Tough decision; regional guy just got Air Force offer
06-20-2008, 04:06 PM
#11
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: A-320
Posts: 6,929
Originally Posted by BURflyer
Stay and upgrade. This isn't about getting a job at a major, would you like to make the military a career?
The opportunity of a lifetime..................and your going to blow it to log PIC time in a SAAB one day, c'mon your smarter then that.
06-20-2008, 04:13 PM
#12
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: idle stop release....
Posts: 81
Not like my opinion counts for much but...
Im a pilot at mesaba and i do love it here but ive always said if i was single and i had the choice i would have gone for the military pilot slot. No other flying job in the world can you fly nearly twice the speed of sound, pull ten G's and light up the after burner. Sounds like a dream job to me not to mention the military will always be around needing pilots where as "X" airline not necessarily. I envy your position.
Im a pilot at mesaba and i do love it here but ive always said if i was single and i had the choice i would have gone for the military pilot slot. No other flying job in the world can you fly nearly twice the speed of sound, pull ten G's and light up the after burner. Sounds like a dream job to me not to mention the military will always be around needing pilots where as "X" airline not necessarily. I envy your position.
06-20-2008, 04:23 PM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: FIRE ALPA
Posts: 3,082
Originally Posted by Airsupport
cant you do both and just go on mil leave for say oh... 20 years? come back to mesaba and then you would have 20 years seniority! 
06-20-2008, 04:31 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: E170 FO
Posts: 686
Take military leave. You can take it right up to completion of any Active Duty Service Commitments required for initial training (10 years after UPT in your case). If for some reason things don't work out or you Palace Chase to the ANG/Reserves down the road, your job will still be waiting for you.
Just be aware that UAVs are growing in popularity so you stand a good chance of spending a few years sitting in a box and drinking a cup of coffee. Word from my FAIP buddy is that they forsee UAV drops to UPT in a year or so. If you expect to end up in fighters, remember that its by no means guranteed, especially in today's shifting AF. I'd still rather be flying military transports than airliners though (assuming I didn't have a family or at least one that liked to move every 4 years).
Just be aware that UAVs are growing in popularity so you stand a good chance of spending a few years sitting in a box and drinking a cup of coffee. Word from my FAIP buddy is that they forsee UAV drops to UPT in a year or so. If you expect to end up in fighters, remember that its by no means guranteed, especially in today's shifting AF. I'd still rather be flying military transports than airliners though (assuming I didn't have a family or at least one that liked to move every 4 years).
06-20-2008, 04:39 PM
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: CRJ
Posts: 2,356
Originally Posted by cbire880
Take military leave. You can take it right up to completion of any Active Duty Service Commitments required for initial training (10 years after UPT in your case). If for some reason things don't work out or you Palace Chase to the ANG/Reserves down the road, your job will still be waiting for you.
Just be aware that UAVs are growing in popularity so you stand a good chance of spending a few years sitting in a box and drinking a cup of coffee. Word from my FAIP buddy is that they forsee UAV drops to UPT in a year or so. If you expect to end up in fighters, remember that its by no means guranteed, especially in today's shifting AF. I'd still rather be flying military transports than airliners though (assuming I didn't have a family or at least one that liked to move every 4 years).
Just be aware that UAVs are growing in popularity so you stand a good chance of spending a few years sitting in a box and drinking a cup of coffee. Word from my FAIP buddy is that they forsee UAV drops to UPT in a year or so. If you expect to end up in fighters, remember that its by no means guranteed, especially in today's shifting AF. I'd still rather be flying military transports than airliners though (assuming I didn't have a family or at least one that liked to move every 4 years).
06-20-2008, 04:45 PM
#18
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,293
Originally Posted by Cessnadriver
I got a bit of a decision to make here. I was hired at Mesaba airlines a year ago. Before I had applied at Mesaba, I had been applying for a pilot slot with the AirForce. I got turned down and decided to pursue the airlines. I just got a call today stating that I was just selected for a pilot slot with the Air Force. A while back my recruiter called and asked if I wanted to resubmit my application. I figured why not although I didn’t really think I would get selected.
So now comes the big decision. Because of the recent growth at Mesaba, I’ve accumulated quite a bit of seniority with the airlines. I’m just under half way up the list. I’ve recently put my bid in to upgrade and when I do, I’ll actually be able to bid a 17 day off schedule out of Memphis assuming the schedules stay the same. I’ve been able to nonrev someplace every month since I’ve been there including 8 days in Alaska and going to Hawaii twice so far (got to love being single and in you’re 20’s with travel benefits!). I really enjoy the flying and I like the schedule.
On the other hand, I can fly for the airlines the rest of my life, but I can only join the Air Force when I’m young. Of course, there’s always the possibility of having difficulty in UPT, washing out and having to start at the bottom with the airlines. On the other hand, the Airlines are pretty volatile as well.
So, what would you do in my situation. I’d especially like to hear from the guys who have done both military and airlines.
So now comes the big decision. Because of the recent growth at Mesaba, I’ve accumulated quite a bit of seniority with the airlines. I’m just under half way up the list. I’ve recently put my bid in to upgrade and when I do, I’ll actually be able to bid a 17 day off schedule out of Memphis assuming the schedules stay the same. I’ve been able to nonrev someplace every month since I’ve been there including 8 days in Alaska and going to Hawaii twice so far (got to love being single and in you’re 20’s with travel benefits!). I really enjoy the flying and I like the schedule.
On the other hand, I can fly for the airlines the rest of my life, but I can only join the Air Force when I’m young. Of course, there’s always the possibility of having difficulty in UPT, washing out and having to start at the bottom with the airlines. On the other hand, the Airlines are pretty volatile as well.
