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-   -   DAL to reduce 35 CRJ-200 (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/50032-dal-reduce-35-crj-200-a.html)

atlmsl 04-22-2010 05:34 PM


Originally Posted by Bug Smasher (Post 798968)
Now 18 not 16.

Did something happen that I don't know about? I thought it was 14 including a spare?

stbloc 04-22-2010 08:47 PM


Originally Posted by jayray (Post 800020)
Doesn't American essentially own Eagle? How about Horizon and Alaska?

I have a hard time believing that the extra costs involved in being able to whipsaw labor outweighs the savings of combining 9 companies into one. Delta is an airline, they are in the business of flying airplanes. At what point does Delta just become a shell of a company with no real employees? Although the contract carriers overhead costs are not directly paid by Delta, the money still needs to come from somewhere to pay for the management team, the buldings, the HR people and all other costs. You don't think it would be cheaper to have one management team and one building to pay rent on verses 9? Delta doesn't want to keep the profits from their own flying? I'm sure it is already a nightmare managing all these airlines that they don't own and trying to bring one level of service. Think of the resources Delta needs now to manage all these regional operations that they don't own and collect no profit from and have no flexibility. If airlines are all about cost cutting there has to be some huge costs to cut here. One wholly owned and one contract, that is all it takes to keep labor in line.

Doesn't the $245,000,000 bond give them an incentive to keep Comair, Mesaba and Compass WO. My understanding the need to keep them under the payroll to avoid this payment on demand.

dba74 04-23-2010 10:53 AM


Originally Posted by Captain Tony (Post 799892)
Someone like SkyWest? Don't be surprised if an announcement is made very soon...

I could see this happening.

Lighteningspeed 04-23-2010 01:37 PM


Originally Posted by dba74 (Post 800657)
I could see this happening.

I agree that one or two of the WO might be on the block to be sold if they can be sold at profit but I seriously doubt it will be to SkyWest. I don't think DAL wants SkyWest to get any bigger than it is. SkyWest already does a big share of DAL connection flying out SLC. That would be putting most of your eggs in one basket and DAL has learned its lesson from Comair back in 2000.

If WO is sold it would probably be to a third party investment holding corporation. However, I don't see that happening any time soon in this economy.

slant alpha 04-23-2010 03:23 PM


Originally Posted by skywatch (Post 800127)
Lots and lots of misinformation on how the agreements with the regionals work. Here are the facts.

All of the regionals (WO and contract) work under a cost plus arrangement. They get reimbursed for the costs of operating the flight, plus a set margin, assuming they hit the pre-determined performance targets. Period. As long as regional airline X hits the completion/A14 numbers, regional X makes money. Period.

Here is why it is makes sense to use a contract carrier rather than a wholly owned: Assume you have two carriers, X (WO) and Y (contract). Both hit all the targets. Both are flying under an agreement that Delta will pay them cost plus 10%.

Now assume that Both operate a flight from ATL - MCO and Delta sells $1500 worth of tickets to fly on each flight. Carrier X has higher labor costs, and it costs them $1500 to operate the flight, so Delta pays Carrier X $1500 plus $150 margin or $1650 to operate the flight. Overall, Delta loses $150 to operate that flight. Carrier Y, however, is a "bottom feeder" and Delta only has to pay their costs of $1200 plus $120 margin or a total of $1320 to operate the flight. Now Delta makes $180 to operate the flight.

It is that simple. Either make $180 or lose $120 to operate the flight is a no-brainer. That is why the "keep it in the family" argument does not work.

Very good explanation, but the wholly owned's are actually cheaper than some of our contract carriers at this point, so it could go either way. In any case it was stated they want to dump 50 seaters, not an entire regional..but hell it's all just a pull on a slot machine.

Captain Tony 04-24-2010 12:35 PM


Originally Posted by Lighteningspeed (Post 800750)
That would be putting most of your eggs in one basket and DAL has learned its lesson from Comair back in 2000.

Really? Can a non union airline go on strike?

WAVIT Inbound 04-24-2010 01:24 PM


Originally Posted by Lighteningspeed (Post 800750)
I agree that one or two of the WO might be on the block to be sold if they can be sold at profit but I seriously doubt it will be to SkyWest. I don't think DAL wants SkyWest to get any bigger than it is. SkyWest already does a big share of DAL connection flying out SLC. That would be putting most of your eggs in one basket and DAL has learned its lesson from Comair back in 2000.

If WO is sold it would probably be to a third party investment holding corporation. However, I don't see that happening any time soon in this economy.

Thats not what we are hearing here at SkyWest. There is even a certain WO being named an awful lot. Not saying its true Im just saying I am hearing an awful lot about it.

Lighteningspeed 04-24-2010 02:44 PM


Originally Posted by WAVIT Inbound (Post 801221)
Thats not what we are hearing here at SkyWest. There is even a certain WO being named an awful lot. Not saying its true Im just saying I am hearing an awful lot about it.

Hearing an awful lot does not mean anything without confirmation from the top management. Pilots are the last ones to find out, especially FOs.

We've been hearing alot about getting CRJ 7s but that's just another rumor like the one you say you are hearing about.

Lighteningspeed 04-24-2010 02:48 PM


Originally Posted by Captain Tony (Post 801194)
Really? Can a non union airline go on strike?

[edit: removed flamebait / insult] My point is DAL would not want one particular DCI to get bigger than the rest for obvious reasons. Strike is not the only way a DCI can extort DAL. SkyWest is already bigger than XJ, CZ, Comair combined.

I agree with Acl65 that when it is all said and done, there will be few WOs and a couple of DCIs left flying for DAL.

slant alpha 04-24-2010 03:43 PM


Originally Posted by WAVIT Inbound (Post 801221)
Thats not what we are hearing here at SkyWest. There is even a certain WO being named an awful lot. Not saying its true Im just saying I am hearing an awful lot about it.

OMG! OMG! No Way! Who is it!??? :rolleyes:


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