I find it really hard to believe that AIRLINE PILOTS actually try to justify being unprofessional! There is no excuse for acting like a child in view of the public, whether you're flying or working at Wal-Mart. As a customer (and as a pilot who is sitting on the sidelines right now) I can only say that such behavior would make me question the dedication of those crews. If you can't deal with the hardships that you afforded yourself by taking the job, then with all due respect - get out!

Lets talk professionalism.

Let's talk about professional standards, and lets talk about open dialogue. Lets talk about walking over to the gate and grabbing a tail number, and a time. Let's talk about gathering information, and conveying it. Once that's done, let's talk to the crew and make sure that we uphold our jobs high.

Nah, lets just get on a public forum and bash some RJ drivers. Pot meet kettle pal......

Well I'm glad I read all nine pages of this thread because you beat me to comment... I think commenting on a public forum instead of talking with your fellow comrads is the unproffesional act in this case... but then again I guess if pilots were paid more we would have thought of this first:rolleyes:

You sound like management or the FAA.

I dunno... the best thing you can do for your fellow aviators who may not be projecting an air of professionalism in their day job (think, saying "gigity" on the PA during announcements), is to either talk to them or ProStan. Pro Stan isn't there to get you in trouble (the first time around at least).... they are there to be a "third party" voice that says, "hey you might want to be careful about saying this or doing that lest someone with the power to fire you sees or hears the action."

Nope, just a fairly junior line guy. I get tired of the mainline guys looking down their noses at all of us. Were else are we supposed to start off....and where else are we supposed to learn the trade? Gone are the days of finding your way through the military...and we all know that the days are long gone of direct hiring into the majors.

Granted, newspaper....or (my guess) charts are way out of line.......there is a way to deal with it.....and this place isn't it.

Excellent post!!! But what is the attitude of people that work for 16K.

AA:cool:

I didn't get past this post, so someone may have already responded and said this stuff. If you DON'T give 100%, why should the company pay you more? You signed on for your job knowing what you were required to do and, since RAH hasn't taken a pay cut, you knew how much they were going to pay you to do said job. Therefore, taking a little pride in your work should be toward the top of your priority list, and that would involve giving 100%, or close to it at least. But you said you understand both sides of this double-edged sword, so you shouldn't have to have that explained to you.

I think part of the reason that a higher percentage of mainline pilots than regional pilots act professional is because they're held accountable by each other. The senior guys don't put up with a bunch of bull*******, and the new junior guys know that, so they straighten up their act in a hurry. You can still have a blast at this job and act professional. It is entirely possible.

On a different note though, I too wish some of these guys would remember that they weren't born holding their ATP, 777 type, and 20,000 hours...

Just reading backwards through these posts, and I hope nobody has ever said "giggady" on their PA announcements...

Ok. So are you saying it's ok to read the paper in cruise? Just as long as the pax don't know about it? So if we keep it a secret from them and they think were not reading the paper, then we're then deemed professional? So, as an MD-11 FO, were you jumpseating on this flight at gate B20 in ATL? Because I don't think DAL or anyone that could nonrev on this flight flies MD11's. Maybe the professional thing you could have done was told the crew they forgot their newspaper in the on the dash, and not called out an entire pilot group on a public board. That, my fellow pilot, was unprofessional.

Perhaps they watched "Soul Plane" one too many times ?


Fred

I find it funny all the people who say "pay us like professionals and we will act like proffesionals". What a cop out. It's an excuse to act like an idiot. How about "act like a proffesional and maybe you will be paid like a proffesional". It goes both ways people.

Only when announcing that we'll be pushing a headwind.

The 400 ft call out is "Autopilot ON" and "Cut the deck" ;)



So you want to complain to your passengers about your pay by looking like a slob (maybe not you but others have mentioned this)? Is the passenger going to write you a check for the what the airfare should have been so you could get paid more?

No. Keep the dispute between you and management. To your passengers, you are the person who is going to keep them safe or fly their unaccompanied sons/daughters to their destinations safely. They deserve the reassurance. Give management hell and make them sweat, but not your pax.

If there is a reason the American public is ignorant about the plight of the regional airline pilots, blame ALPA's PR department.


Poprocket, RatherBeFishing, FlyJSH -- Bravo!


Regardless of your opinion of the first thread, the last 10 pages of post (particularly the childish ones) seem to indicate that a discussion on professionalism was really needed.

So, for all of you Captains, if on Day 1 of 4, your FO showed up with a wrinkled shirt and pants, would you say something to this person about it? Or would you say something about their technique of telling ATC "SEE YAAAA" in that deep voice -- honestly, I have no idea how to discribe the voice except that it's load, deep, and the syllables are all slurred together.

I was thinking the same thing! Funny stuff!

I can't speak for everyone, but MY attitude is always positive. I knew what I was getting into when I accepted the job.

ALPA's what?! ;)

On a bright note... there was some hope for the pilot career a while back - majors offered money, work rules, retirement, etc.

Nowadays... you have to ask yourself - why spend so much money to become a pilot only to make poverty level wages and almost never be able to repay your loan?

This whole media frenzy about regional airline pilots should be exploited BY INDIVIDUAL regional pilots (since ALPA is impotent and incompetent) to not just educate the public about the plight, but educate prospective future students who just don't know what they're getting into, while this is in the spotlight.

