Eagle Displacement - Round 3
 

Latest vacancy and displacement bid...

VACANCY AND DISPLACEMENT BID IS OPEN EFF <19DEC08
*VACANCIES* *ENTER TRAINING NO LATER THAN*
<13 JFK CA EMJ <31 AUG 09
<17 JFK FO EMJ <31 AUG 09
<04 LGA CA EMJ <31 AUG 09
<12 LGA FO EMJ <31 AUG 09
<03 MIA CA ATR <31 AUG 09
<03 SJU CA ATR <31 AUG 09

*DISPLACEMENTS* *ENTER TRAINING NO LATER THAN*
<08 DFW CA EMJ <31 AUG 09
<44 DFW FO EMJ <31 AUG 09

THIS BID WILL CLOSE AT 2300CT ON 04JAN09 AND IS SCHEDULED TO BE RUN ON 05JAN09. A PRELIMINARY AWARD MAY FOLLOW. PILOTS ENTERING TRAINING WITHIN 14 DAYS OF THE ACTUAL RUN DATE WILL BE SUBJECT TO A TRAINING FREEZE AND WILL NOT BE AWARDED A VACANCY PER CBA SECTION 15.I.2 AND 3. THE FINAL AWARD WILL BE POSTED ON 11JAN09.

******CHECK YOUR STANDING BID LISTS (3*) FOR ACCURACY.******
REPORT ANY PROBLEMS TO YOUR CHIEF PILOT. ALL BIDS ARE YOUR RESPONSIBILITY AND FINAL ON THE BID CLOSING DATE. AWARDED PILOTS SHOULD REFER TO THE CURRENT FLOW PLAN FOR PLANNED TRAINING AND TRANSFER INFORMATION. THE FLOW PLAN IS A CREW RESOURCES DOCUMENT DISTRIBUTED TO DOMICILE CHIEF PILOTS, THE TRAINING DEPARTMENT, AND POSTED ON JETNET. IT IS UPDATED CONTINUALLY. IT DOES NOT CONSTITUTE OFFICIAL NOTIFICATION OF TRAINING

Eagle was a great place at one time. It's even better when you leave.

This New York push is amazing. They couldn't have come up with a better way to upset everyone without pay cuts. Well, it pretty much is a pay cut because of the non-adjust for cost of living from one base to another.

Good luck to all involved.

Total of 15 UGs. Better than nothing man.

So what does all that mean exactly. Is that saying that they need FO's within the company to fill those spots or that those are empty spots needing to be filled with new hires. And that they need to be filled by Aug 09, which means absolutely nothing.

It means they are fat on EMB FOs and CAs in DFW and they need more of them in LGA and JFK. I'm betting that there will be around 75 total FO displacements just from DFW as the EMB guys that want to stay will bump junior guys off the ATR to stay in DFW rather than commute. As far as displacements from other bases as a result of it is anybody's guess. The smelly brown stuff rolls downhill, it's not good for any of us that are junior in DFW.

As far as hiring I wouldn't expect it. If hiring does happen in 2009 expect to be sent to the northeast.

well i hope there is some kind of hiring...still crossing my fingers for the spring time.

so the boston base closing is already a set deal?

It is now. ALPA tried to fight it, but couldn't get it done. So its a done deal as of a few days ago.

Don't cross your fingers too hard...it isn't looking good for hiring at the moment. It'll probably take an economic recovery before that happens.

I'm ashamed I don't know the answer to this question, but oh well.

If you are one of the ones to get displaced, can you be awarded only a posted vacancy or will they give you whatever your seniority will hold? Just doing the simple math, the number of respective CA and FO displacements don't add up!
Thanks!

Truer words could not be spoken!

When you are displaced you can go to whatever your seniority can hold. Make sure to update your displacement preferences if you are at all close to the bottom on any equipment.

things are getting uncomfortable everywhere right now. I know its not any consolation but just know that the grass isnt greener anywhere else. No one is moving anywhere.

Ouch. 44 displacements out of a single domicile is huge. How many first officers are in DFW?

347 EMJ FOs in DFW

Dang! Are all of your domiciles this big?

No. ORD and DFW are big... the rest are much smaller.

I think our ExpressJet houston base has around 550 FO's and close to 700 FO's before the furloughs. Those are just the ones bidding and not on leave. Makes it really good for getting any day off you want, even if you are the most junior, since someone should always be looking to switch any day of the month around. Anyone else have any bigger bases, kinda curious.

i'm wondering when the dust will finally settle and the ship will stop rocking...i'm thinking there may be one more vacancy/displacement bid after this one to get everything right....

An examiner in the training center in dallas said that the northeast need for pilots should be temporary stating the reason being that the extra 1900 hrs is going to be seasonal. Any truth to this?

(by "extra 1900", I mean 1900 more than was expected from the hrs AMR was removing)

i hope not...i actually flew this month quite a bit...the loads were always full...then again flying around the northeast with the 135's we're always weight restricted to like 33 people...kinda like flying a saab around but paying for a jet...

i wonder how long this "seasonal" addition will last until? Jan? March? and then will we get more flying come spring and summer???

