Post Flight Walk Around
 

I thought I get an opinion from the peanut gallery about a situation I had as a passenger. I won't give out what airline but it was a CRJ. The aircraft arrived about 1 hour prior to the departure and there was a crew swap. It was raining out. The next crew was delayed and arrived at the aircraft about 15 minutes after scheduled departure and found a tire that needed to be replaced. Now my question comes that had the previous crew done post flight walk around wouldn't they have found a tire that was bad enough that it needed to be replaced? I have a few thousand hours in the CRJ and wasn't very happy this was left to the next crew as my experience is that bad tires are obvious. Post flight should be as thorough as pre-flight, aren't we are all on the same team?

The previous crew was probably on the return leg home. :D

At NWA we don't do post flight walk arounds. Perhaps they're not required at that particular regional?

When I flew for Air Wisconsin, nothing ****ed me off more than catching something broken on a preflight that should have been caught by even the most cursory of postflights (burnt out nav lights, broken static wicks, flatspotted tires or tires with cord showing, busted bonding straps, brake wear pins out of limits, etc).

Even in the rain, grab an effing umbrella and run around the plane - the next crew will thank you.

Maybe you dont have the full story. or maybe the second crew was going to an airport where the Captain decided they did not want an OK tire but a new tire. I have seen a tire that was technically OK but another crew member was going to land at an airport with heavy snow forcast... always two sides to a story. Lets not bash the PIC of either flight unless we were there (not in the terminal but in the decision making proccess)

Maybe the tire had a slow leak

What NWA is that? Some other NWA's do.

Fedex pilots don't do post flights, the mechanics do. Usually looking at the plane before we get off it.

Company policy is to do a post flight walk-around after everyflight.

But, out on the line, if a flight is coming in, and the next crew is already down on the ramp, that crew get's the pre-flight, which then covers the current crew's post-flight. At least that's the gentleman's (and gentlewoman's) agreement at my company.

But, who knows about this situation.

Sometimes it just depends on the point of view. A tire may look low to one pilot and fine to another pilot. I could think of a few reasons for that could have caused this situation.

Maybe the Captain needed to take a slow leak and skipped the walk-around.

At what airline do the CA's do the walkarounds???

I dont know about other airlines but the one I'm at the FO does the preflight and the CA does the postflight.

I should have done this as a survey, so far we have (open to interpretation): 2 people thing they did the post flight and something may have changed or different opinions, 4 think they didn't do it or didn't have to, and 2 would like more info. I think this is kind of sad.

For those that want to know, at that company the FO is required to do both walk arounds and the weather was light rain at departure and sun at arrival, no runways under 8k.

With the current opinions, my opinion is, it would be nice if FedEx could use some of that extra capacity for pax ops, at least I know MX delays would be minimized.

The PIC is the one most responsible for all of that. Then most delegate it or the Ops state that the FO may/will conduct the Walkaround if the PIC delegates.

Either way I have seen many CA and FO do the walk around. When I was new I even had a few do it with me to show some areas that pose issues at times that were not covered in the initial training.

There are some great mentors out there. And they still walk around, share their experience, and help transition you to the left seat.

In my (meager) experience of 1 year and 1 month, 500+ hours of flying, I have had a CA do a walkaround once.

Horizon.. At least when i was there

As far as I know,for the time being there is only 1 NWA.

For all you know, the crew did catch it on the post flight, wrote it up, and depending on the regional, going through dispatch, then maint, then the moon, and waiting for Jupitor to align with Venus, They finally got around to fixing it, and by that time the other crew was there so it seemed like they were the ones to catch it.

Most of these companies just are not run very well these days, and even when crews are pro active about things, they call it in to dispatch, and that dispatcher does not even know what aiport there at!!!! Im not trying to monday morning QB here at all.

If the tire had a leak it's possible and very likely that it happened on the landing which could mean it wasn't noticeable on the taxi in or at the gate. That being said at CHQ we do walkarounds between every leg as well as when taking a new aircraft or retiring one for the day. I actually enjoy it since it gives me a moment to stretch my legs after being cramped in that cockpit.

That would be NWA MAINLINE. I've flown the DC9 and the A320, and a post flight is not required on either.

How many NWA's are there? I only know of one.:rolleyes:

At SKW CA's are required to do the preflight and post flight workarounds, although it can be delegated to the FO. Also, post flight workarounds from the income crews are mandatory unless the accepting CA waves it. If no accepting CA then it MUST be completed.

Waterskiers have the Pre/Post flight inspections as listed FO duties. It's the only official duty the FO has that isn't dual responsibility with the CA. On the contrary, if you see a TSA CA walking around, it's possible that he's being nice while the FO grabs food, or the more common one, is the guy walking around has lost his command.

