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-   -   Uh Oh. Mesa just cancelled the note agrmnt (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/36741-uh-oh-mesa-just-cancelled-note-agrmnt.html)

flycrj200 02-10-2009 06:16 AM

Mesa could have rescinded the agreement with the bond holders because they are planning to file for BK and need the cash to do so.

TheDashRocks 02-10-2009 07:55 AM


Originally Posted by iPilot (Post 555439)
2/3 of the pilot group got in knowing exactly what a scummy operation it was and undercut the rest of us for a quick upgrade. The other 1/3, the old timers from pre JO days, had plenty of opportunity to get out into another decent job at a major, charter, or just about anything else and probably still have it better off than they have it now. Sure there may be a handfull that truly will get screwed in this deal but the vast majority really have no reason for us to pity them.

This flawed and oversimplified logic is used by some on this forum to justify rooting for the loss of 1500 pilot jobs. The nerve of those MAG prostitutes trying to move their careers along by earning an ATP and gaining PIC experience. Why can't everyone take advantage of American Eagle's decade-long, right seat seasoning process?

The Union pilots of Mesa Air Group fought a successful battle to convert a non-union alter ego into a union operation. Doing so required a long term strategic vision and the willingness to eat some crappy contract provisions. This move benefited the union pilots as a whole. However in return, the uninformed refer to this pilot group as "bottom-feeders".

In a time of economic downturn, the Mesa MEC successfully won an improved contract, which will be up for negotiation in two years.

Many of us, within and without Mesa, feel deep sympathy for the Aloha folks who have lost their jobs. Many of us feel the same sympathy for the Midwest Airlines pilots on furlough while their routes are flown by E170's crewed by much lower paid pilots. I have not seen the same level of angst and anger directed at RAH pilots as has been directed at MAG pilots.

There are market forces at work much larger than one pilot group. Mesaba flying in SLC? Are they taking Skywest flying? Flying shifts all the time, yet when Mesa shows up somewhere, the shrieking starts.

laserman2431 02-10-2009 08:24 AM


Originally Posted by TheDashRocks (Post 555798)
This flawed and oversimplified logic is used by some on this forum to justify rooting for the loss of 1500 pilot jobs. The nerve of those MAG prostitutes trying to move their careers along by earning an ATP and gaining PIC experience. Why can't everyone take advantage of American Eagle's decade-long, right seat seasoning process?

The Union pilots of Mesa Air Group fought a successful battle to convert a non-union alter ego into a union operation. Doing so required a long term strategic vision and the willingness to eat some crappy contract provisions. This move benefited the union pilots as a whole. However in return, the uninformed refer to this pilot group as "bottom-feeders".

In a time of economic downturn, the Mesa MEC successfully won an improved contract, which will be up for negotiation in two years.

Many of us, within and without Mesa, feel deep sympathy for the Aloha folks who have lost their jobs. Many of us feel the same sympathy for the Midwest Airlines pilots on furlough while their routes are flown by E170's crewed by much lower paid pilots. I have not seen the same level of angst and anger directed at RAH pilots as has been directed at MAG pilots.

There are market forces at work much larger than one pilot group. Mesaba flying in SLC? Are they taking Skywest flying? Flying shifts all the time, yet when Mesa shows up somewhere, the shrieking starts.

DashRocks,

I don't have any bad feelings against any Mesa pilot. If Mesa dies, and I hope they do, I will not feel sympathy for the pilots who will lose their jobs any more than I would feel sympathy for the gambler who loses his stake.

When you went to Mesa, you accepted an opportunity and a risk. Many who went before you reaped a great benefit by getting some jet PIC and moving on to great jobs such as Southwest. I say "good for them." Those pilots rolled the dice and won. If Mesa takes a giant dump, and I hope they will, some other gamblers will lose. If you didn't want to deal with risk, what were you doing at Mesa?

I've been there myself. I've gambled and lost. I never asked for any sympathy. I'm a big boy and I made my own decisions. I have no choice but to live with the results.

I hope it will work out well for you and all your brothers and sisters. I always wish the gambler good luck. Best of luck to you!

TheBills 02-10-2009 08:32 AM


Originally Posted by laserman2431 (Post 555814)
DashRocks,

I don't have any bad feelings against any Mesa pilot. If Mesa dies, and I hope they do, I will not feel sympathy for the pilots who will lose their jobs any more than I would feel sympathy for the gambler who loses his stake.

When you went to Mesa, you accepted an opportunity and a risk. Many who went before you reaped a great benefit by getting some jet PIC and moving on to great jobs such as Southwest. I say "good for them." Those pilots rolled the dice and won. If Mesa takes a giant dump, and I hope they will, some other gamblers will lose. If you didn't want to deal with risk, what were you doing at Mesa?

I've been there myself. I've gambled and lost. I never asked for any sympathy. I'm a big boy and I made my own decisions. I have no choice but to live with the results.

I hope it will work out well for you and all your brothers and sisters. I always wish the gambler good luck. Best of luck to you!

Well said, speaking as a former mesa piece of trash. There was a reason Mesa lost 700 pilots in a year to other regionals.

laserman2431 02-10-2009 08:43 AM

Strange that the Mesa stock price has increased since yesterday.

iPilot 02-10-2009 08:48 AM

The price almost certainly already factors in the fact that they have an almost insurmountable amount of debt and obligations going into the future. 10 cents per share is where most companies would be already bankrupt. Most are either gambling with it hoping for a cent or two increase for big-big gains or hedge funds hoping for a restructuring and eventual turnaround.

kersplatt 02-10-2009 08:53 AM

It is a gamble no matter where you go.

TonyWilliams 02-10-2009 09:04 AM


Originally Posted by TheDashRocks (Post 555798)
There are market forces at work much larger than one pilot group. Mesaba flying in SLC? Are they taking Skywest flying?


SkyWest Airlines is moving CRJ-900's to ATL to back fill for ASA's pending new CRJ-900's and FAA approval to operate them.

So, Mesaba is filling the void in SLC with their planes.

Why, you might ask, didn't SKW, Inc, just put the new -900's in ATL with SkyWest pilots? Because the deal involves parking twice as many -200's, and SkyWest is grossly overstaffed now.

To answer your question, no, Mesaba isn't "taking" SkyWest flying.

TheDashRocks 02-10-2009 09:07 AM


Originally Posted by laserman2431 (Post 555814)
DashRocks,

I don't have any bad feelings against any Mesa pilot. If Mesa dies, and I hope they do, I will not feel sympathy for the pilots who will lose their jobs any more than I would feel sympathy for the gambler who loses his stake.

...If you didn't want to deal with risk, what were you doing at Mesa?

I am okay with the risks. I came here to fly the Dash-8. I felt the bases would be a reasonable commute to my home. I knew the pilot group was negotiating a new contract which I hoped would improve things. I hoped for a quick upgrade opportunity. So far, my "gamble" has paid off. If we fold, I will survive. I will feel sympathy for fellow MAG employees who lose their jobs.

I hope it will work out well for you and all your brothers and sisters. I always wish the gambler good luck. Best of luck to you!

I do not see the harm in extending sympathy to others. If I understand your logic, life is a gamble and no one deserves sympathy.

Thank you for your good wishes.

CAPTAIN INSANO 02-10-2009 09:32 AM

Wow.........


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