Ahh!! Thanks for the clarification. I agree with what you are saying then. Poor piloting skills, maybe not technique. I don't think the technique is flawed.

I will say that I am in no way attacking the group as a whole. I am positive that you have a professional pilot group with the same set of skills as everyone else. There are always those that don't belong in the cockpit and make it through the cracks.

I could throw a story out where a certain pilot at a un-named company grabbed the controls and tried to move them cause she thought the bank angle was to high. They didn't move when she tried. She screamed "roll control jam" and pulled the disconnect handle, then when she couldn't get the control column to move for pitch she screamed "elevator control jam" and pulled the disconnect handle. Turns out the auto pilot was still on and she didn't use enough force to disconnect it. That was her second major incident so she got canned. Now she works for, YEP YOU GUESSED IT, The FAA.

What FSDO?

Unbelievable...:eek:

Remember way back when we were pre solo pilots and our instructor screamed, "Keep your hand on the throttle!."

Maybe he had something there.

Many of the folks I fly with keep a hand on the power levers when power is at a non-standard setting.... just so we remember to scan that air-speed-o-meter a little more frequently.

Just to correct the record, JS was a SAAB Capt. at CHQ. She failed the ERJ transition twice, resigned and went onto Colgan as a BE1900 F/O then progessed thru to the "Q". I don't know about her failing 4 Q PCs, but she did bust the initial type ride for being out of standards for the 0-flap landing. She is actually a very nice person, but a lot more nervous than I expected for someone with her experience level even back in 04' when I was a new-hire 1900 F/O tdy to AOO and flew with her.
The hearings were an embarassment for managment across the board with a few exceptions, and it was painful to hear the reaction by some of the 3407 victim's family members to MF testimony in particular. I wouldn't be to pleased with the lawyers that prepared them for the hearing, because they had a list of the points to be covered in the hearing. MF appeared to take the questions addressed to her as a personal affront, and that is a huge problem for someone in a VP slot.
Colgan Air does have some really, really good pilots too. I might sound prejudice, but the guys that flew the 1900 are darn good pilots almost to a man (and woman). Flown with some darn good SAAB drivers too, but you're going to have a few bad apples in every organization, people that slip thru the cracks and get carried by the company. Ultimately, this could cause our undoing if it isn't addressed and addressed very soon.
We must work extra hard to restore the faith and trust of the flying public, our industry partners and fellow pilots. This will prove difficult over the coming months with our pilots also going thru negotiations for our first contract. Our managment team MUST view a unionized pilot group as an asset and work in a partnership to solve the company's systemic problems, re-build trust and develop a corporate culture that puts safety, well-being of the flying public and employees first above all other corporate goals. This CANNOT be lip service, it must be a sincere goal of both parties. I am willing to maintain an open mind for the time-being, however, if past history were used to predict events. I'd not hold out much hope for anything, but a "war" between management and the pilots.

Why don't these captains that fly with these so called "terrible pilots" with numerous issues become another line of defense for safety and report it to the chief or the higher ups? That got rid of a couple "poorly" skilled FOs at eagle.(but then again they were still on probation)

You are making the assumption that the "terrible pilots" are all FO's, and not CA's.

Colgan has made some much needed changes in how we treat "special" pilots. The have started a pilot monitoring program which basically is intended to weed out those who are having training issues after they are one the line, PC's for example. We had a FO bust her PC ORAL and she is still not back on line and it has been a while, she is showing out on "leave" currently. It is much more difficult to get back on line if you bust a ride.

I have seen more pilots fired in the last few months that ever at Colgan and it is great to see because they are starting to clean house of all the morons (JW and JS).

They also fired someone recently because he thought it would be funny to play with his gun in ops at an outstation...fired. There was also someone who decided to walk off the job at an outstation because he was upset at the FA. He (A Captain of all thing) pulled off his badge and walked off the plane, the FO had to talk him back to fly the flight back to IAH, he is still on "leave."

There has also been a lot of calling out of check airman by check airman. We have a check pilot in IAH who is calling out his fellow check pilots and telling them to all start walking the walk, not only flying 100% by the book but shirt pressed, top button done, tie straight...100% by the book all the time. And to his credit he is always 100% by the book and a great guy to fly with, one of the best CA's I have ever flown with.

Bottom line is Colgan is starting to clean house and it is long overdue. And now that we have a prostans dept up and running it will help pilots (especially FO's) deal with other pilots who are not following the books without having to throw them under the Chief's buss

yeah, you're right, There are terrible CAs, FOs and FAs. I was responding to his post where he mentioned FOs and compared it with a situation at eagle, that's all! No disrespect intended to the colgan crews

I may have mistyped what I was trying to get at. The issues so far have been with captains and not the FOs. All of the issues that I have heard of involving stick shakers and other issues have been the captains at the controls. I am positive there are FO issues but I just have not heard them through the grapevine as I have the captain issues.