So, what would you do in my situation. I’d especially like to hear from the guys who have done both military and airlines.
Listen carefully, I am assuming that you are talking about regular active-duty, not ANG or AF reserve...
You are job (and seniority!) protected for Five (5) years of voluntary reserve and/or active-duty service. If you can utilize this protection, you could return to the airline with massive seniority, as though you never left.
Here's the problem...five years would cover the obligated service terms for most military jobs, but not for pilots and a few others (special ops, divers).
There are a couple of possible ways around this, but you would have to do some research.
1) Palace Chase. This is a program where active duty AF pilots can get an "early-out" on the condition that join an operational reserve (or possibly ANG) squadron for a number of years. Do some research, if palace chase can get you off AD in five years or less you can return to the airline and participate in reserves on the side.
2) There are many exemptions to the five year rule...ie circumstances which DO NOT count against your five year clock.
- One of these IIRC is active duty for "initial training"...counting OCS, UPT, and follow-on aircraft training this could be several years which does not count against you. This may actually extend all the way through your initial obligation, but you REALLY want to verify that yourself (and not on the internet either).
- Deployment under wartime circumstances...this does not count for ANG/reserves, not sure about AD.
You would have to do some research to find out EXACTLY what counts and what does not. DO NOT trust a recruiter...they don't know these rules and will lie anyway. The federal ESGR would be the people to ask.
In any event, if you decide to go military...DO NOT RESIGN from the airline! That way you have at least five years to come back under any circumstances...UPT washout, palace chase, or unforseen future circumstances. Notify the company in writing that you intend to take military leave for an undetermined amount of time. Give plenty of notice, and I'd do it certified mail for that long of an absence.
06-20-2008, 05:02 PM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: E170 FO
Posts: 686
Originally Posted by rickair7777
Listen carefully, I am assuming that you are talking about regular active-duty, not ANG or AF reserve...
You are job (and seniority!) protected for Five (5) years of voluntary reserve and/or active-duty service. If you can utilize this protection, you could return to the airline with massive seniority, as though you never left.
Here's the problem...five years would cover the obligated service terms for most military jobs, but not for pilots and a few others (special ops, divers).
There are a couple of possible ways around this, but you would have to do some research.
1) Palace Chase. This is a program where active duty AF pilots can get an "early-out" on the condition that join an operational reserve (or possibly ANG) squadron for a number of years. Do some research, if palace chase can get you off AD in five years or less you can return to the airline and participate in reserves on the side.
2) There are many exemptions to the five year rule...ie circumstances which DO NOT count against your five year clock.
- One of these IIRC is active duty for "initial training"...counting OCS, UPT, and follow-on aircraft training this could be several years which does not count against you. This may actually extend all the way through your initial obligation, but you REALLY want to verify that yourself (and not on the internet either).
- Deployment under wartime circumstances...this does not count for ANG/reserves, not sure about AD.
You would have to do some research to find out EXACTLY what counts and what does not. DO NOT trust a recruiter...they don't know these rules and will lie anyway. The federal ESGR would be the people to ask.
In any event, if you decide to go military...DO NOT RESIGN from the airline! That way you have at least five years to come back under any circumstances...UPT washout, palace chase, or unforseen future circumstances. Notify the company in writing that you intend to take military leave for an undetermined amount of time. Give plenty of notice, and I'd do it certified mail for that long of an absence.
You are job (and seniority!) protected for Five (5) years of voluntary reserve and/or active-duty service. If you can utilize this protection, you could return to the airline with massive seniority, as though you never left.
Here's the problem...five years would cover the obligated service terms for most military jobs, but not for pilots and a few others (special ops, divers).
There are a couple of possible ways around this, but you would have to do some research.
1) Palace Chase. This is a program where active duty AF pilots can get an "early-out" on the condition that join an operational reserve (or possibly ANG) squadron for a number of years. Do some research, if palace chase can get you off AD in five years or less you can return to the airline and participate in reserves on the side.
2) There are many exemptions to the five year rule...ie circumstances which DO NOT count against your five year clock.
- One of these IIRC is active duty for "initial training"...counting OCS, UPT, and follow-on aircraft training this could be several years which does not count against you. This may actually extend all the way through your initial obligation, but you REALLY want to verify that yourself (and not on the internet either).
- Deployment under wartime circumstances...this does not count for ANG/reserves, not sure about AD.
You would have to do some research to find out EXACTLY what counts and what does not. DO NOT trust a recruiter...they don't know these rules and will lie anyway. The federal ESGR would be the people to ask.
In any event, if you decide to go military...DO NOT RESIGN from the airline! That way you have at least five years to come back under any circumstances...UPT washout, palace chase, or unforseen future circumstances. Notify the company in writing that you intend to take military leave for an undetermined amount of time. Give plenty of notice, and I'd do it certified mail for that long of an absence.
Also, your USERRA rights cannot be exercised until you RETURN from duty. Therefore, the company can say all they want now, but if they don't give you your job back once your initial commitment is up, then they are in hot water. Do not resign and you can't waive your USERRA rights until you are discharged from the service.
I went through this with Boeing when I was going to be a navigator (family got in the way and change priorities), but needless to say I had an 8+ year job protection. Also, don't let them try to tell you it doesn't apply to Active Duty. The law makes no distinction.
If you have any questions don't hesitate to contact the DOL VETS program or USGR. They are both very helpful. I'm sure some of the guys in the military forum or baseops.net can point you in the right direction as well.
Edit: Doh, should've read the whole post first. Point being, even if they try to deny you now, it won't matter until you try to return from service. Its a very useful protection should you become injured or wash out for whatever reason.
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