I think the need for pilots in the northeast(JFK/LGA) will be continuous. Nobody wants to be based in NYC and we had a big demand for LGA pilots even before all this displacement/base closure stuff. This particular flying may be seasonal, but in the long run NYC will be a major base much like ORD/DFW today.

will they let dfw emb guys go to the atr and not be displaced to lga/jfk?

And, what about transfering to say ORD or the CRJ?

If you get displaced you can go anywhere your seniority holds. This means you can go DFW ATR FO, ORD CRJ FO, or anywhere as long as there is someone junior to you there. But... there will come a point where 44 guys have to go to JFK. Enjoy the commute to your $250 crashpad in Jamaica NY! :)

The funny part is that some of the 44 FO's to be displaced from de EMJ come from the CRJ and will probably get ATR. A total of 3 long term training in less than a year. Can any other airline beat that?

i'm moving outta my jfk crashpad for an lga one...PM me if you want details...250 a month however no one is there...you have the second floor of a two family home to yourself...you'd also be right off the cargo road...a 10 minute drive from the airport if you had your car...nothing like sitting ready reserve from the crashpad....

whoa whoa whoa whoa....

might just be all the beer...however...

if i'm LGA EMJ FO with this displacement could i get bumped to SJU ATR FO? or DFW ATR FO?

From what I've gathered, no. the only ones getting displaced are DFE and DCE. plus theyre posting vacancies in your domicile. so if anything, you'd have junior ppl coming on under you. The only way you would go from LGA to the ATR is if you proffered to displace.

lol that's what i figured but just b/c i'm so junior everytime there is a vacancy bid i always get a little nervous b/c anything is possible these days...

That's not the only way. In theory, if all 44 displaced DFE could hold and displaced to LGA FO, there would be a surplus of LGA FO's. These FO's would be displaced to wherever there seniority could hold. If the junior LGA FO is the most junior pilot at Eagle and there is a only a SJU FO slot left, guess where he is headed? Don't forget that a SJU FO upgrading to CA now creates a SJU FO vacancy.

Bottom line is always have your displacement preferences up to date! Merry Christmas from your AMR family!!

No, if you are displaced you can bid to any base, or any equipment your seniority can hold.

You can proffer to displace (basically volunteer to displace) to a base/equipment vacancy... and they do the volunteers first, but you could then end up bumped by a senior person who gets moved through regular displacement.

The number don't have to add up, and in reality, they never should.... re: CA & FO. There are normally more CA's at any base anyway since they have more training cycles, more vacation, and it all needs to be covered with more CA's.

wrong. If enough people senior to him decide they want to displace to LGA and he gets pushed to the bottom of the list in base and they are over the number they need, he could get displaced out.... so, he needs to have his preferences set in his *3. Would I expect it to happen, nope... unless he is number 65 in base out of the 65 FO's currently there....then the risks go up.

Wait, so more pilots can be awarded a vacancy than are posted. I didn't think so. I thought once the 13 or so were filled no one else would be awarded it.

I have been through two long terms in 9 months if I get the ATR it will be my 3rd long term in a year with the company! The Admiral should just give me a mailbox! I hope I hold my seat:(

Likewise. I just don't want to lose my seat in DFW. Commuting is going to suck!

i will be the last pilot on the base list...i'm just hoping that not that many people are dying to come to ny...i do have my 3* set up how i want...hopefully i'll stay put tho...

It means they need 13 more than they currently have.... it does not mean the people already there are safe.... it is not simply a vacancy bid, in which case the 13 most senior people asking for LGA would get it.... it is a displacement/vacancy bid.... if they have 65 now (which they do) and they want to end up with 78.... and 100 people from other bases senior to him list LGA as there displacement preference, then he could be pushed out. Does that explain it any better? The problem here is that on a displacement, you bid and get whatever you have listed in your preferences.... base, equipment and seat. Whatever your personal seniority can hold is what you will get.

This is called "backfilling." If on the vacancy bid there are no openings for OFE, but 10 OFEs chose to preference bid for LGA then that creates 10 OFE openings that could be awarded if you have them in your preferences (or displacements preferences). Sometimes youll notice on vacancy bids they say we wont backfill the first 10 OFE, 20 OCE, etc. In that case it would mean nobody would go to OFE if only 10 OFEs chose to go to LGA. If 11 OFEs went to LGA then 1 person in the company would be awarded an OFE slot. Clear as mud?

lol why didn't i think of that? clear as day!;)

i just don't wanna go to SJU...at least in ny the guy mugging you knows a little english and will understand "please sir i'm a poor regional FO..."

Agreed! I think NYC will be the most junior base for a long time to come, especially considering the cost of living, delays, etc. Sadly, I bet this will be an ugly displacement as well and guys in ORD/DFW will feel some pain.