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United capacity to effect regional partners?
Any thoughts on if United's announcement of a 4% capacity cut in winter will affect it's regional partners?
From what I read it seems to be directed at older mainline jets and some 50 seat RJs. I'm new to this stuff but can't imagine they can just walk away suddenly from agreements with regionals. Wouldn't that take time and if they did couldn't the affected regional find flying elsewhere? Certainly hope that won't be the case for everyones sake involved. This industry is indeed a non stop roller coaster. I guess you just get used to it or get off the ride. |
Delta got rid of a bunch of rj's post merge and I would expect the same with the new United.
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They estimate 50% of their cuts will be from the regional, outsourced flying.
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RJ50's have the highest CASM in the industry, getting worse by the day with $100+ oil. Time for the regionals to bear some of the pain.
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Originally Posted by Keyscrab
(Post 960646)
Any thoughts on if United's announcement of a 4% capacity cut in winter will affect it's regional partners?
From what I read it seems to be directed at older mainline jets and some 50 seat RJs. I'm new to this stuff but can't imagine they can just walk away suddenly from agreements with regionals. Wouldn't that take time and if they did couldn't the affected regional find flying elsewhere? Certainly hope that won't be the case for everyones sake involved. This industry is indeed a non stop roller coaster. I guess you just get used to it or get off the ride. 1437 MAINLINE pilots furloughed at United are not upset about PARKING RJ's...trust me on that one. |
Originally Posted by contrail67
(Post 960692)
1437 MAINLINE pilots furloughed at United are not upset about PARKING RJ's...trust me on that one.
So...now that we've gotten this out of our system... Does anyone have any inside info on real who/what/when cuts? |
Originally Posted by wanttofly
(Post 960701)
Neato!
So...now that we've gotten this out of our system... Does anyone have any inside info on real who/what/when cuts? They have indicated they will make capacity adjustments which will include elimination of unprofitable routes and reduction of same day frequencies as needed. Announcements of those specific reductions/changes will be communicated further down the road. So no official specifics as of yet as they analyze their plan going forward. A few points from the employee bulletin: The capacity reductions will come from reducing flight frequencies, indefinitely postponing the start of certain markets and exiting less profitable routes, primarily in our domestic schedule. The modest increase in international capacity allocates our aircraft on more profitable routes. In addition, we are analyzing exiting certain less fuel-efficient aircraft from our fleet and will be taking other cost-saving measures. Doesn’t it make sense to reduce more regional flying? About half of our domestic capacity reduction will come from regional flying, much of it through a reduction in daily frequencies or day-of-week flying and, in some cases, exiting routes. As the world’s leading airline, we want to continue service to the communities in our network, which also enables us to feed customers into our hub locations for access to our destinations around the world. What routes will be impacted? We will share this information as we make the schedule changes. How will I know how my hub or fleet is going to be affected? As we finalize schedule changes, we will share the information with co-workers, customers, community and government leaders and others. We realize that any changes can affect the lives of our co-workers, and we will share the information as soon as possible. |
Originally Posted by Ottopilot
(Post 960678)
They estimate 50% of their cuts will be from the regional, outsourced flying.
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CHQ was just recently cut down to 8 erj's, the q400 is being used to reduce frequency with the regional jets, some of the Commutair short hop flying out of ewr will most likely get cut and redistributed, and Skw and XJT/ASA will be reduced by a percentage or two. I think a lot of this was all ready in motion prior to this announcement. XJT has been affected by these seasonal pull downs before. They keep the same number of aircraft around but they just utilize them a lot less.
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Originally Posted by PurdueFlyer
(Post 960712)
Is there a source for that? I definitely believe it. :)
read the above posts...it is from the United employee web site. |
Originally Posted by Keyscrab
(Post 960646)
Any thoughts on if United's announcement of a 4% capacity cut in winter will affect it's regional partners?
From what I read it seems to be directed at older mainline jets and some 50 seat RJs. I'm new to this stuff but can't imagine they can just walk away suddenly from agreements with regionals. Wouldn't that take time and if they did couldn't the affected regional find flying elsewhere? Certainly hope that won't be the case for everyones sake involved. This industry is indeed a non stop roller coaster. I guess you just get used to it or get off the ride. One doesn't get used to it..in fact it gets harder as you get older.I've been doing this for a living 35years plus..over 30 with airlines. Each wrecked roller coaster makes one wonder, but this is what I do and the life I chose. For some it's not worth it. For some of us it is. As the commercial says.."enjoy the ride". (and may yours be a smoother one) |
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 960735)
CHQ was just recently cut down to 8 erj's, the q400 is being used to reduce frequency with the regional jets, some of the Commutair short hop flying out of ewr will most likely get cut and redistributed, and Skw and XJT/ASA will be reduced by a percentage or two. I think a lot of this was all ready in motion prior to this announcement. XJT has been affected by these seasonal pull downs before. They keep the same number of aircraft around but they just utilize them a lot less.
