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Old 06-12-2009, 08:27 AM
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Default Politician says stop the race to the bottom

Lawmakers to Draft Bill on Commuter-Airline Safety

By JOSH MITCHELL

WASHINGTON -- House lawmakers said Thursday they planned to draft legislation designed to improve commuter-airline safety, responding to the Feb. 12 crash near Buffalo, N.Y., that killed 50 people.


The legislation will address various issues that have arisen in the investigation into the commuter-airline crash, including low pay for pilots, pilot fatigue, minimum training standards and aircraft inspections, said Rep. Jerry F. Costello (D., Ill.), chairman of the aviation subcommittee of the House Transportation Committee.


Mr. Costello opened a hearing on the crash by pledging to draft legislation as early as Thursday.


"I am concerned these issues could be symptomatic of a larger trend driven by economic pressures," Mr. Costello said. He added that Congress must ensure that smaller, regional airlines and major carriers are adhering to the same safety standards.


Rep. Peter A. DeFazio (D., Ore.) said the Federal Aviation Administration has set a "low bar" for minimum safety standards.


"We've got to stop the race to the bottom," Mr. DeFazio said. "It's time for action...We need to set a much, much higher minimum bar."

The hearing was the second this week in Congress to examine safety issues raised by the Feb. 12 crash near Buffalo, N.Y., of a flight operated by commuter carrier Colgan Air Inc., a unit of Pinnacle Airlines Corp. Flying under contract to serve Continental Airlines Inc., the Bombardier Q400 turboprop smashed into a house approaching the airport.


On Wednesday, FAA chief Randy Babbitt told a Senate panel that tighter government regulations and tougher industry self-policing are needed to improve commuter airline safety. Mr. Babbitt laid out a series of initiatives to ensure a single level of safety between major airlines and their commuter partners. Such carriers typically fly smaller planes serving smaller markets, or they shuttle passengers to and from major hub airports around the U.S.
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Old 06-12-2009, 08:32 AM
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Funny what politicians will do to gain attention. Increase the minimum to what? 1000? An ATP? Both had an ATP. Can't write a law that forces people to pay attention and not crash a perfectly good aircraft.
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Old 06-12-2009, 08:46 AM
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A pilot minimum wage would be a good place to start. Something like $35k/year for a part 121 pax pilot. In addition to that require 1,000TT or an ATP as a bar of entry for airline pilots... something along those lines. In my opinion the pay is the most alarming thing and needs to be addressed. Foreign carriers have ab-initio pilots flying Airbii and Boeings with 250TT under the multi crew license and frozen ATPL, but at least they are justly compensated for it.... our pay is disgraceful.
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Old 06-12-2009, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by kersplatt View Post
Funny what politicians will do to gain attention. Increase the minimum to what? 1000? An ATP? Both had an ATP. Can't write a law that forces people to pay attention and not crash a perfectly good aircraft.

No, but they can write a law that forces companies to create better working conditions (more rest, less duty hours, etc) and set a standard for compensation (better pay and bennies). They only thing to worry would be the FAA enforcing it.
Btw, I don't think this is about attention. If you look at his title (Rep. Costello), Chairman of the Aviation Subcomittee etc....it is his job to create/promote legislation pertaining to AVIATION.
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Old 06-12-2009, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Diver Driver View Post
A pilot minimum wage would be a good place to start. Something like $35k/year for a part 121 pax pilot. In addition to that require 1,000TT or an ATP as a bar of entry for airline pilots... something along those lines. In my opinion the pay is the most alarming thing and needs to be addressed. Foreign carriers have ab-initio pilots flying Airbii and Boeings with 250TT under the multi crew license and frozen ATPL, but at least they are justly compensated for it.... our pay is disgraceful.
Not going to happen...we already have a minimum wage in this country. How would you justify a special one for pilots? Because we are "better" than lettuce pickers and fast-food technicians?

You can't use public safety as a justification because then you would have to consider bus, taxi, train drivers as well as potentially any other profession which impacts safety. This might extend to those who build and maintain systems which impact public safety...that is a very, very large can of worms and congress knows better than to go there.
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Old 06-12-2009, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by kersplatt View Post
Increase the minimum to what? 1000? An ATP? Both had an ATP. Can't write a law that forces people to pay attention and not crash a perfectly good aircraft.
I feel like I'm beating a dead horse here, but I will say it again. The captain did not have an ATP when he started flying for an airline. Maybe if he had the 1200 extra hours he would have needed for an ATP before he started at Gulfstream, he would have reacted differently once the plane had earned back his attention.

Disclaimer: Other than the fact that he was hired with low time, the above is pure speculation. Simply typing my opinion.

I for one am very happy to see Congress and the media finally paying attention to our profession. We all b**ch and moan on this site and others, complaining that someone should do something. Well here it is. They are doing something. Am I worried about what they may do??? Sure I am. Might it actually make our lives worse??? Sure it might. But it may also cause our pay to go up and rest requirements to increase. It may may it harder to get into the industry which would also make each one of us worth more. Let's see what they decide to do before we mock it.
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Old 06-12-2009, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by rickair7777 View Post
How would you justify a special one for pilots? Because we are "better" than lettuce pickers and fast-food technicians?
Why, yes. That's exactly what I was thinking...

I am aware of the federal minimum wage. It gets complicated when you divide flight pay over duty time. In some instances it is less than minimum wage. With our federally mandated duty restrictions, we should have a federally mandated minimum salary. I don't think too many people would fight that, except management of course. Most taxi, bus and train drivers make a lot more than first or second year FO's anyway.
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Old 06-12-2009, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by kersplatt View Post
Funny what politicians will do to gain attention. Increase the minimum to what? 1000? An ATP? Both had an ATP. Can't write a law that forces people to pay attention and not crash a perfectly good aircraft.
Both had an ATP? From what I read the FO wasn't even close to ATP mins
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Old 06-12-2009, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by evilboy View Post
Btw, I don't think this is about attention. If you look at his title (Rep. Costello), Chairman of the Aviation Subcomittee etc....it is his job to create/promote legislation pertaining to AVIATION.
If it isn't about attention, why does it take a crash with everyone on board dying before they do something? Did they honestly not realize this existed before? Haven't they ever heard the 'discount airline pilot--real men of genius' commercial. Everyone acts shocked about what the investigation revealed but if he is on the Aviation subcomittee, he should not be shocked. There are a lot of underpaid professions and no one cares. Do you have any idea how many hours and little pay a resident doctor makes? No one cares because they see the doctors making big fat money. Pilots are kind of the same way.
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Old 06-12-2009, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by rickair7777 View Post
Not going to happen...we already have a minimum wage in this country. How would you justify a special one for pilots? Because we are "better" than lettuce pickers and fast-food technicians?

You can't use public safety as a justification because then you would have to consider bus, taxi, train drivers as well as potentially any other profession which impacts safety. This might extend to those who build and maintain systems which impact public safety...that is a very, very large can of worms and congress knows better than to go there.
It is easy to justify a special one for pilots. If the minimum wage employee at Party City filling up your helium balloons balls one up and a few burst, it isn't going to kill 50 plus people. You have been so demoralized you think pilots actually don't deserve an improvement. Terrible.
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