawed? Do you have any facts? Better yet, do you have any ways that I can be better prepared for the (Pay cuts, furloughs, etc...). By all means, I want to hear EVERYONE's mistakes so I can better prepare for them.

I am sick and tired of hearing people tell me how damn BAD flying is. If you hate your job so much, just quit. If you think my plan is flawed, tell me how it is flawed and what I can do to increase my chances.
Enough said.

I like my job, but I fly with many folks who don't but seem unwilling to make the effort switch careers. Well, lately more folks have been actualling doing that. I just want everyone to understand that there are significany challanges in pay, quality of life, and stability. But if you REALLY enjoy flying that won't matter.

I also have an ulterior motive...I don't want some kid (in his infinite youthful wisdom) convincing himself that if he takes an airline job for $6/hour now that it will all pay off with huge $$$$ in the end. There are no huge $$$$ left at the end, and that sort of misconception continues to undercut what's left of the industry. I want new pilots to realize that they are worth far more than they are actually being paid so that they are less likely to work now for a payoff later...the leaders of this industry will happily take your "work now", but they will immediately pocket your "payoff". When you get to the payoff point, it's allready been liquidated in chapter 11 or exercised as management stock options. These facts are free to be had by reading the newspapers.

If flying was really as bad as they say it is, then they wouldn't be doing it. If they can make more money at Burger King (as I have heard), then they would be there working there, instead of flying. I'm not saying it is the perfect career, because it certianly does have its flaws, but which career doesn't?

Every career has problems and those people complain about it too, just as happens here, its only natural for people to complain about whatever they can. Some times these people will realize its the wrong career for them, and thats fine. But to complain is the natural way of things, remember way back in school, the older grades would tell you how hard there grade was, how mean the teachers were, how unfair, etc. Some of it turned out to be true, some of it did not. There is truth to what these guys are saying, but there is also exagerration, just as in school (not that I'm calling you liars, since I can't make that conclusion, because I don't know any of you). But I think if you go in knowing it isn't perfect, knowing it will be tough, and knowing the problems with the career, you won't become disillusioned like others have with their careers. I think the main thing they are trying to say is "Don't think its perfect, don't think its easy, for we had made those mistakes when we were new like you."

If you go into a career because of the money, you will never be happy about it, no matter how much you make. I think too many people have gone with Aviation due to the high pay, and the esteem, and all the fiction that surrounds it, only to be let down because there expectations were too high, and they realize that they do not really enjoy flying, as a job.

Now in no way take this as an authoritative stance, I have not been paid to fly yet, and have low time, these are just my thoughts on what is happening, and could easily be wrong, since I haven't acutally expeirenced it myself. (<-----My way of covering my a$$)

N6724G and Mike B525, the airline industry could use more folks like you. I spent over 10 years in the business world before switching to a pilot career and have loved every minute of it. The schooling, the instructing and the line flying. Pilots who think that there are 9 to 5 , 40 hour a week jobs paying $70,000/ year have their head in the clouds ;) No, the pay does not start out great. But what entry level job does?

I've worked desk jobs where I saw my family less than I do with an airline. If only I were independently wealthy and didn't have to work at all, but alas, work I must. This is the first and only career where I actually look forward to going to work. It has virtually no stress compared to other management positions I have had and when I walk off the plane and head home I have no stress at all. Not worried about quotas, proposals, contracts, or delegated responsibilities not being completed. All I have to worry about is what time I sign in three or four days from now. With this career, when you are off, you are really off. And I enjoy a career that has a combination of manual and intellectual skills. My product is a safe landing and every time a deliver one (even on a calm, sunny day) I feel good even if nobody else notices.

You do have to put up with a bunch of socialists who think that the almighty and all knowing worker should decide what we should fly (scope), when we should fly it (work rules), and how much we should be paid to fly it, despite the fact that they cannot name a single industry that has survived such nonsense. They look under their hotel room beds before they go to sleep to make sure the "management" boogey man isn't going to jump out. But like any discussion, if you find yourself in the cockpit with someone who disagrees with you on a topic, change the topic. I can always find common ground with another pilot, and bitching about my job is not it. They say polite conversation should not involve religion or politics, and union talk is a little of both. Just let people know that you enjoy your job, enjoy your pay, and have certainly had worse of both and change the subject. Plus, I think that the whiners really come out on these boards. Not so many in real life.

It's a good job, with good pay and benefits, and no matter how hard they try the union recruiters can't change my mind.

Thats one of the nicest compliments I've ever gotten. Thanks!

I can say that your sentiments are shared by my close friend at Continental. Even after the pay cuts and traumas, he's still in love with his job. Granted, though, his company is the healthiest of the Legacies. In his opinion, the industry has simply changed as the entire world has changed. He also told me that pilots have a tendency to whine. I suppose it's the old "A complaining (career field) is a happy (career field)". There are definently things that need to be worked out and the career cannot be cheapened too much as has been said. My close friend pointed out to me that the airline industry has always been an unstable one and that the starting positions were never ever highly paid. He doesn't hold any "scope animosity" towards the Continental Express pilots either. My friend never worked at a regional, but he did move to South Dakota and spent a time doing cheap turboprop charter work, before being hired to the the Air Force Reserve, and then going directly to Continental after 2 years of training. I know what you mean about regular work. I'm in college and I HATE doing my calculus homework and sitting through classes on stuff I don't care about. And to top it all off, my parents have to pay them for the privilege. At least at my job I get paid to do less stressful work (except during the holidays).

One of the first things I realized when I became an adult is that money does not equal happiness. Doesn't mean I'm willing to work for peanuts my entire life and it also doesn't mean I wouldn't love to be a millionaire. In a realistic sense I just want a more-than-livable salary with enough left over to own a small airplane. I have no desires at all for a family. I actually can't stand most of my family and don't see what good having one of my own could do. lol ;)

I think you can take the payrates and go about 1000-1200 x that for the year (this will show perdiem, holiday pay, training pay, bonuses, plus maybe a little extra flying here or there). At least that's what my W-2s have shown over the years. Then you can subtract taxes, medical, disability insurance, 401(k), stock purchase to find take-home. That's about 30-35% for me (5% 401(k), 5% stock purchase, family medical and dental, short-term disability).