Since the anounced cuts are presumably fuel price driven, I suspect you will see an increase in CommutAir flying out of EWR, not less. Just my opinion, (no inside knowlege). We will know for sure shortly. |
Originally Posted by Ottopilot
(Post 960678)
They estimate 50% of their cuts will be from the regional, outsourced flying.
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Maybe GoJet will get cut
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Originally Posted by MaxQ
(Post 960766)
Newark,
Since the anounced cuts are presumably fuel price driven, I suspect you will see an increase in CommutAir flying out of EWR, not less. Just my opinion, (no inside knowlege). We will know for sure shortly. ewr-phl and similar shorter routes dont make sense when fuel is high and the passenger has other cheaper options. If they are going to jack up fares then passengers will drive 2 hrs for a cheaper fare. People will drive, train, or shuttle to the airport. Using those aircraft to do slightly longer flights BDL, PVD, DCA might be a better option for CAL but i think commutair will be reduced out of ewr and sent to ORD, DEN, or IAH. XJT/ASA is being redistributed all throughout the new United system and now the other regional partners are going to start spreading out too. They are going to try to utilize the right aircraft for the route and that means any base is fair game. |
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 960735)
CHQ was just recently cut down to 8 erj's,
we know they are going to be out in two years.. but it's not down to 8 yet. |
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 961121)
ewr-phl and similar shorter routes dont make sense when fuel is high and the passenger has other cheaper options.
Small segment flying is mainly sold to pax that connect at the hub, not people dumb enough to fly phl-ewr |
Originally Posted by jayray2
(Post 960773)
Sure they estimate 50% will come from Regionals. Now you guys will abandon your scope fight . . . Their propaganda is working if you believe it. Just keep fighting the good fight at the negotiating table instead of believing scope is going to magically reappear. Take it back in negotiations and then you will know for sure the flying is moving back in the right direction.
How is a 50/50 reduction from regional AND mainline really a change from the status quo then that would cause us to relax on scope? It's not like they said we are reducing 90% regional and 10% mainline here. Even then we wouldn't take our eyes off of scope as an issue. |
Originally Posted by seattlepilot
(Post 961424)
Wrong.. there are 13 chq airplanes working on the continental side of the house.
we know they are going to be out in two years.. but it's not down to 8 yet. 1Q11 15 chq erj 2Q11 9 chq erj 3Q11 8 chq erj |
Originally Posted by seattlepilot
(Post 961426)
When you sell NRT-PHL at premium with a connection in EWR does make money. Telling to the pax that came off of a 10+ hr Pacific flight to take the train will drive the customer to a different airline. I hope you realize that..
Small segment flying is mainly sold to pax that connect at the hub, not people dumb enough to fly phl-ewr |
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 961543)
for the hundreds of dollars per ticket they would charge for that ewr-phl flight...
You have clearly never taken a close look at airline ticket pricing... I have a feeling they'd sell this much in the way that AUS-DFW-EWR is cheaper than DFW-EWR. |
I expect the CAL 735 being parked and replaced by the a UAL 320. Any reduction of flying on the CAL sisde will leave then with excess pilots. While the A320 increase will require recall pilots. You are still on two seperate certificates and two seniority list.
You keep on looking at the RJ folks as your demon, management loves that. |
Originally Posted by buddies8
(Post 961874)
I expect the CAL 735 being parked and replaced by the a UAL 320. Any reduction of flying on the CAL sisde will leave then with excess pilots. While the A320 increase will require recall pilots. You are still on two seperate certificates and two seniority list.
You keep on looking at the RJ folks as your demon, management loves that. This really isn't a big reduction. I think a bunch of 50 seat routes will be chopped and then maybe a couple 737s or 757-200s at worst. Most can be absorbed by decreasing aircraft utilization. This is a pretty minor adjustment as compared to purposely parking 100 UAL 737s for the merger, ahem, I mean due to fuel prices :p |
Originally Posted by kc135driver
(Post 961885)
RJs (not the people) ARE the demons. Look how many routes have been converted from UAL 737s to RJs over the past 10 years and now (and hopefully finally). UAL used to have 10000+ pilots, now barely 7000. Where did those 3000 jobs go????
This really isn't a big reduction. I think a bunch of 50 seat routes will be chopped and then maybe a couple 737s or 757-200s at worst. Most can be absorbed by decreasing aircraft utilization. This is a pretty minor adjustment as compared to purposely parking 100 UAL 737s for the merger, ahem, I mean due to fuel prices :p |
Originally Posted by Copperhed51
(Post 961905)
I don't blame the airplane. I blame the folks who originally gave up scope because they didn't want to fly the little airplanes. Once you give up scope, good luck getting it back. I know people are working toward that goal but it's clearly very very difficult to achieve.
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