Hey rickair. I remember hearing about ATA going under, but I don't really know any details beyond that. Do you have a good idea of what happened? I heard some people lost LOTS of money!
Thanks

Yeah, the family that ran that place (COMAIR and Delta pilots BTW) was trying to set-up their own commuter airline on the side with Brasilias. The rumor was that they were taking full deposits from new students at the flight school, and dumping all the money into the airline (I have no doubt of this based on my personal experiences with those clowns).

When 9/11 hit things went downhill real fast...but naturally they continued to accept new students and take their money too. One day the students came in and the doors were chained shut...they went BK and got sued by everybody, and I think there was law enforcement involvement too. I hope the entire Williams family ended up in jail.

I know a guy who was finnishing up his CFI at ATA when all this was happening. Yeah there was law enforcement in the mix beacuse using the studnets money to fund the airline or start up (w/e you want to call it) and that is fraud.

And as for a year and a few months ago the FBI was unable to locate them.

What about places like Mesa Pilot Development Program? Is it a legitimate
alternative to the CFI route?

I cannot tell you as much about Mesa Pilot Development as I can about other academies, but I just want to throw out two ideas to consider before you consider Mesa's program:

1. Have you ever been to Farmington, New Mexico? Well if you haven't, then I would recommend keeping it that way. Do you want to spend 2 years of your life there???

2. Do you have a college degree?
If yes, Mesa is a bad idea. It takes longer than most the other pay for training paths (2 years) because you receive a 2 year degree from San Juan College.

If no, then go get a real 4 year degree. First off, many major airlines require a 4 year degree. Second, you should have a backup career incase you get furloughed from an airline job (and it may happen). Having a 4 year degree is the highest recommendation I can give.

There is a really good thread about this called Information on MPD. It is at the bottom of page 2 (or check the top of page 3) of the regional forum. Read that!

All the other things aside (high cost, flying for mesa, Farmington, NM), the fact that their program is linked to a 2 year AA degree is the worst part of this program. I would not recommend this.

Not to single you out but I hear this a lot. Ya know it has validity to it but. It doesnt matter what you have your degree in if you dont have experience where do you plan on getting hired. Maybe Ive been looking at this the wrong way but All I picture when people say this is 8 years out of college yo get furloghed and say to hell with this. ANd then, you take your engineering degree to boeing and they instantly hire you up. All jobs are like the avaition industry. Without experience you dont get the job. Unless that is you can take your bussiness degree and go manage high schoolers at the local movie theater.

Well I disagree with the experience thing with respect to engineering because ALL my friends who graduated with an aerospace degree, who want a job in that industry, currently have one. Sure, some of us did some internships, but some people I know had no experience. To use your example, I have a friend Katherine working on the dreamliner at Boeing, and she probably makes more than I do!

But, there is really no reference to that in my above post. All I said (what you quoted) was that you absolutely should get a 4 year degree.
Two reasons:
1. You NEED one to get hired by a good major airline. PERIOD!
2. You better have a backup if you are going into a volatile industry like aviation.

Other reasons include...oh, I don't know...
It will be the best time of your life
Looks better than HS degree on ANY resume
You will learn more there than you ever will anywhere else

There are some other good ones, but I think you get my point.
If you are young, and you want to fly for a living (and make decent money), you should get a 4 year college degree.

But those people who got hired right out of college have new degrees, and have up-to-date training in that field. They are fresh out of college, the information is fresh and its all industry standard. If you have an engineering degree and try to use it 8 years down the line, it won't get you anywhere because you will have the expeirence in the field of someone right out of college, but you will not be up-to-date education. Your trying to get a job with no expierence and out-dated training, further you will not be as effecient as someone out of college or who has been in the industry because you have not touched the stuff since graduation.

I dont think he was arguing that you shouldn't get a degree, he was just saying that having a degree in a different field is not a valid backup unless you switch within 2-3 years, after that what your degree says is worthless because you haven't used it and you are no longer current with the industry. All it is, is a 4 year degree.

Yes thats exactly it thank you.

There could be some exceptions to that, such as if your degree is non-aviation, but closely involved with aviation. The perfect example is a meteorology degree, which I'm currently working on at Rutgers. Weather is a major part of flying, from sport pilot on up. In alot of ways, I use the stuff I learned in my meteo classes when I'm doing my weather planning. In general, a pilot with a meteorology degree is a great thing, as is a meteorologist who happens to have a pilots license. So if one gets furloughed they could take their meteorology degree and their years of real world piloting experience, and go into aviation meteorology, at a company like Meteorlogix, AccuWeather, etc. In general though, there are very very few degree fields that allow for that, and meteorology is a very difficult, math-intense major.