At our regional we can DMI a tire at an outstation for 5 cycles only if the spot it does not cover more then 1/3 the tire

As far as I know this is the regional thread not major.....NWA...Northwest Airlink.....But thanks for playing.

Hahaha....perfection

At SKW; 1st cord = 12 landings until it must be replaced, 2nd cord = 6 landings, 1 cord = No Go.

Usually if I don't have a quick turn, say 40 minutes or more, I just call Mx Control and tell them to have the Mechanic and tire waiting for us. It's better to just get it swapped before it becomes a problem.

Show me the FAR that says a pilot must do a postflight inspections, I believe its only a preflight required. Company Policy may say otherwise, I know at most Majors postflight is a mx action. As far as walk arounds who ever is the non-flying pilot does the walk around and the other sets up the box.

CMR requires a pre- and post-flight inspection to be performed by the FO.

But the manual states a post-flight is not meant to be as in depth as a pre-flight.

None? (Sorry, couldn't resist!:D)

Sorry to break it to you but at your new airline, you will be doing post flights. They are required on all terminating flights at stations with no MX. A terminating flight is one which isn't departing til the next day and you are powering down to a single light. If the aircraft is departing later that day, you follow the 2 hour placard*, and leave exterior inspections for the next crew to deal with.


* 2 hour placard: Pull appropriate color coded CBs, turn off all cockpit lights, and dim all CRTs.

Man I wish this was the case where I work. I've had only 1 Captain set up the box while I was doing a walkaround. Never had a Captain do a walkaround. Saves time and makes sense for it to be done how your airline does it.

We just do the postflight on a terminating flight, not if we're swapping out, that's the next crews preflight.

Not to belabor the point...BUT:

Let's say you have a tail swap, and due to inbound delays, the crew taking your airplane is not there yet. On landing, one of your two nosegear tires went flat. Since you evidently aren't required to do a postflight inspection, you continue about your business and unknowingly leave the airplane sitting with a flat nose tire.

Next crew shows up 30 minutes later, and once the preflight begins the FO immediately notices a flat nose tire. Now, the already delayed flight is delayed even longer as maintenance is called to swap out both nose tires and get the airplane airworthy again.

This additional delay could have been vastly reduced if the flat had been discovered on a postflight inspection, and the crew who brought the airplane in wrote the flat up and called it in to maintenance control for repair. Now, lets replace flat tire with "engine oil leak", "hydraulic leak", "tailstrike", or any other number of problems that a quick runaround would have discovered - see the potential problems such a policy exposes your crew and company to?

When I was at AWAC, the only time I wouldn't postflight (even in the crappiest of weather) was if the crew taking the airplane was RIGHT THERE upon our arrival and I knew the FO would start the walkaround immediately.

Again, not bashing on you...just how the company has set their operation up for operational problems via policy (or lack thereof).

I was just providing some input, chill out dude...

It is essentially always delegated to the FO...FO's don't even bother to ask, they just do it. I don't ever recall seeing a SKW CA doing a walk-around unless it was IOE :rolleyes:

I think they just put that in the manual so they can hold the CA responsible.

The post flight should always be done, and should be just as thorough as the pre-flight, especially at an outstation RON. It's good business sense more than a safety issue. I've had several airplanes grounded on the morning flight cuz the inbound crew didn't notice the bald tire spot, or bent flap that had been nailed by a goose.

I'm plenty chill, thanks.

You may notice that I specifically said I wasn't attacking YOU, but rather questioning the logic of your company's policy. I wouldn't ever attack somebody for following their FOM policies, but I'd happily debate those policies all day long.

And that's all I was doing.

Once upon a time I had a KSHV turn. We were an hour late AND swapping planes with another crew that was already there. Typical bayou thunderstorm when we park. As soon as we open the cabin door, the other FO starts his preflight. We are both 15 minutes late for departure at this time. I go preflight the other aircraft we are swapping into while the FO is still preflighting the a/c I just got off of.

Well next thing I know I'm sitting in the cockpit and an FAA inspector is reading me the riot act about how he watched me not do a postflight on the other aircraft. He didn't like my explanation for the reason for a postflight or why I didn't feel the need to do it hand-in-hand with the accepting fo. My post flight would have been AFTER his preflight! One of those feds that can't think outside the box.

That would depend where they were trained or flew for previously. If they are/were from a regional, once they put on the fourth stripe they probably stopped doing walkarounds unless you asked them to look at something.

At several majors/legacies, and a few that are no longer in business, both pilots took turns walking. Example; If it was your leg to fly, I'd walk and vice versa.

Last I checked, most company manuals were FAA approved as part of your op specs... as such, they would have the same force and effect as a FAR.

That's exactly how its done 99.9% of the time here at JBU. Whoever is flying programs their box while the other guy walks. Postflights are not required as they are a MX function. Both practices are drastically different than my previous regional RJ gig.