Agreed. I commute on a CRJ-200 frequently on a route which makes perfect sense. I commute GRR-DCA on a Pinnacle or Mesaba CRJ and it is an ideal plane for this thin route. The flight is almost never full but full enough to support the premium ticket prices it likely commands as a way for folks to bypass DTW and take a direct flight.

It's about 1:20-1:35 depending on direction of flight and winds. ERJ or CRJ would be perfect. I do question it's place though when I am launching from PHL-MCI in the dead of winter and looking at 2:45 or even 3:00 on the FMS and every single seat is full. That, folks, is a long flight on a 50-seater. Too long.

I think Boiler did a pretty good job of shooting this one down for me.

Indeed I do. They, along with XJT simply proved that on a fuel burn level, the economics of 50 seat aircraft simply don't work when the price of fuel skyrockets. But neither is a DC-9. I guess it's all perspective, but is an Airbus an RJ?

Funny you mention this, but the previous aircraft I flew did no sh1t have the WIDEST seat of anything that DAL had to offer for coach. Ain't that funny? Wider than the MD, 75/76, etc. That plane was ACTUALLY used the way RJ's were meant to be. Doesn't matter, being wedged between two fat bastards sucks anyway you cut it.

50 seat market:
 

One of the best 50 seaters was the Nihon YS-11, and it wasn't that long ago when Piedmont first purchased them for $1M apiece, and was flying them off of shale runways. It was fast, and quiet inside (not out) and had ample room, we had a bunch at PBA in the 80's. "It cost as much to run a 50 seater as it does a 733"? Guess again, the DOC's on the 733 are double that of the RJ, right down to the landing fee schedule at MAssport. Obviously you don't flight plan your RJ for 5000#/hr burn, plus there are two more salaries in back of the 733, and two higher salaries up front. Not certain about Boeing leases, however Jet Blue 320's will cost you $375,000/mo.

Along with the 75 replacement aircraft!

I'm not convinced the CRJ200 or the larger ones are not immune to the ERJ enroute performance issues.

50 seat economics depend on several things...

- Lower labor cost.
- Value of frequency to the consumers.
- Reasonable fuel costs

In the current environment, labor cost is low, fuel is not too bad, and pax value good frequency.

These are things which could screw up that equation in the future...

- Significant increase in regional labor costs...fat chance, although inceasing longevity due to no growth/movement will make a dent.

- Increasing fuel costs...this could make it more economical to run larger planes with less frequency. Pax will pay for frequency, but only up to a point.

- Congestion...slot limitations would force a shift to larger airframes. This WILL happen eventually, just a question of how long.


For right now, 50 seaters still work, and as long as people have leases to cover they will keep operating them. If the lease is payed off and you can make a little profit, might as well keep operating them too.

Honesty, I'm not either.

However, when I was in class in May I asked B.C this question; How come the WHOLE time we were out on the west coast I never heard a SKW plane decline direct routing, as well as why they could take the RNAV SIDs out of SLC and we couldn't.

His answer, "they're behind the scenes flight ops engineering is different than ours".

Different or better? I just guessed that their PIO is more lenient or its just getting swept under the rug.

I'm not sure. And until the day that I hope never comes that I'm flying a CRJ over mountainous terrain, I won't care.

Point I was making was that even when two different companies are operating the SAME aircraft type, what the plane can actually do in real life and what each of their performance data says they can do are not always the same.

At my former employer, AWAC's CRJ's could go into places that ours couldn't Why, simply because they were using a different (and probably more expensive) vendor.

Thread drift complete.

You left out:

SCOPE CLAUSE

As long as places like CAL continue to hold the line, there will be a market. I know a lot of folks here are salivating at the opportunity to take mainline jobs away, but let's focus on the real factor, Scope!

50 seaters are a lot like a sticky booger, no matter how much you flick you just can't seem to get rid of them