As long as there's a perception of a big payoff later on, you'll have people lining up for the job. No payoff at the end... might as well point them elsewhere to make more money and buy a CE-210 or something to buzz around on weekends for fun.

I'll say it again since you obviously weren't paying attention the first time:

1) I was eating alone and not going to leave my food/bags unattended (remember that rule, or were you asleep in indoc that day).

2) I deliberately chose not to post identifying information for reasons already explained. Re-read the thread.

3) I was not a chart. Also already covered.

I have nothing against the regionals (nor am I a mainline pilot, not that that would change the truth), I have a number of friends who work for the regionals. Yes, everyone has to start somewhere. They should probably be learning to act in a professional manner while they are starting - if now when will they learn it? You chose to enter a career field where professionalism is expected - if you can't handle that then maybe this isn't the career for you.

"Either do or don't do . . . there is no try!"

No, I was not jumpseating. Re-read the post. I WAS EATING!!! I've covered this more than once now - how many times do I have to repeat it. By all means, make me this issue and not the actions of this crew.

You are also trying to change the topic by getting into reading the paper in cruise - I'm not talking about that (though I personally don't do it). Try and stay on topic.

The Moose just shakes his head in dis-belief.

Posting on this board is like that 2nd grade game where you sit in a circle with 10 other people, and whisper "I believe in aliens" to the guy next to you, and by the time it gets back to you it has become "he voted for Obama."

lmao that's so true. We played this game in our ground school. It was ridiculously hilarious what people would come up with, lol.

Good Read
 

Perhaps a minute of everyone's time to read "The importance of pilot unity" on the this section of APF would be time well spent.

If that approach was adopted by all of us, a lot of the issues in this particular thread would become non-existent.

Just my two cents...devalued to $ .00012984 on Friday's close.

G'Luck Mates:)

I know a certain Cpt .that's been known to keep a dancing hula girl doll in the cockpit .:D


Ally

That would be me, only the grass skirt comes off once airborne! It's an illness I know ; )

Based on what I keep reading on this board and hearing out in the field, I'm beginning to believe this so called "unity" in our profession.., is an urban legend. I'm really looking to find specific "meaningful" examples of "unity" in our industry, maybe I'm not looking in the right places. For now I've accepted the fact that my unity rests with my family, and the folks I personally fly with.

Wow!?, just lost all my respect for the Duck. Bad logic and poor professionalism.:confused:

I don't think thats even possible anymore. I do think that when you purchase a ticket you should be given the aircraft name instead of a strange code like 73G or CR9. A little truth in advertising.. Its should simply say "Delta Airlines Boeing 737-700" or "operated by Mesa Airlines Canadair 900". The affiliate airline should have a hyperlink to the corporate website.

I used Delta as an example...I don't mean anything by it.

Professionalism is a measure of self respect.

Pay is what you consider your skill set to be worth.

On a related topic, am I the only one who thinks it's completely unprofessional to have newspapers/magazines sitting below the center console in public view? So many pilots have zero awareness of public perception.

Funny thing is, as much as most of us complain about Travelocity, it DOES say who is the actual operator.

Professionalism
 

Fellow Aviators,

The level of professionalism at any organization is a direct reflection of management's level of oversight. Management controls the hiring process and sets professional standards. The problem of lack of professionalism would disappear if management managed. If management demanded professionalism then a culture of professionalism would evolve.

For those of you with a work ethic and a professional attitude don’t worry. While your professionalism may not be noticed by your management, it is being noticed by your peers. If you are accustomed to behaving professionally at all times regardless of hardship then you will always behave professionally by habit and without forethought.

It may be sometimes intangible but your professionalism is rewarded every day. It is rewarded by how smoothly your day goes. It is rewarded when your professionalism causes errors to be avoided. It is rewarded by your good relationships with other professionals who respect and admire you and help you manage your trouble free day. It is rewarded by those around you raising their level of professionalism to meet yours and assisting in making good things happen. Professionalism and unprofessionalism are contagious. Don’t let unprofessionalism infect you.

"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair – Oil Well Firefighter, American Hero

Take Care,

Winglet

Excellent Post!

I'd like to add to this discussion by sharing a thought. I am not a 121 guy, so take it for what it's worth. Originally this was in reference to another subject but I feel it applies to professionalism as well. It came from a highly experienced, wise aviator.

"I am of the opinion that pilots are not allowed to rationalize, not if they want to live. They have to analyze, accept and move on one notch smarter. In order to be able to do that, we have to accept in all honesty and clarity exactly the nature and severity of the mistakes we made. In being honest with yourself, you will find strength and value. When we start to rationalize and delude ourselves we set ourselves up for future failure and the cycle of low self worth and the developed self pity continues and you spend a lot of money and still don't find what you came to aviation seeking."

... I see a connection. Do with it what you wish.

I guess Fred is not the only one lol!!!!!!!!:)


Ally

I'm sure those were enroute charts you were seeing. Because the GOM specifically forbids non-essential reading in the cockpit. By the way, Jepp has recently changed their update scheme. Now, there are daily updates. I'm sure you only saw the "JEPs Today" on the glare shield :D

whaaah. "problay 90 something degrees in there"

boo hoo.

A quick childhood quote from my Great Grandma...

"Whether the job is large or small- Do it well, or not at all."