I can't remember the EXACT time, but if I remember correctly, before the whole economic downturn the levels of passenger traffic were the same as pre 9/11 levels. The crappy part, people were paying within a few percent of the SAME for fares as the pre 9/11 time frame. Except the labor is now cheaper.

As stated by other posters, the labor costs of those CBA's simply wasn't sustainable, which is a shame. It was said the the management at UAL knew full well after contract 2000 that they'd be having to get concessions from labor as soon as the economy tanked.

9/11, and the poop storm it created was nothing but a perfect opportunity for airline management to extract maximum cost reduction out of labor. And turn the airlines into what they are today. Remember, labor was the highest cost before fuel went up.

So you're kinda right.

Something many people forget. Although pilots (at any airline) are the highest labor cost, they are not the ONLY employees. Also, unlike a regional, they are not the largest employee group. Mechanics, rampers, FA's, ect all had to go through the same crap.

In the late 90's most airline labor had negotiated improved contracts on the heels of the tech boom economy - which later was named the tech bubble burst.

In 2000 the bubble had burst and the economy softened, then came 9/11, and then SARS, and then Desert Storm II (not the video game). All of which caused marked downturns in passenger air travel.

High productions costs (labor, fuel, leases) and no passenger revenue was the recipe for several airlines burning through cash and then declaring bankruptcy. The most notable exception were the cargo carriers, namely UPS and FedEx, who both saw contract improvements during that time frame.

I don't remember anyone having anyone on furlough prior to 9/11. I know the doors were shutting prior to 9/11. CAL was taking guys, and so was AA. Don't know how long AA would have kept on because they were going through the TWA deal.

What others have said regarding the dot come bubble, start of a recession etc is spot on.

I think UAL did cave on that contract. It was a sweet one, but the company had to cave after the summer of love. Couldn't go through it again.

My personal opionion was that 9/11 didn't kill the airlines, it was just the final nail in the coffin for the airlines in the way they ran their business. Too bad, it was a lot of fun. Glad I was there for the end of the party!

True, and was is not rumored that UAL may have over hired and was potentially facing a possible furlough situation just before hiring shut down?

That's kinda what I meant. It was the perfect opportunity to streamline operating cost and make them more efficient. If the term efficient can be used.

It was slowing... Kitty Hawk had furloughed in May, and furloughed a bunch more on 9/03/01,... as usual, freight leads into the downturn, but often leads the recovery

Another tragedy occured outsourced flying.

My hometown Rochester and Buffalo Niagra are prime examples

No brainer. CA's bump back to FO's.

This started before 9/11. Remember the old ValueJet (1995-98) finding pilots to work for 25K and having new hirers pay 10K (training costs) on the first day of ground school?

I think rich kids are attracted to the airline industry... the glamour and all. This was before 9/11 and it was already driving pay down for pilots.

I mean, who has the money for college, flight training, build some flight time and then paid 10K for a job?

Not me.

The US had already entered a recession prior to 9/11.

The world economy was devastated due to the 9/11 attacks and it remains impossible to put a figure on the cost.

For several years now, most airlines worldwide have been undercapitalised. That pretty much says it all.

Al

my theory is that 9-11 was the best thing that ever happened for swa and B6....the mayor airlines retrenched about 20% and that was golden for them to move in and gain market share....of which the mayors never recovered...the little that was recovered was farmed out to the code share partners...that is why today legacy carriers fly less than 20% of the u.s. domestic market